The Last Days great war in the Middle-East

[ARGOSY]

It is never my intention to brow beat anyone to believe as I do. That is arrogance. I struggle enough with this sin in many other facets of my life. Don't want to here.

I can see we see things differently, so what more can I do except have a good time fellowshipping with my brother.

You made it clear you see Jesus where I see antichrist in Daniel 9.

My desire is mostly to share and let you think about it. If you reject it, maybe you are wise to do so. Lol or maybe you are not. Haha

 

I do appreciate your approach, but surely a small exchange of verses is reaching discussion level rather than debate level. I find if both parties  just put forward their views and immediately agree to disagree without delving, then we are not even reaching discussion level. For example, you could have actually replied to my question about what you would have done in 69AD? Its not browbeating to ask someone to support their view scripturally that Israel should always be supported no matter how evil they are. Sure its non-confrontational to avoid answering some questions, but its not really a discussion then. Anyway, we may have to agree to disagree on this one too 

[Spock]

Argosy,

I didn't see your question what would I have done in 69AD?

Well, if I'm a Jew living in Jerusalem, I'm evacuating Jerusalem and probably thinking about starting a home bible study.

[Spock]

Marilyn,

This is one of those I feel 90% correct. I do not see the six days war fulfilling psalm 83 both in territory and extent of damage. Read this slowly again....

13Make them like tumbleweed, my God,

like chaff before the wind.

14As fire consumes the forest

or a flame sets the mountains ablaze,

15so pursue them with your tempest

and terrify them with your storm.

16Cover their faces with shame, Lord,

so that they will seek your name.

17May they ever be ashamed and dismayed;

may they perish in disgrace.

18Let them know that you, whose name is the Lord—

that you alone are the Most High over all the earth.

Wow! I can't wait to see it before my eyes. Praise The Lord!

[Marilyn C]

Hi Spock,

 

So it is the last bit that you do not see fulfilled in the 6 day war, is it? Well we know that all mankind will not acknowledge our Lord until He comes in Power & great glory, thus that last verse is a prophetic view to the end. This is what I spoke about somewhere else as to prophetic perspective. Remember Isa. 61: 2 & Luke 4: 19. Jesus stopped right in the middle of the sentence. The last part of that sentence has to wait for over 2000 years to be fulfilled - Prophetic perspective - putting 2 events close together in writing but in actuality they are a long way apart.

 

Hope that makes Ps. 83 & the 6 day war clearer. Marilyn.

[Spock]

Hi Spock,

 

So it is the last bit that you do not see fulfilled in the 6 day war, is it? Well we know that all mankind will not acknowledge our Lord until He comes in Power & great glory, thus that last verse is a prophetic view to the end. This is what I spoke about somewhere else as to prophetic perspective. Remember Isa. 61: 2 & Luke 4: 19. Jesus stopped right in the middle of the sentence. The last part of that sentence has to wait for over 2000 years to be fulfilled - Prophetic perspective - putting 2 events close together in writing but in actuality they are a long way apart.

 

Hope that makes Ps. 83 & the 6 day war clearer. Marilyn.

Yes and no.

The 6 days war pales in comparison to what I believe the extent of the psalm 83 war has in store for us. I believe the destruction of Syria will be HUGE and I believe once and for all the adjacent Arab nations will be done away with. This didn't happen during the 6 days war.

I think God wanted us to see this prophecy because it is going to be pretty dramatic, much more than the 6 days war.

Again, I speculate that the result of the devastation of this war will be the catalyst to bring in the antichrist. That makes this war even more significant.

[Marilyn C]

Hi Spock,

 

I hear what you are saying about a BIG war. Yet you need to remember that the Anti-Christ, the Assyrian, the King of the North, has a power base of that region - Iraq, Syria & Jordan - Assyria. Syria will not be destroyed but included in the ISIS`s Islamic State. Those that do get destroyed are Russia & its Federation. Thus as you said it will be the catalyst to bring in the Anti-Christ.

 

I can see this discussion will be developed in your latest thread. Good point to open up - the difference between the two wars.

[Spock]

Marilyn,

I've been studying hard the past two days on things you and inchrist have been saying, and you know, you two might be onto something.

ISIS may be scarier than I imagined.

What caught my eye came from rev 13. Read this-

1The dragon stood on the shore of the sea. And I saw a beast coming out of the sea. It had ten horns and seven heads, with ten crowns on its horns, and on each head a blasphemous name. 2The beast I saw resembled a leopard, but had feet like those of a bear and a mouth like that of a lion. The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority. 3One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was filled with wonder and followed the beast.

Notice the description of the beast-

1. Leopard-Greece=Syria

2. Bear- Persia=Iran

3. Lion-Babylon=Iraq

Where is Rome? No Rome. Interesting. Although I do believe a Rome is one of the 7 heads that have ruled Israel over history-

1. Egypt

2. Assyria

3. Babylon

4. Medo-Persia

5. Greece

6. Rome

7. Ottoman

So maybe the beast's (ac) kingdom is made up from countries that comprise those three beasts. Most of those countries are in the Middle East and North Africa.

That leads me to this thought?

Maybe, Rome isn't even the 4th beast in Daniel. (Are you drooling over this?)

Maybe it is like you say something more powerful IN THAT PART OF THE WORLD.

You see, I always have believed all these beasts are all about who controls ISRAEL.

I feel strongly about the antichrist being Assyrian which means he may be Iraqi and probably a Muslim.

So.......

Maybe the 4th beast is........

ISIS or something similar. They certainly kill by beheading.

Anyhow, I'm studying hard. I will be rereading your threads soon.

