firestormx Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,113 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 442 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/06/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/17/1975 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 Clearly the first church was not perfect. I agree with what you said, but I meant to use the first church only as an example, that collectively they recieved the truth from Christ, it wasn't about there personal understanding. I guess what I'm trying to figure out is....When does it stop being that we are standing on his word, and become that we are standing on our own understanding. I hope that is more clear, if it is not I will try to use some examples next time to better explain my point. By the way, thank you for your concern and taking the time to post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 9, 2012 I think I understand u better now !?! OK, this is my 'aha' moment regarding yr op: As the early or first Christians had no Bible, they were depending on 'fresh' words or understanding concerning their faith and their risen Lord so, as they were all 'hearing' the same thing, their understanding was closer together than ours is in this day and age We, on the other hand, have the Bible and are often in disagreement about how to 'interpret' it with the result that it sometimes becomes a free for all and all the love goes out the window Am I somewhat on the same page with you now? The word of God states very clearly and very bluntly that we are NOT to lean to our own understanding, Proverbs 3:5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firestormx Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,113 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 442 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/06/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/17/1975 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 I think I understand u better now !?! OK, this is my 'aha' moment regarding yr op: As the early or first Christians had no Bible, they were depending on 'fresh' words or understanding concerning their faith and their risen Lord so, as they were all 'hearing' the same thing, their understanding was closer together than ours is in this day and age We, on the other hand, have the Bible and are often in disagreement about how to 'interpret' it with the result that it sometimes becomes a free for all and all the love goes out the window Am I somewhat on the same page with you now? The word of God states very clearly and very bluntly that we are NOT to lean to our own understanding, Proverbs 3:5. Yes, that's it They relied on the Holy Spirit and Christ, they were in one accord ( pretty much anyways), we ( the church today ) one the other hand disagree about everything from salvation to the return of Christ. When is it leaning on him and his word, and his truth vs leaning on our understanding of him and his truth and his word? To put it another way, what is the difference between standing on the word and standing on our understanding of the word? the scripture makes plain not lean on our understanding. Maybe I'm looking at it to hard, and I can't see the forest for the trees, lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.23 Reputation: 9,762 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted October 9, 2012 I don't think you are looking at it too hard. I see your question as actually digging deeper into what the word says. On the surface, the words tell us to follow scripture instead of our natural instinct in matters, which are at odds many times. Looking at this a little deeper, it is also telling me not to use scripture to back what I want it to say, but instead, allow scripture to change my beliefs to be on accordance to what it is really saying. Scripture is alive! I can read the same passages over and over and find new ways to apply the meaning to my life. I am trusting the Holy Spirit to teach me each time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firestormx Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,113 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 442 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/06/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/17/1975 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 I don't think you are looking at it too hard. I see your question as actually digging deeper into what the word says. On the surface, the words tell us to follow scripture instead of our natural instinct in matters, which are at odds many times. Looking at this a little deeper, it is also telling me not to use scripture to back what I want it to say, but instead, allow scripture to change my beliefs to be on accordance to what it is really saying. Scripture is alive! I can read the same passages over and over and find new ways to apply the meaning to my life. I am trusting the Holy Spirit to teach me each time. Thank you for your response. I keep having the thought, the early church ( the first church ) leaned on the Living Word, where as we lean on the written word. There understanding came from the Living Word, our understanding comes from our interupitation of the written word. Big difference I think, and maybe somewhere in that is the answer I'm looking for????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 9, 2012 Yes, that's it OK well that was exhausting! just kidding I agree with something OneLight has touched on in his post above.. .I see your question as actually digging deeper into what the word says. A verse from Psalm 119 popped into my mind while I was off doing something else: I have hidden your word in my heart that I might not sin against you. (v.11)although for some strange reason I tend to remember verses in the KJV...Thy word have I hid in mine heart that I might not sin sin against thee... That is one of the best Psalms to find all the Bible can relay to us and how that Word keeps us from both sin and misunderstanding And I agree again with OL in that we allow scripture to direct/change our minds (thoughts) I think a major problem with some of todays interpretations is looking for scripture to back up what you already think. One of the worst offenders of this type of interpretation is what I call the 'lone ranger' who 'hears' from God and then looks up passages to try and support what they supposedly heard. That, is not prophecy and not how the Holy Spirit operates 1. This is how the Holy Spirit operates according to scripture: But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. John 14:26 In other words, He does not speak from Himself (neither did Jesus) but only in accord with what has already been stated. Do you see that? Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will. Romans 12:2 Scripture renews our minds and tears down strongholds that have been formed through living in this world and partaking of its systems and rebellion against God The caveat there, is that scripture must interpret itself...we are not free to insert our own interpretation Remember that while the new Christians did not have the NT, they did have the OT and what Jesus lived was the fulfillment of OT prophecy. In other words, God's Word not only shows us HOW to interpret that very same Word, it also engages our minds and proves to our minds that it is true so that we come to depend more and more on that Truth which was delivered once and for all Beloved, while I was making every effort to write you about our common salvation, I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints. And this is just scratching the surface Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firestormx Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,113 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 442 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/06/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/17/1975 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 You and OL having giving me much to pray and seek the Lord about, thank you May God bless you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 9, 2012 I keep having the thought, the early church ( the first church ) leaned on the Living Word, where as we lean on the written word. There understanding came from the Living Word, our understanding comes from our interupitation of the written word. Big difference I think, and maybe somewhere in that is the answer I'm looking for????? Well now, what does the Bible say about this fire? For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. The Bible declares itself to be ALIVE...so you might start with what that means in order to line up YOUR thoughts with what is actually WRITTEN It's not just words to understand...the Holy Spirit's job is to make it come ALIVE to us Jesus left the earth. So, the Living Word was no longer there physically...enter the Holy Spirit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firestormx Posted October 9, 2012 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,113 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 442 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/06/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/17/1975 Author Share Posted October 9, 2012 thank you for your post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 There's something wrong if our prayers don't ever accomplish anything right? Not necessarily. God sees time differently than we do, and it might simply be that its not time on His schedule for what you are praying for to happen yet. I know people who have prayed for things like the salvation of a loved one, or change in life situation that didn't happen until years later -- but they kept praying nonetheless. i stand by my guns... if you NEVER see a result from your prayers something's wrong. Okay. I wasn't attacking you, so there's no need for guns. May I ask your definition of "never?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts