OakWood Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 867 Topics Per Day: 0.24 Content Count: 7,331 Content Per Day: 2.00 Reputation: 2,860 Days Won: 31 Joined: 04/09/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/28/1964 Author Share Posted August 21, 2014 It is because they have no excuse. They cannot hide anything from God. The books are an open view of what they have/had done in their lifetime. They did not accept the Truth when given to them. They chose to do evil and not good. God is looking into their hearts. They are guilty, thus their fate is eternal torment in the Lake of Fire. They are being judged by their works, not Christ's work on the Cross. In Christ Montana Marv Yes, but what is the point of judging them then? The word 'judge' means to assess a situation in order to determine an outcome. The word 'according' means that the outcome is should be in agreement with those works. In other words, you don't judge those that have already been judged. If they're damned anyway, then their works are irrelevant, so why bother with them unless their works in some way help to determine the outcome. If the outcome is already determined then why judge? Just throw them into the fire and be done with! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Marv Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 3,135 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 1,091 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted August 21, 2014 It is because they have no excuse. They cannot hide anything from God. The books are an open view of what they have/had done in their lifetime. They did not accept the Truth when given to them. They chose to do evil and not good. God is looking into their hearts. They are guilty, thus their fate is eternal torment in the Lake of Fire. They are being judged by their works, not Christ's work on the Cross. In Christ Montana Marv Yes, but what is the point of judging them then? The word 'judge' means to assess a situation in order to determine an outcome. The word 'according' means that the outcome is should be in agreement with those works. In other words, you don't judge those that have already been judged. If they're damned anyway, then their works are irrelevant, so why bother with them unless their works in some way help to determine the outcome. If the outcome is already determined then why judge? Just throw them into the fire and be done with! Oakwood Because they will ask the question. Prove it. And Christ proves it by what is written in the books. In Christ Montana Marv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jesse Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 It is because they have no excuse. They cannot hide anything from God. The books are an open view of what they have/had done in their lifetime. They did not accept the Truth when given to them. They chose to do evil and not good. God is looking into their hearts. They are guilty, thus their fate is eternal torment in the Lake of Fire. They are being judged by their works, not Christ's work on the Cross. In Christ Montana Marv Yes, but what is the point of judging them then? The word 'judge' means to assess a situation in order to determine an outcome. The word 'according' means that the outcome is should be in agreement with those works. In other words, you don't judge those that have already been judged. If they're damned anyway, then their works are irrelevant, so why bother with them unless their works in some way help to determine the outcome. If the outcome is already determined then why judge? Just throw them into the fire and be done with! Oakwood Because they will ask the question. Prove it. And Christ proves it by what is written in the books. In Christ Montana Marv God is righteous,all must be judged before proven guilty. When proven guilty;they will not receive their reward,which is everlasting life. jesse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OakWood Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 867 Topics Per Day: 0.24 Content Count: 7,331 Content Per Day: 2.00 Reputation: 2,860 Days Won: 31 Joined: 04/09/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/28/1964 Author Share Posted August 21, 2014 It is because they have no excuse. They cannot hide anything from God. The books are an open view of what they have/had done in their lifetime. They did not accept the Truth when given to them. They chose to do evil and not good. God is looking into their hearts. They are guilty, thus their fate is eternal torment in the Lake of Fire. They are being judged by their works, not Christ's work on the Cross. In Christ Montana Marv Yes, but what is the point of judging them then? The word 'judge' means to assess a situation in order to determine an outcome. The word 'according' means that the outcome is should be in agreement with those works. In other words, you don't judge those that have already been judged. If they're damned anyway, then their works are irrelevant, so why bother with them unless their works in some way help to determine the outcome. If the outcome is already determined then why judge? Just throw them into the fire and be done with! Oakwood Because they will ask the question. Prove it. And Christ proves it by what is written in the books. In Christ Montana Marv It's still not a judgement because they have already been found guilty. All it is, is an explanation of the verdict and why that verdict was reached. That's not what judgement means. Besides, that doesn't explain how their works shape the verdict. If they are damned anyway, then their works are insignificant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 597 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,106 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,837 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted August 21, 2014 Oakwood, thank you for bringing up this subject, but alas as I have had trouble for years when I bring it up, you will see preconceived ideas make what the Bible clearly says none affect. When Jesus told us that the only way to the father was through him, he didn't mean a Romans 10 conversion....... he meant that he and only he would decide who goes to heaven and who goes to hell. If you read Matthew chapter 25 starting at verse 30 I believe you will see the details of this Judgement. It gives an opening for Jesus himself to decide who will and will not go to heaven among those who never heard of him, and even the parameters for his choice.