Always Love for you matey,

Spock

[Marilyn C]

Hi Spock,

 

I changed my picture as someone thought the angel looked like Moroni.

 

Now you had some good thoughts as to the final `beast.` Since we are far off the topic of this thread I thought I would start one in relation to the forming of the Global Government. And there we can try some scenarios & see how they line up with what is actually taking place. It would fit in well with your other thread - the 2 wars which lead up to & finish the Global Government.

 

`drooling,` yes, well...very pleased you are doing you homework & really checking out different views .  Great to chat with you are you think through & try things on for size.

[Spock]

Let's revisit the alleged Psalm 83 war.

Question: how do we know this is a war? Does it specify this in the word? Let's look at the word again...

1 O God, do not be silent! Do not ignore us! Do not be inactive, O God!

2 For look, your enemies are making a commotion; those who hate you are hostile.

3 They carefully plot against your people, and make plans to harm the ones you cherish.

4 They say, "Come on, let's annihilate them so they are no longer a nation! Then the name of Israel will be remembered no more."

5 Yes, they devise a unified strategy; they form an alliance against you.

6 It includes the tents of Edom and the Ishmaelites, Moab and the Hagrites,

7 Gebal, Ammon, and Amalek, Philistia and the inhabitants of Tyre.

8 Even Assyria has allied with them, lending its strength to the descendants of Lot. (Selah)

9 Do to them as you did to Midian - as you did to Sisera and Jabin at the Kishon River!

10 They were destroyed at Endor; their corpses were like manure on the ground.

11 Make their nobles like Oreb and Zeeb, and all their rulers like Zebah and Zalmunna,

12 who said, "Let's take over the pastures of God!"

13 O my God, make them like dead thistles, like dead weeds blown away by the wind!

14 Like the fire that burns down the forest, or the flames that consume the mountainsides,

15 chase them with your gale winds, and terrify them with your windstorm.

16 Cover their faces with shame, so they might seek you, O LORD.

17 May they be humiliated and continually terrified! May they die in shame!

18 Then they will know that you alone are the LORD, the sovereign king over all the earth.

Spock: I don't see anything about a war. I see Israel exhausted because they are surrounded by so many enemies. Check. I see the author pleasing for The Lord to do something about this. Check.....

Yes, he will do something about this. But where does it say it has to be before Daniel's 70th week. Why can't this judgment form God being at the day of The Lord?

So, let's ponder this- are we really sure Israel IDF has to wipe out these inner circle of Muslim enemies that surround Israel before the 70th week? Maybe it's not the IDF that will get the job done, maybe it will be The Lord at the day of The Lord.

Most of the OT prophesies related to these nations show them being judged in the day of The Lord and not before then.

Are we being a bit premature or perhaps wishful in wanting to see Israel flex it's muscle against their Muslim neighbors?

[Marilyn C]

Hi Spock.

 

 

Good try, but I would like to bring you attention to some important points -

 

Psalm 83.

1 O God, do not be silent! Do not ignore us! Do not be inactive, O God!
2 For look, your enemies are making a commotion; those who hate you are hostile.
3 They carefully plot against your people, and make plans to harm the ones you cherish.
4 They say, "Come on, let's annihilate them so they are no longer a nation! Then the name of Israel will be remembered no more."
5 Yes, they devise a unified strategy; they form an alliance against you.

 

This alliance was the first time it had ever happened, plus they were nearly quoting scripture it what their plans were - `to wipe Israel out as a nation.`

 

6 It includes the tents of Edom and the Ishmaelites, Moab and the Hagrites,
7 Gebal, Ammon, and Amalek, Philistia and the inhabitants of Tyre.
8 Even Assyria has allied with them, lending its strength to the descendants of Lot. (Selah)

 

These are the exact nations that came against Israel. They had hundreds of thousands of soldiers, with superior equipment etc.

 

9 Do to them as you did to Midian - as you did to Sisera and Jabin at the Kishon River!
10 They were destroyed at Endor; their corpses were like manure on the ground.
11 Make their nobles like Oreb and Zeeb, and all their rulers like Zebah and Zalmunna,
12 who said, "Let's take over the pastures of God!"
13 O my God, make them like dead thistles, like dead weeds blown away by the wind!
14 Like the fire that burns down the forest, or the flames that consume the mountainsides,
15 chase them with your gale winds, and terrify them with your windstorm.
16 Cover their faces with shame, so they might seek you, O LORD.

 

This is exactly what the outcome was - shame, humiliation, as it was a huge army overcome by a very small group with inferior equipment, tanks etc. The whole world saw that little Israel overcame the large alliance of the surrounding nations armies.

 

17 May they be humiliated and continually terrified! May they die in shame!
18 Then they will know that you alone are the LORD, the sovereign king over all the earth.

 

This is obviously for the future but in the context of the prophetic Psalm the Holy Spirit was giving their ultimate end . (prophetic perspective)

 

 

Now Israel did not wipe out the inner circle & that is not what is written there. Also the large territory that Israel gained during that war is exactly what is being disputed & divided up. This is what God says He will judge the nations for in the valley of Jehoshaphat (when the world armies came down from Armageddon, north of Israel)

 

`I will enter into judgment with them there on behalf of my people & My inheritance, Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations & they have DIVIDED UP MY LAND.` (Joel 3: 2)

 

Israel is not going to get more land from those around. So it has to be Ps. 83 as from then on it has been a `dividing up` of God`s land. Israel just wants peace with its neighbours (though of course it has to protect itself) Thus it will continually seek `peace treaties,` & continually give over more & more land. The world will continually show Israel as the aggressor but that is not the case.