GoldenEagle Posted July 10, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted July 10, 2013 Many people these days who says rich people and money are evil these days are just envious of the rich people's wealth, hence the socialist and wealth redistribution movement. This is probably true to a certain extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted July 10, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,993 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,691 Content Per Day: 11.76 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted July 10, 2013 Many people these days who says rich people and money are evil these days are just envious of the rich people's wealth, hence the socialist and wealth redistribution movement. This is probably true to a certain extent. The 10th Commandment. 10) “You shall not covet your neighbor's house. You shall not covet your neighbor's wife, or his manservant or maidservant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.” This is a command against desiring anything that is not one’s own. Coveting can lead to breaking one of the commandments listed above: murder, adultery, and theft. If it is wrong to do something, it is wrong to desire to do that same something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udx Posted July 10, 2013 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 684 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 230 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/15/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted July 10, 2013 So what is your point Enoob? You cannot immerse yourself within a system that has been in design since the fall of man, a system, that was given over to satan for his use ... and think it benign! Eph 2:1-3 2 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, 2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, NKJV Notice the course of this world -clearly a different course than the one we are now to be walking! The point above is if you spend your energy and focus on that which passes away you cannot be in obedience to The Lord Who says are focus is to be this way Col 3:1-4 3 If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God. 2 Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. 3 For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. 4 When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory. NKJV It really is a no brainer! Love, Steven Well Steve, Money is a tool, an enabler. You can't spent your entire life not knowing how to use it effectively either.Money is just a method of trade and resource distribution. I don't see Christian organizations being successful if they can't use what resources donated to them effectively. All your posts seems to say stay away from money, I believe that is the wrong attitude. Money in the broadest sense of definition is anything you can exchange in what you desire more, in essence it could be any and all things. It doesn't make sense to stay away from everything, you might as well not exist. Yes, we shouldn't be consumed by money, but we ought to be a good steward of resources/tool provided to us to further the kingdom while on Earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted July 10, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,393 Content Per Day: 8.00 Reputation: 21,566 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Well Steve, Money is a tool, an enabler. You can't spent your entire life not knowing how to use it effectively either. Money is just a method of trade and resource distribution. I don't see Christian organizations being successful if they can't use what resources donated to them effectively. All your posts seems to say stay away from money, I believe that is the wrong attitude. Money in the broadest sense of definition is anything you can exchange in what you desire more, in essence it could be any and all things. It doesn't make sense to stay away from everything, you might as well not exist. Yes, we shouldn't be consumed by money, but we ought to be a good steward of resources/tool provided to us to further the kingdom while on Earth. Matt 6:24 24 "No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon. NKJV I have been in both worlds both riches and poverty I know subtlety of the riches how the more you have the more you immerse yourself in their care the more time you spend in that immersion of things that pass away! So the Christian presents it as stewardship and they cross OT borders to justify the gain of riches... BUT they are not true riches by keeping them are they Matt 19:21 21 Jesus said to him, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." NKJV Luke 12:33-34 33 Sell what you have and give alms; provide yourselves money bags which do not grow old, a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches nor moth destroys. 34 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. NKJV 1 Peter 4:2-3b 2 that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh for the lusts of men, but for the will of God. 3 For we have spent enough of our past lifetime in doing the will of the Gentiles NKJV what is the will of gentiles? Matt 6:31-34 31 "Therefore do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' 32 For after all these things the Gentiles seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble. NKJV If we would have adhered to the order in which this teaches maybe The Lord would never have had to say this Luke 18:8b Nevertheless, when the Son of Man comes, will He really find faith on the earth?" NKJV Love, Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udx Posted July 10, 2013 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 684 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 230 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/15/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted July 10, 2013 Well Steve, Money is a tool, an enabler. You can't spent your entire life not knowing how to use it effectively either. Money is just a method of trade and resource distribution. I don't see Christian organizations being successful if they can't use what resources donated to them effectively. All your posts seems to say stay away from money, I believe that is the wrong attitude. Money in the broadest sense of definition is anything you can exchange in what you desire more, in essence it could be any and all things. It doesn't make sense to stay away from everything, you might as well not exist. Yes, we shouldn't be consumed by money, but we ought to be a good steward of resources/tool provided to us to further the kingdom while on Earth. Matt 6:24 24 "No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon. NKJV I have been in both worlds both riches and poverty I know subtlety of the riches how the more you have the more you immerse yourself in their care the more time you spend in that immersion of things that pass away! So the Christian presents it as stewardship and they cross OT borders to justify the gain of riches... BUT they are not true riches by keeping them are they Matt 19:21 21 Jesus said to him, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." NKJV Luke 12:33-34 33 Sell what you have and give alms; provide yourselves money bags which do not grow old, a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches nor moth destroys. 