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justfaith Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted August 21, 2014 Here is how you are thinking: 1,000 Years Start At Christ's Coming 1. "first resurrection", "resurrection of life" - unto Eternal Life at Christ's coming, His Faithful saints 2. "the dead" - wicked in the graves, not resurrected 3. "nations" - wicked and unbelievers outside the gates of the holy city of Rev.22:15, still subject to the "second death". 1,000 Years End 4. Great White Throne Judgment - "the dead" resurrected at end of thousand years, judged and cast into the "lake of fire" ("second death"). Any name not found also cast into the "lake of fire". Hell and death cast into the "lake of fire". (nothing about those of the "nations" that DO NOT follow Satan after his release from the pit at the end of the thousand years, is there?) (nothing about believers on Christ that fell away NOT of the "first resurrection" either, is there?) Do you not see a problem with that? Here's how I am thinking... 1,000 Years Start At Christ's Coming 1. "first resurrection", "resurrection of life" - unto Eternal Life at Christ's coming, His Faithful saints, dwelling inside the gates of the holy city, having right to the tree of life on earth, Rev.22:14, Ezek.47. 2. "resurrection of damnation" - ALL who rejected Christ Jesus, and all believers who fell away from Christ (took the mark, being deceived, fell from the Faith, five foolish virgins, unprofitable servant, etc.). The "nations" and peoples dwelling outside the gates of the holy city on earth, Rev.22:15. These all... are STILL subject to the "second death" ("lake of fire") at the end, and thus are "the dead", meaning spiritually dead in their souls. 1,000 Years End 3. those of the "nations" outside the city that follow Satan when he is released perish with him by fire from God down from Heaven in protecting the holy city and His saints upon the earth (Rev.20:8-10). 4. Great White Throne Judgment - "the dead" before the Throne. Books are opened and compared. Those names not found cast into the "lake of fire" with hell and death. 5. 2nd Resurrection - unto Eternal Life through Christ Jesus, those of "the dead" who came to Christ DURING the 1,000 years and overcame Satan's final temptation to go upon against the "camp of saints" on earth to destroy. These are no longer part of "the dead", but are joined with Christ's saints of the "first resurrection", and both go into God's Eternal Kingdom forever. Are you saying that the new Jerusalem will exist during the 1000 years ? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justfaith Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted August 21, 2014 It is because they have no excuse. They cannot hide anything from God. The books are an open view of what they have/had done in their lifetime. They did not accept the Truth when given to them. They chose to do evil and not good. God is looking into their hearts. They are guilty, thus their fate is eternal torment in the Lake of Fire. They are being judged by their works, not Christ's work on the Cross. In Christ Montana Marv Yes, but what is the point of judging them then? The word 'judge' means to assess a situation in order to determine an outcome. The word 'according' means that the outcome is should be in agreement with those works. In other words, you don't judge those that have already been judged. If they're damned anyway, then their works are irrelevant, so why bother with them unless their works in some way help to determine the outcome. If the outcome is already determined then why judge? Just throw them into the fire and be done with! Oakwood Because they will ask the question. Prove it. And Christ proves it by what is written in the books. In Christ Montana Marv Will the righteous be judged at that white throne also ? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justfaith Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted August 21, 2014 There is an idea in Scripture that some will fare worse than others when it comes to Hell........ Matthew 10 24 Nevertheless I say to you that it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom in the day of judgment, than for you.” Matthew 18 6 but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea. I can see something in this. This suggests that a person's works will decide how severe their punishment is. Hi Oakwood. 1. At the second coming;This wicked system will be destroyed,only the true belivers resurrected in spirit form. The rest of the survivors and the dead in their graves will be left as is. 2. The jews from the past and present and some living will be brought back to their own land,in the flesh. which will be paradise(jerusalem).Only the remnant of the jews chosen by God. The saints will rule over them,as kings and priests. And Jesus as king of kings. This would be the kingdom of the saints,for one thousand years.The lion will eat straw. 3. The gentiles left,will multiply outside the square(kingdom),and so will the jews inside the square(paradise). 4.The jews taught christ by the saints,will also teach the gentiles out side. many gentiles will accept Christ,But many also will not. 5.When the thousand years are past, satan will be let loose to draw the non believers of the gentiles outside, to one place to attack the square(kingdom). They all will be destroyed by God himself this time. This is the war of gog and magog. Now all the wicked are dead;satan and his angels cast into the fire. 6.There are still many dead gentiles in the graves of all generations,and all religions. They will be brought back to life; judged by their deeds(hearts). The sheep placed on the right(the good hearted),and the goats on the left(the mean hearted). The goats, cast in the fire;the sheep accepted,and changed into spirit form,and will join all the saints. 7. Now all the wicked are no more, all the saints will be God's children. 