Going to church every Sunday

[kwikphilly]

Blessings to Everyone,

     Far be it from me to disrespect anyones decision  not go to church on Sunday but I think it is very disrespectful of the people that choose not to go to caterorgize all churches as teaching traditions of men & the purpose of tithing for the Pastors self-gain & so on.......How would the rent get paid,the electiric stay on & the Pastor feed his family if no one faithfully contributed?My Pastor does not wear the tithes  & offerings on his back with fancy suits nor does he drive them or go on vacation with them....& he never preaches that tithing is mandatory but that it is not a debt we owe ,it is a seed we sow.-he teaches us that none should lack because we have one another...when my father died(he lived 1200 miles away from me),I had not the means to get to the funeral & I was supported by my church......

     It is a sad thing when people have been hurt or deceived in some way by a church,pastor or members of the congregation but I hear alot of "me" & "I" in much of this discussion....I  cannot do it better than my pastor,I am not called to pastor a church or to teach and there is much to gain sitting in the pew,much to learn & much spiritual growth......I think there is a bit of a problem when people do not have a teachable spirit..........I attend a Pentecostal church & though I do not agree with some of the traditions they no way interfere with the wonderful fellowship,Rhema Word received on Sunday,the move of the Holy Spirit & the opportunity to praise& worship God in a beautiful,uplifting atmosphere(Glory to God)....

      Well,there are really good churches out there and nobody has to go if they choose not to and they need not try to justify their decision by finding fault in everything about church.......take what you need & leave the rest when attending or simply don't go

                                                                                                                  With love,in Christ-Kwik

[Guest]

Well, I might be that some have said, of MY my blogs give more theology in 14 minutes than the church has done in 1501 years. Now, while I doubt that actually happens in my case, anyone who would say such things about my writings would be indicating their own ignorance, since nothing I write is that good, and there is a lot of awesome teaching from most pulpits of the last 15 centuries Let me get back to somethings I though I saw asked about early in the thread.

 

It was, I think, about 6 months after I was aware of my salvation before I became a church member. In the 35 years since then, I have regularly attended  4 differant chuches, been a member of two, visted probably another half dozen, and I would say all were good, strong, bible believing churches, not bound up in money etc. and encouraging people to live lives as true believers should. 

 

I would not say any were perfect, but one was pretty close. I have no bad church experiences, and believe me I am not the joining and following type. I am quite critical and vocal actually.

 

However, for the most part, I do not attend church for what it can do for me, I go to serve as I can, both the entity that is the organization, but mostly the people of the body of Christ whether or not they are formally associated with the organization or not.

 

Broken churches, are not to be scorned, they are places that need your help. Some have theological issues, and I find pastors are usually humble, always good natured and generally receptive to correction. 

 

I read people frequently on Worthy complaining about how hard it is to find a good church. I have found it odd that I find them so easy to find out here is liberal and rebellious, pagan Southern California, what explains this, or am I just too easily pleased?

[kwikphilly]

Blessings Mega!!!!

     Well said,my Brother.....I agree,just this Sunday (I didn't get the memo-lol)& I pulled up at my church for the 8:30am service & a couple of church members were standing outside & told me we were having 1 service only at 10am....I drove around the block(there are a few churches in the immediate area)& saw a parking lot full of cars at one of the churches so I parked & went inside....it was a beautiful service,a great message given and I felt all refreshed & fueled up with the Word of God!It's not the first time I just walked in an unfamiliar church & most everytime I feel right at home with the Body of Christ....

     I guess I am not hard to please either...if Jesus is preached & the Bible is read,what's not to like?

                                                                                                           With love,in Christ-Kwik

[Qnts2]

In the OT, people did not gather for worship on a weekly basis. There was not such thing as a synagogue until the Babylonian exhile. And the Temple was too far away for weekly travel. On the Sabbath, which is a day of rest, people stayed home.

 

There were a few Holy Days when the people were commanded to travel to Jerusalem, but other then those few, there were no commands to gather for worship. In the Temple, there was worship, 7 days a week.

 

In modern Judaism, without the Temple, just about all prayers and holidays can be done at home. (Except for Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur). While synagogues are open and services occur 7 days a week, most are optional because they can be done at home.