34 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. NKJV 1 Peter 4:2-3b 2 that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh for the lusts of men, but for the will of God. 3 For we have spent enough of our past lifetime in doing the will of the Gentiles NKJV what is the will of gentiles? Matt 6:31-34 31 "Therefore do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' 32 For after all these things the Gentiles seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble. NKJV If we would have adhered to the order in which this teaches maybe The Lord would never have had to say this Luke 18:8b Nevertheless, when the Son of Man comes, will He really find faith on the earth?" NKJV Love, Steven Doesn't look like you are doing what you are preaching. If you have given all your riches away, how do you still have a computer...why haven't you given your riches away then? By the standard of poverty of the most poor in the world, everyone in the US are extremely rich. Lets have a thought experiment. If all the rich Christians (anybody that has anything) has given everything they have away. Who is left to bring food and shelter to the poor? Instead of one time offering, isn't it better to manage the wealth you got so you can continuously give and increase in giving as it grows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted July 11, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,393 Content Per Day: 8.00 Reputation: 21,566 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Doesn't look like you are doing what you are preaching. If you have given all your riches away, how do you still have a computer...why haven't you given your riches away then? By the standard of poverty of the most poor in the world, everyone in the US are extremely rich. God clearly warns us there is deceitfulness in riches! Matt 13:22 22 Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful. NKJV God also clearly warns us 1 Cor 10:12-13 12 Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed lest he fall. NKJV Lets have a thought experiment. If all the rich Christians (anybody that has anything) has given everything they have away. Who is left to bring food and shelter to the poor? The poor cannot be eradicated! Because every jot and tittle will be fulfilled in His Word Mark 14:7 7 For you have the poor with you always, and whenever you wish you may do them good; but Me you do not have always. NKJV Instead of one time offering, isn't it better to manage the wealth you got so you can continuously give and increase in giving as it grows? Except it seems to me you are presuming upon God granting you tomorrow... Luke 12:18-21 18 So he said, 'I will do this: I will pull down my barns and build greater, and there I will store all my crops and my goods. 19 And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years; take your ease; eat, drink, and be merry."' 20 But God said to him, 'Fool! This night your soul will be required of you; then whose will those things be which you have provided?' 21 "So is he who lays up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God." NKJV Matt 6:19-21 19 "Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; 20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. NKJV 1 Cor 7:29-31 29 But this I say, brethren, the time is short, so that from now on even those who have wives should be as though they had none, 30 those who weep as though they did not weep, those who rejoice as though they did not rejoice, those who buy as though they did not possess, 31 and those who use this world as not misusing it. For the form of this world is passing away. NKJV Everything I have I use for God and others... don't get me wrong I am every bit a sinner as the next I just burn inn my heart to be nearer to Him! Don't worry people here think I'm nuts too I love to give from my need because until you do you cannot know those depths and riches! Mark 12:43-44 43 So He called His disciples to Himself and said to them, "Assuredly, I say to you that this poor widow has put in more than all those who have given to the treasury; 44 for they all put in out of their abundance, but she out of her poverty put in all that she had, her whole livelihood." NKJV I am fully persuaded that true riches are the spiritual substances of relationship with His Word through Spirit and that outworking to others! So much so that I am willing to deny myself and draw near to Him... Comes with a promise you know James 4:7-10 7 Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. 8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9 Lament and mourn and weep! Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom. 10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and He will lift you up. NKJV Remember we do not answer to God collectively but individually and right now can you tell when you are going to die? So most all live in complete disregard to this Word Matt 6:34 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble. NKJV I don't think it would be a bad thing to be at the point of starvation and care more about His Word than bread... do you? Love, Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted July 11, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 55 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Share Posted July 11, 2013 Doesn't look like you are doing what you are preaching. If you have given all your riches away, how do you still have a computer...why haven't you given your riches away then? By the standard of poverty of the most poor in the world, everyone in the US are extremely rich. God clearly warns us there is deceitfulness in riches! Matt 13:22 22 Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful. NKJV God also clearly warns us 1 Cor 10:12-13 12 Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed lest he fall. NKJV Lets have a thought experiment. If all the rich Christians (anybody that has anything) has given everything they have away. Who is left to bring food and shelter to the poor? The poor cannot be eradicated! Because every jot and tittle will be fulfilled in His Word Mark 14:7 7 For you have the poor with you always, and whenever you wish you may do them good; but Me you do not have always. NKJV Instead of one time offering, isn't it better to manage the wealth you got so you can continuously give and increase in giving as it grows? Except it seems to me you are presuming upon God granting you tomorrow... Luke 12:18-21 18 So he said, 'I will do this: I will pull down my barns and build greater, and there I will store all my crops and my goods. 19 And I will say to my soul, "Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years; take your ease; eat, drink, and be merry."' 20 But God said to him, 'Fool! This night your soul will be required of you; then whose will those things be which you have provided?' 