8. But the earth is still poluted on the suface, and under the earth. The earth will be melted, and a new earth created. All the saints will be in heaven untill its done. 9. Then all will come down to the new earth,and God will also dwell on earth,all can see Him face to face. God's will is done in earth. jesse. Where in the bible say that the wicked will accept Christ in the 1000 year and get salvation ? Are you saying there will be baptism in the 1000 years ? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jesse Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 There is an idea in Scripture that some will fare worse than others when it comes to Hell........ Matthew 10 24 Nevertheless I say to you that it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom in the day of judgment, than for you.” Matthew 18 6 but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea. I can see something in this. This suggests that a person's works will decide how severe their punishment is. Hi Oakwood. 1. At the second coming;This wicked system will be destroyed,only the true belivers resurrected in spirit form. The rest of the survivors and the dead in their graves will be left as is. 2. The jews from the past and present and some living will be brought back to their own land,in the flesh. which will be paradise(jerusalem).Only the remnant of the jews chosen by God. The saints will rule over them,as kings and priests. And Jesus as king of kings. This would be the kingdom of the saints,for one thousand years.The lion will eat straw. 3. The gentiles left,will multiply outside the square(kingdom),and so will the jews inside the square(paradise). 4.The jews taught christ by the saints,will also teach the gentiles out side. many gentiles will accept Christ,But many also will not. 5.When the thousand years are past, satan will be let loose to draw the non believers of the gentiles outside, to one place to attack the square(kingdom). They all will be destroyed by God himself this time. This is the war of gog and magog. Now all the wicked are dead;satan and his angels cast into the fire. 6.There are still many dead gentiles in the graves of all generations,and all religions. They will be brought back to life; judged by their deeds(hearts). The sheep placed on the right(the good hearted),and the goats on the left(the mean hearted). The goats, cast in the fire;the sheep accepted,and changed into spirit form,and will join all the saints. 7. Now all the wicked are no more, all the saints will be God's children. 8. But the earth is still poluted on the suface, and under the earth. The earth will be melted, and a new earth created. All the saints will be in heaven untill its done. 9. Then all will come down to the new earth,and God will also dwell on earth,all can see Him face to face. God's will is done in earth. jesse. Where in the bible say that the wicked will accept Christ in the 1000 year and get salvation ? Are you saying there will be baptism in the 1000 years ? thanks I am sure that there will be the same ritual of baptism of water. It's not written in scripture. jesse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justfaith Posted August 21, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted August 21, 2014 There is an idea in Scripture that some will fare worse than others when it comes to Hell........ Matthew 10 24 Nevertheless I say to you that it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom in the day of judgment, than for you.” Matthew 18 6 but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea. I can see something in this. This suggests that a person's works will decide how severe their punishment is. Hi Oakwood. 1. At the second coming;This wicked system will be destroyed,only the true belivers resurrected in spirit form. The rest of the survivors and the dead in their graves will be left as is. 2. The jews from the past and present and some living will be brought back to their own land,in the flesh. which will be paradise(jerusalem).Only the remnant of the jews chosen by God. The saints will rule over them,as kings and priests. And Jesus as king of kings. This would be the kingdom of the saints,for one thousand years.The lion will eat straw. 3. The gentiles left,will multiply outside the square(kingdom),and so will the jews inside the square(paradise). 4.The jews taught christ by the saints,will also teach the gentiles out side. many gentiles will accept Christ,But many also will not. 5.When the thousand years are past, satan will be let loose to draw the non believers of the gentiles outside, to one place to attack the square(kingdom). They all will be destroyed by God himself this time. This is the war of gog and magog. Now all the wicked are dead;satan and his angels cast into the fire. 6.There are still many dead gentiles in the graves of all generations,and all religions. They will be brought back to life; judged by their deeds(hearts). The sheep placed on the right(the good hearted),and the goats on the left(the mean hearted). The goats, cast in the fire;the sheep accepted,and changed into spirit form,and will join all the saints. 7. Now all the wicked are no more, all the saints will be God's children. 8. But the earth is still poluted on the suface, and under the earth. The earth will be melted, and a new earth created. All the saints will be in heaven untill its done. 9. Then all will come down to the new earth,and God will also dwell on earth,all can see Him face to face. God's will is done in earth. jesse. Where in the bible say that the wicked will accept Christ in the 1000 year and get salvation ? Are you saying there will be baptism in the 1000 years ? thanks I am sure that there will be the same ritual of baptism of water. It's not written in scripture. jesse. The bible does not say that there is a second chance for anyone in the 1000 years Though they listen to Jesus that is the wicked nations it would be in vain as regards to salvation thus they are ruled with a rod of iron and only listen to survive and eat Zechariah 14:16-18King James Version (KJV) 16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles. 17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain. 18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the Lord will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles. Probation period is closed thus we live for Jesus now so that when He comes we will not be found wanting Isaiah 65:20King James Version (KJV) 20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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