 

In the Jewish community, most Jewish people live in Jewish neighborhoods. The practice of the Mosaic law requires the people to live in closer proximity. Community is important.

 

So growing up Jewish, I was surprised at the lack of community in Christianity. The supposed added rule of a requirement of attending Church services which is not in scripture. Services only occuring once a week vs 7 days a week in Judaism.

 

It was about 1.5 years after finding Jesus, when I first went to a church. I do enjoy being with other Christians.

 

As far as churches go, it is difficult to find a good church in my area. There are certain beliefs and practices in my local churches which I find are a big issue. One is replacement theology. Another is manipulation and abuse thru the Shepherding movement now called The New Apostolic Reformation which is in most churches in my area. And finally, a belief that Jewish people already have a covenant and don't need to believe on Jesus at this time (this will occur when Jesus returns according to dual covenant theology).      

[Sandyz]

You should go to church for the right reasons.  If you are going to learn, have fellowship, and contribute to the Body of Christ you are going for the right reasons.  Any other reason why bother, you can to to any social club for that.

[JohnD]

By people who read my blogs, Fez. Theologians some of them.

 

How often, Fez, does your church teach the Trinity doctrine?

 

And do they ever teach from the perspective of what one in the Godhead does that the other two do not?

 

I searched Church doctrines and commentary some as old as the 19th century. Just a lot of this is what it is even though we cannot comprehend it... etc.

 

The Bible says Prove everything. Cling to that which is good. In fact the Bible is the only holy book that says test the Maker, the God, the Spirits, because it is the only truth and has nothing to hide behind the walls of "touch not the anointed" and blind faith.

 

The Bible admonishes us to question everything. 

 

1 Thessalonians 5:21

1 John 4:1

Acts 17:11

[JohnD]

Those who took offense by my charge against the modern Church have in effect made my point about this being an unpopular teaching and difficult at best to get across to people.

 

I just showed Fez how we are to test everything. I pray God in Christ you test everything I say by scripture. Taking my word for it is a fools gambit. The same goes for any man. Which is what I was driving at about the Galatians 1:8-9 text wherein the Apostle included himself and the other apostles not to go even on their say so if it contradicts the Gospel message already taught (meaning the inspired version and now the scripture version is the authority bar none).

 

Psalm 138:2 (NASB95)
2 I will bow down toward Your holy temple And give thanks to Your name for Your lovingkindness and Your truth; For You have magnified Your word according to all Your name.

 

KJV says "above all thy name."

 

¡ Muy importante !

 

Start to take notice how much of the time your pastor teaches directly from the Bible... has the congregation read it... compared to life lessons as a Christian for example.

 

How often do they teach theology and encourage you to study scripture to the point you no longer need his or her teaching that you are tutored by the Holy Spirit as much as he or she is...

 

Do they teach there is no difference between your ministry and theirs?

 

Do they even teach you that you have a ministry and that you are a priest of God?

 

Or is it more of the same old feed 'em a fish and never teach 'em how to fish for themselves?

 

Hebrews 5:12 (NASB95)
12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you have need again for someone to teach you the elementary principles of the oracles of God, and you have come to need milk and not solid food.

 

Revelation 1:6 (NASB95)
6 and He has made us to be a kingdom, priests to His God and Father—to Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen.

 

Does your pastor know or teach how the Father is the God of Jesus?

 

Jehovah's Witnesses exploit this ignorance in the Church to get people to believe the scriptures teach only the Father is God and Jesus is not God.

 

Can you explain this?

 

If not why not?

 

Revelation 5:10 (NASB95)
10 “You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God; and they will reign upon the earth.”

 

Are you a priest reigning on the earth? Or are you merely a lay person because your Church teaches you to be... sit quietly there in Church and pay your tithes and offerings...

 

Clergy / laity is an unbiblical teaching and practice in the New Covenant / New Testament. 

 

It was what God had to resort to in the Old Testament / Old Covenant after the terrible thing that happened in the wilderness when Moses was up on Mount Sinai (Exodus 32), when the tribe that came to his side (the Levites) became the priestly tribe and the rest of Israel became essentially the laity. God had big plans for Israel:

 

Exodus 19:6 (NASB95)
6 and you shall be to Me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words that you shall speak to the sons of Israel.”

