Why are we all so pro israel here?

[Guest yod]

so quick to judge!

But thats not about the debate.

the Bible says that we ARE to judge all things in the house of God. We're trying to figure out whether;

1. you are pretending to be a christian

2. you are a christian without godly wisdom

3. you are an unbeliever only here to stir up strife

4. you are an unbeliever in search of the truth

If, as we all suspect, #4 is correct then we will handle you with kid gloves. If, however, you claim to be a christian we must take this a bit more seriously. We can't have one of our brothers popping off such hatred.

Read my post again, and say something relevant, not about me, but about myideas.

You ideas have all been disproven factually by Shiloh and every other comment you've made reveals your heart is corrupted against God's chosen people, the jews.

But if you have bitter jealousy and selfish ambition in your heart, do not be arrogant and so lie against the truth.

This wisdom is not that which comes down from above, but is earthly, natural, demonic.

For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there is disorder and every evil thing.

But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, reasonable, full of mercy and good fruits, unwavering, without hypocrisy.

[nebula]

Dear Daniel,

I have read through this whole thread, and, as a teacher, I have noticed that your posts have been a bunch of rants and raves with no evidence to back your claims - aside from one newspaper article that doesn't really prove anything.

If I were to grade you on your debating skills, your score would be very low. This does not help your argument any.

If you would like to make a case, please back your statements with Scriptures, provide supporting evidence to the claims you make (and one link to one newspaper article is not sufficient - for one article does not tell the whole story), and you need to specifically answer questions addressed to you.

Here is an example:

I know the scriptures well, ands that why you're wrong.

What is your supporting evidence that you "know the scriptures well"?

And you gave no evidence that Shiloh's statement was wrong.

Likewise, how can I believe you have the Spirit of God inside of you when you are reluctant to share about the time you gave your life to Jesus? If a bride is reluctant to share about her wedding day, I'd wonder about the status of her marriage. In the same way, if someone says, "I am a Christian," yet would rather dodge the question of his born-again experience, I have to question whether or not he really does have a walk with the Lord.

And yes, this question is very important in knowing how to answer your questions.

Why do we all support Israel which claims to have divine origins, when it doesn't?

Why do we support its killing of Palestinians?

Why?

Is this just?

Does it make the grass grow greener?

Does it?

Does it bring a smile to someone's face NOT at the cost of a Palestinian?

Why do we back Israel?

I will attempt to address these.

First, we as Christians believe that God's word does not change. Therefore when God told Abraham that He will bless those who bless Abraham and his descendants, and He will curse those who curse them, this means that we need to bless them. Since the Jews, as they are now called, are Abraham's descendants, we need to bless them for the sake of the Lord.

Recall in the Old Testament historical books and the Prophets that even though the Lord caused nations to rise against Israel for the sins Israel commited, the Lord still punished those nations for how they treated Israel.

By the way, have you noticed what is said of the Jews and the land of Israel in the last of the books in the New Testament, the book of Revelation?

About the "killing of the Palestinians," it is not as if Israel is going around targeting innocent civilians the way the Palestinians suicide bombers are. They have been targeting those that threaten their existance, and unfortunately "innocent bystanders" get caught. This is a sad occurance in every war.

The answer for why we back Israel has been given to you, so I do not see the point in repeating what has been said before.

how can they be God's people when they're so messed up, and NO DIFFERENT FROM ANY OTHER NATION

When did the Jews stop being God's people?

But why create an Israeli state in Arab land? why should they move out of their land for you? thats called stealing isnt it? Taking Arab land?

The Arabs who lived there didn't own the land. The area, then called "Palestine" belonged to the British, if I recall correctly.

The Israelis came AFTER the arabs. It wasnt the arabs that came after the jews? The jews came in the 20th century, how can that mean its their land if they had to invade it?

The Jews were there during the Roman Empire. This is long before there were a people even called "Arabs".

Ok, so gods on you're side. but the Arabs dont beleive in that god, they say Allah gave them the land, so its you're word against theirs, no one is right.

Whose word do you believe? Which God do you side with - the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob, or Allah?

The jews seem easy to manipulate. Say the words "anti semnitic" and they are at the speaker's throat. Easy to move pawns. Easily angered, and easy to use. Killing machines.

Alright, who are the ones walking onto buses or cafes and blowing themselves up - Jews or Arabs?

Talk about easy manipulation - why are the Arabs committing suicide and taking as many innocent civilians as they can with them? Can you answer this and not claim them as "killing machines"?

God doesnt kill, the israelis do.

God doesn't kill?

I thought you said you know the Scriptures!

New Testament: God killed Ananias and Saphira (book of Acts).

New Testament: God killed Herod (book of Acts).

New Testament: God kills many people (book of Revelation).

Now, when you chose to answer what I have said, please provide statements of evidence to back your claims.

Thank-you!

[apothanein kerdos]

yes to all, but thats not the debate.  And the BBC does a fine job.

Ah...you are English. That explains a lot.

The BBC has poisoned you.

so quick to judge!

But thats not about the debate.

Read my post again, and say something relevant, not about me, but about myideas.

BTW im going camping into the countryside, so you guys have a weekend to shout at me and say im ingnorant, and the usual, as much as you like

have fun

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If you get lost an need to use your cell phone, or someone calls you for an emergency on your cell phone...thank israel...they developed that technology.