21 "So is he who lays up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God." NKJV Matt 6:19-21 19 "Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; 20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. NKJV 1 Cor 7:29-31 29 But this I say, brethren, the time is short, so that from now on even those who have wives should be as though they had none, 30 those who weep as though they did not weep, those who rejoice as though they did not rejoice, those who buy as though they did not possess, 31 and those who use this world as not misusing it. For the form of this world is passing away. NKJV Everything I have I use for God and others... don't get me wrong I am every bit a sinner as the next I just burn inn my heart to be nearer to Him! Don't worry people here think I'm nuts too I love to give from my need because until you do you cannot know those depths and riches! Mark 12:43-44 43 So He called His disciples to Himself and said to them, "Assuredly, I say to you that this poor widow has put in more than all those who have given to the treasury; 44 for they all put in out of their abundance, but she out of her poverty put in all that she had, her whole livelihood." NKJV I am fully persuaded that true riches are the spiritual substances of relationship with His Word through Spirit and that outworking to others! So much so that I am willing to deny myself and draw near to Him... Comes with a promise you know James 4:7-10 7 Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. 8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9 Lament and mourn and weep! Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom. 10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and He will lift you up. NKJV Remember we do not answer to God collectively but individually and right now can you tell when you are going to die? So most all live in complete disregard to this Word Matt 6:34 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble. NKJV I don't think it would be a bad thing to be at the point of starvation and care more about His Word than bread... do you? Love, Steven Very good post for all of us to read! Thank you Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted July 25, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.98 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Does money control what you choose to do or does God's leading? If money ceased to have any value in the eyes of people, would you still go do what you do for a living tomorrow without it's incentive? Do you value people based upon what they have to offer you? Why is a doctor worth $200,000 a year but the one who cleans the toilets $9 an hour when each one is only doing that which they are suited to do through the abilities given them by God? If money is so important to God then why did the book of Acts declare twice that those who believed had all things common and none of them declared that that which he possessed was his own? As fallen human beings we have the capacity to rationalize, justify and minimize based upon our own understanding but the truth is that there is a distinct reason why this is a temporal state wherein it is appointed man once to die and then the judgment. Selfishness and self-centeredness are simply the acts of playing God due to being made in the image of God and having the eyes of our understanding opened which is exasperated by a fallen angel who desires to be God. Self-sacrifice is the true mark of Christ in the believer. We live in a society that places value on stuff. They worship and serve the creation more than the Creator. They love things and use people as it is the way of the world. They justify themselves but will not be justified by God in the day of judgment. We as Christians must be in this world but are not to be of this world. Knowing the truth has helped us to escape the corruption that is in the world through human desire to possess, being earthly minded. We have been given the power to overcome evil desires to be self sufficient through trusting in uncertain riches and instead place our faith in God to provide for us while we are self-sacrificial. Money is just an object no matter what form it comes in, paper, gold, etc. The love inside the heart of man who is glad that money can be used to control that which refuses to be controlled by God is the evil. When I would to do good evil is present with me. I either deny God or that evil. The choice is mine. God help us through Christ to choose Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted July 26, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,393 Content Per Day: 8.00 Reputation: 21,566 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted July 26, 2013 Does money control what you choose to do or does God's leading? If money ceased to have any value in the eyes of people, would you still go do what you do for a living tomorrow without it's incentive? Do you value people based upon what they have to offer you? Why is a doctor worth $200,000 a year but the one who cleans the toilets $9 an hour when each one is only doing that which they are suited to do through the abilities given them by God? If money is so important to God then why did the book of Acts declare twice that those who believed had all things common and none of them declared that that which he possessed was his own? As fallen human beings we have the capacity to rationalize, justify and minimize based upon our own understanding but the truth is that there is a distinct reason why this is a temporal state wherein it is appointed man once to die and then the judgment. Selfishness and self-centeredness are simply the acts of playing God due to being made in the image of God and having the eyes of our understanding opened which is exasperated by a fallen angel who desires to be God. Self-sacrifice is the true mark of Christ in the believer. We live in a society that places value on stuff. They worship and serve the creation more than the Creator. They love things and use people as it is the way of the world. They justify themselves but will not be justified by God in the day of judgment. We as Christians must be in this world but are not to be of this world. Knowing the truth has helped us to escape the corruption that is in the world through human desire to possess, being earthly minded. We have been given the power to overcome evil desires to be self sufficient through trusting in uncertain riches and instead place our faith in God to provide for us while we are self-sacrificial. Money is just an object no matter what form it comes in, paper, gold, etc. The love inside the heart of man who is glad that money can be used to control that which refuses to be controlled by God is the evil. When I would to do good evil is present with me. I either deny God or that evil. The choice is mine. God help us through Christ to choose Him. This is the sense I also get from God's Word Gary! When God said there is deceitfulness in riches ... what you have written is the light upon how deceitful! Love, Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FresnoJoe Posted September 27, 2015 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 207 Topic Count: 60 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,651 Content Per Day: 1.17 Reputation: 5,761 Days Won: 4 Joined: 01/31/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/04/1943 Share Posted September 27, 2015 Is the origin of money of God or of this world? So I'll ask again.... Please take a position and present Scripture to support your position.... Love Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever. 1 John 2:15-17 Is Where Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also. Matthew 6:19-21 The Heart Dwells Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.This is the first and great commandment. Matthew 22:37-38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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