 

Sound familiar?

 

The compromised Gospel taught in Church today teaches a false division in the Church (clergy / laity)...

 

1 Corinthians 6:19-20 (NASB95)
19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?
20 For you have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body.

 

1 Corinthians 7:23 (NASB95)
23 You were bought with a price; do not become slaves of men.

 

Romans 12:1 (NASB95)
1 Therefore I urge you, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies a living and holy sacrifice, acceptable to God, which is your spiritual service of worship.

 

Or are you taught to go out and live like the world and just show up here when we have prayer meetings and collect your offerings?

 

Of course they would do it in such a way that you like them and feel good about yourself for doing what they tell you...

 

I am convinced most pastors who do so haven't got a clue that there is anything wrong with it.

[JohnD]

btw. I go the evening off and only had to work one job today... if any are wondering why I am here tonight.

 

Generally I believe I struck a nerve and am persona non grata right now.

 

Fine.

 

Each time over the past 40 years I go through it my hide gets that much thicker.

 

{sigh}

[LadyKay]

At a church I use to attend, one Sunday the pastor had a sermon on going to Sunday School. He told everyone that if you don't go to Sunday School, it means you don't love Jesus. Needless to say I did not agree.

[JohnD]

How about eschatology?

 

Does Pastor Friendly talk much about it? Or if at all with any sense of authority?

 

"Well some believe this, others believe that, and I'm not going to say what I believe..." sound familiar? It's a coward's compromise in the guise of not wanting to appear to take sides.

 

Eschatology is simple once you combine them all. The 70th Week of Daniel is what most have gotten wrong.

 

The Bible prophetically teaches in several references in several methods that it is a 7-year period of two tribulation periods that are 3 1/2 years long. Most formulated their eschatology on a single 7-year long tribulation period. 

 

When you realize the Bible breaks it down in 3 1/2 halves the eschatology makes perfect sense and is one belief not several.

 

1260 days = 3 1/2 years

42 months = 3 1/2 years

time + times + 1/2 a time = (you guessed it) 3 1/2 years.

 

The least popular tribulation is the first half of the 70th Week of Daniel:

 

Revelation 13:5-10 (NASB95)
5 There was given to him a mouth speaking arrogant words and blasphemies, and authority to act for forty-two months was given to him.
6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemies against God, to blaspheme His name and His tabernacle, that is, those who dwell in heaven.
7 It was also given to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them, and authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation was given to him.
8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.
9 If anyone has an ear, let him hear.
10 If anyone is destined for captivity, to captivity he goes; if anyone kills with the sword, with the sword he must be killed. Here is the perseverance and the faith of the saints.

 

The rapture will take place before the wrath of God is poured out on man and Satan. Believer's will never receive wrath from God since that was dealt with on the cross. (Isaiah 52:13 - 53:12) and:

 

Isaiah 54:8-10 (NASB95)
8 “In an outburst of anger I hid My face from you for a moment, But with everlasting lovingkindness I will have compassion on you,” Says the Lord your Redeemer.
9 “For this is like the days of Noah to Me, When I swore that the waters of Noah Would not flood the earth again; So I have sworn that I will not be angry with you Nor will I rebuke you.
10 “For the mountains may be removed and the hills may shake, But My lovingkindness will not be removed from you, And My covenant of peace will not be shaken,” Says the Lord who has compassion on you.

 

BTW this is a beautiful text to quote at a water baptism testimonial of the Holy Spirit baptism within.

 

But the devil's wrath and the wrath of the world when they get the upper hand on the Church as we have seen in recent generations here in America is real and devastating. All the more reason we should have bounced the equal opportunity thinkers out of this country when we were in a Protestant Christian majority in this country.

 

The one rapture will take place according to scripture,

 

PRE Great Tribulation

MID  70th Week of Daniel

POST Believer's Tribulation

 

This is where the three major camps got their biblical ammunition / support. They just got the setting wrong and once we do get it right all three camps line up.

 

This chart shows (using Daniel 12:11-12 as the base) the 70th Week of Daniel (click on to make larger):

 

 

Since we do not know when the 70th Week actually begins and we won't know until the sacrifice is abated to back date when it began... this is NOT date setting. It is prophetically showing the time frame or as Jesus said the season.