[Budman]

BTW im going camping into the countryside, so you guys have a weekend to shout at me and say im ingnorant, and the usual, as much as you like

I can just picture you with your lower lip stuck out and you stamping your foot as you posted that.

You can't back up a single thing you said with facts, you only state your hate filled opinion. You can't even quote any of the scriptures you know so well to back up anything you say. Face it Daniel, you have been exposed as just another Jew-basher with a demonic hatred for Israel.

Grow up, Junior.

-bud

PS: This is how you really spell "ignorant."

[Daniel9601]

Well id say nebula answered my questions concisely.

Thankyou, it has cleared the issue up for me, because no one in England knows ANYthing about Israel AT ALL, not NOTHING. Which is why i came this website for answers to questions no one knew about.

The only question remains, if they [israel] were god's people, why would god allow stray bullets to harm civilians, why would he want his people to have a bad name?

PS: demonic is spelt "daemonic"

Lets not be immature and go into spelling issues please...

[Leonard]

Brits and Americans spell some words differently, among them 'demonic' (USA) and daemonic (UK). As Churchill noted, America and England are two great nations separated only by a common language.

[Botz]

Neb...

The Jews were there during the Roman Empire. This is long before there were a people even called "Arabs".

Not quite true.

My understanding is that Arab ancestry traces its roots back to the offspring of Shem...the eldest of Noahs sons. This can be seen by looking at the areas in which their tribes came and dwelt.

The word Arab occurs in Joshua.

Joshua 15:52 Arab, and Dumah, and Eshan,....

... as a town in Israel at the time. It is interesting to see that the word arev derives from the verb arov which means 'to ambush'.

It is also found in Kings and Nehemiah...etc

1Kings 10:15 Beside that he had of the merchantmen, and of the traffick of the spice merchants, and of all the kings of Arabia, and of the governors of the country.

Nehemiah 4:7 But it came to pass, that when Sanballat, and Tobiah, and the Arabians, and the Ammonites, and the Ashdodites, heard that the walls of Jerusalem were made up, and that the breaches began to be stopped, then they were very wroth,

Neh 4:8 And conspired all of them together to come and to fight against Jerusalem, and to hinder it.

Isaiah 13:20 It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation: neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall shepherds make their flocks to lie down there.

From what I understand Arabs/Arabians at first were odd nomads that lived in land that had no name...they were basically desert dwellers,bedouin types that did not enjoy a good reputation...much like the Bedouin that rampaged throughout Palestine indescriminately plundering,killing and terrifying local transient inhabitants before the nation of Israel re-emerged.

Also the people who dwelt in the Arabian peninsular eventually became known collectively as Arabs certainly by around the 3rd Century BCE. There are also Assyrian writings as far back as about 850 BCE that mention them...I believe I saw some large carvings in the British Museum depicting captive Hittites,Jews and Arabs dating to that time period and Tiglath Pilezer 3rd...but don't quote me on that as I cannot remember clearly...more likely they were Egyptians.

There are other aspects to Arab identity including the origin of the Cushites and the Nabateans...and sometimes the old red-herring of the Ishmaelites gets thrown into the argument. So suffice to say...Arabs were around a bit longer than was suggested.

[Guest shiloh357]

Well id say nebula answered my questions concisely.

Thankyou, it has cleared the issue up for me, because no one in England knows ANYthing about Israel AT ALL, not NOTHING.

[angels4u]

DANIEL, YOU FORGOT TO ANSWER MY QUESTION!

Are you a born again Christian?

Do you know for sure if you are saved?

Who saved you and from what?

Who is Jesus to you??

Angels

[Daniel9601]

y-

-e

-seh

Look yes to all.

Christ Jesus saved me from, some say drugs, some say sex, but i say he saved me from nothing. He saved me from boredom, he saved me from a life that MEANT nothing.

I wasn't in despair, i wasn't at the end of my road, quite the opposite i was looking forward to a bright future and a rich career (none of which i hope for now), so i wasn't that bad, then i met a pensioner, who told his story which was much like mine (the one i was hoping of living), full of money and a nice house, and long and interesting life story, and then he died the next week. It hit me that he, like myself had hoped to live a good life, and he HAD, and i was hoping that i was going to, but i realised HE DIED, it WAS OVER, THE END! HES DEAD NO ONE CARES ABOUT HIM!!! But with jesus there is no end. I wont die and then that'll be it, just imagine, how meaningless my life would have been, it wwouldn'thave MATTERED if i was good, no one would CARE if i was a murderer, with judgement comes significance of a lived. God will ask me at the end of my life, what did you do with the 10,000 talents i gave you?

Jesus gave me meaning and code to be answered by. If there was no Law, or God, or Jesus, then theres nothing to be worried about, who will we answer to? Now that jesus is here (well, he always was, it MYSELF that wasn't WITH HIM!) i cant say "Oh im sorry i didn't know!"

at the gates of hell there will be much gnashing of teeth and "i knew you jesus!" and jesus will say "i don't

know you?"

also there will be many people that claim they don't know jesus, and will say to him "who are you?"

I don't want to be a non-knower living out a happy (irrelevant) life.

So my testimony isn't about how he saved from a bad life, but he saved me from a meaningless life.

Edited January 9, 2005 by Daniel9601