A Question for Roman Catholics

[George]

1 hour ago, BlueMinou said:

What do you have to say about that?

 

Col 1:13  Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
Col 1:14  In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 1:15  Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16  For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Col 1:17  And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Col 1:18  And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Col 1:19  For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
Col 1:20  And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

 

[BlueMinou]

3 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

Arius was a heretic.  That's where the terms Arianism and Arian Heresy come from.  He did not worship the same God as we do because Jesus said "I and the Father are one."  [NASB, John 10:30]  To learn more, read the information in the link cited below.

Source: Arianism

Yes, we both agree he taught lies and had the wrong idea about who God is, and who Jesus is. 

 

Still, Arius still worshiped the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, the Great I Am, did he not? How is that any different than the jews of the Old Testament worshiping YWHW without accepting Jesus as God, or that YWHW is a triune God?

 

Although Arius really did worship YHWH, we both agree that he was in error regardless of how he worshipped YWHW.

 

 

 

Edited July 27, 2016 by BlueMinou

[SavedOnebyGrace]

Just now, BlueMinou said:

He still worshiped the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, the Great I Am, did he not?

Evidentially, he did not regardless what he claimed.

"Truly, truly, I tell you," Jesus declared, "before Abraham was born, I am!"  [John 8:58]

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning.…  [John 1:1-1:2]

Matthew Henry Commentary

1:1-5 The plainest reason why the Son of God is called the Word, seems to be, that as our words explain our minds to others, so was the Son of God sent in order to reveal his Father's mind to the world. What the evangelist says of Christ proves that he is God. He asserts, His existence in the beginning; His coexistence with the Father. The Word was with God. All things were made by him, and not as an instrument. Without him was not any thing made that was made, from the highest angel to the meanest worm. This shows how well qualified he was for the work of our redemption and salvation. The light of reason, as well as the life of sense, is derived from him, and depends upon him. This eternal Word, this true Light shines, but the darkness comprehends it not. Let us pray without ceasing, that our eyes may be opened to behold this Light, that we may walk in it; and thus be made wise unto salvation, by faith in Jesus Christ.

Source: Bible Hub on John 1:1

[SavedOnebyGrace]

I won't be posting any more today.  George and I have provided enough information for you to ponder.  I'm not feeling well at the moment ... I suffer from migraines resulting from a bulging disc in my neck (C7).

[BlueMinou]

My point still stands that Arius worshipped the first person on the Trinity, God The Father.

[George]

26 minutes ago, BlueMinou said:

Still, Arius still worshiped the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, the Great I Am, did he not? How is that any different than the jews of the Old Testament worshiping YWHW without accepting Jesus as God, or that YWHW is a triune God?

 

The issue of salvation is up to God and praise God He saves based on His Son!  However this does not negate the fact the Scriptures are full of references showing the Triune God. 

[BlueMinou]

George I agree with your post.

Just now, George said:

The issue of salvation is up to God and praise God He saves based on His Son!  However this does not negate the fact the Scriptures are full of references showing the Triune God. 

 

[SavedOnebyGrace]

Arius and His Teaching
Arius, who was born in Egypt in 256 A.D., was a parish priest in Alexandria. He had studied under St. Lucian of Antioch, the founder of the school of Antioch, who had earlier been condemned for holding that Christ was only a man; although he was later reconciled. He is called the "Father of Arianism" because "Arius and almost all the 4th-century Arian theologians were his students.

Calling themselves Lucianists and Collucianists, they developed his adoptionist and subordinationist tendencies into a full heresy (Harkins 1967, 1057, 1058)."

With this background Arius struggled with the question of the Trinity. His teaching in Alexandria was the following: "Personal distinctions were not eternally present within the nature of God. . . the Godhead Himself was responsible for them. . . Identifying the eternal Godhead with the Father and regarding the Logos ('Logos' is simply a Greek word for 'word') as no more than a power or quality of the Father, he said that before time began the Father had created the Son by the power of the Word to be His agent in creation.

The Son was not therefore to be identified with the Godhead, He was only God in a derivative sense, and since there was once when he did not exist He could not be eternal. Arius stressed the subordination of the Logos to such an extent as to affirm His creaturehood, to deny His eternity and to assert His capacity for change and suffering (Ward 1955, 41)." This teaching of Arius "drove the distinctions outside the Deity and thus destroyed the Trinity. It meant solving the difficulty of the One and the Many by proposing a theory of one Supreme Being and two inferior deities (Ward 1955, 43)." The Person of Christ "belonged to no order of being that the Church could recognize. . . He was neither God nor man (Ward 1955, 42)."

Source: The Teaching of Arius

Since this teaching denies the very nature of the Godhead, Arius worshipped a god of his own creation, denying the deity of Jesus and the Holy Spirit.  Ergo, he did not worship the same God as Christians do today.  There's no Biblical support for his teaching.

Edited August 4, 2016 by Saved.One.by.Grace