Hippie333 Posted February 13, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,236 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 673 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/24/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/18/1970 Share Posted February 13, 2013 I never attacked your character, I only used your statements, scripture speaks on its own..nothing to debate about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted February 13, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.99 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 sevenseas, on 13 February 2013 - 11:27 AM, said: Do you have scripture to show that God leads into deception? 2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: This is clear to me that God is the one who sends the delusion. The only aspect of this verse we are seeking to understand is that he is the one who sent the delusion. Nothing else matters. We cannot get away from the fact that God sent a delusion that they might believe a lie. My point is that if I am deceived it is because I believe God is someone that he is not. You see, I am obeying him as I understand him to be. If I have been deceived into following lies about who God is and what it means to obey him, then I fit the category here of one who has not received a love of the truth. Where this takes us is into many other doctrines. Some people twist the word of God to make homosexuality OK with God. These have not received a love of the truth. Many, many other examples can be shown, much of which will be very controversial, even as these very statements of mine are controversial in nature because they call into question all the debate that goes on here at worthy over various doctrines. It is certain that there are those here that have not received a love of the truth and for that cause have received a delusion from God. I cannot say that I can be 100% convinced that I am not being deceived due to various factors. All I can do is speak as I understand that which is true and place my faith in God that I am being shown truth. What is the just cause? This is not talking about those who are saved Back up a bit: The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie 12and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness. Read it with Romans 1 in mind...is that you? If so, you are not saved You cannot make a doctrine out of one verse and God does not deliberately full those who are His...you cannot operate on that principal A person (Christian) can certainly be deceived, but the verse you supply would not be the support for that to occur...it is similar to God tempting...does God tempt? Does God entice people to sin? Thanks for your well thought out reply. If you are correct and the verse applies unto the unsaved only then I would have to agree with your assessment. I am going to have to take some time to consider this on a deeper level. One that takes into account how God interacted with his people all through out history. I once read the text as you have until I realized that there were a great many texts in scripture that have been said to apply only to the unsaved that I have since come to understand, do not apply only to the unsaved. Thanks for the food for thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted February 13, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted February 13, 2013 Look, I am not really a once saved always saved type of believer...there are just too many warnings in the NT to ignore if we think we can do as we please as long as we do lip service and answer an altar call or even have ourselves immersed. BUT, there is a very specific type of condition in which God sends delusion and that is continued sin despite warning after warning. That's why I said read Romans. What is the reason for the delusion in II Thess? THEY DID NOT LOVE THE TRUTH SO AS TO BE SAVED...Romans 1...God gives people over to a reprobate mind as they descend further and further into sin What kind of God would we have if He set out to destroy someone who did not realize they were in deception and so sent them further into deception? Does not work that way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted February 13, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.81 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted February 13, 2013 Time to take a break. This thread is closed for review. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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