Lucifers creation and rebellion.

[HAZARD]

49 minutes ago, hmbld said:

I don’t know that not believing your theory makes me a “scoffer”. 

Is your name "Some?" Did I mention your name? Its not my theory, read 2 Peter 3:5-7 and believe what you read.

Or Explain this another way, if you can logically.

Peter said, If the world that "THAT THEN WAS" is that between Adam and the flood of Noah, then God created The heavens and the Earth "WHICH ARE NOW" since the flood of Noah.

Noah and his family lived prior to his flood and after it. The world "THAT THEN WAS PERISHED"  and everything in it also perished.

What change could Noah's flood make to the heavens? None, for floods on Earth can never cover the heavens. The earth, vegetation, the heavens, all remained the same after Noah's flood.

2 Peter 3:5-7 expresses this clearly in plain human language, "For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing (emerging) out of the water and in the water:

Whereby the world THAT THEN WAS, being overflowed with water, PERISHED:

But the heavens and the Earth, WHICH ARE NOW, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."

Peter also said these scoffers were / and now also, are willingly ignorant of this truth.

[hmbld]

1 hour ago, HAZARD said:

Is your name "Some?" Did I mention your name? Its not my theory, read 2 Peter 3:5-7 and believe what you read.

Or Explain this another way, if you can logically.

Peter said, If the world that "THAT THEN WAS" is that between Adam and the flood of Noah, then God created The heavens and the Earth "WHICH ARE NOW" since the flood of Noah.

Noah and his family lived prior to his flood and after it. The world "THAT THEN WAS PERISHED"  and everything in it also perished.

What change could Noah's flood make to the heavens? None, for floods on Earth can never cover the heavens. The earth, vegetation, the heavens, all remained the same after Noah's flood.

2 Peter 3:5-7 expresses this clearly in plain human language, "For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing (emerging) out of the water and in the water:

Whereby the world THAT THEN WAS, being overflowed with water, PERISHED:

But the heavens and the Earth, WHICH ARE NOW, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."

Peter also said these scoffers were / and now also, are willingly ignorant of this truth.

Friend, I have read all you present, years ago. You stand on dangerous ground, for you are opposing scripture, for in six days God created all, then rested. Even in Eden, God provided cover for Adams nakedness, a shadow of what was to come:  pointing to Christ. 

Tell me, how does this theory you present point to Christ?

[Guest]

20 hours ago, HAZARD said:

Noahs flood which I will post as . 'N.F.' Lucifers flood, 'L.F.'

L.F. Earth made waste (Gen. 1:2; Jer. 4:23-26; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Earth not made waste (Gen. 8:11-12, 22 ; Heb. 11:7 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. Earth made empty (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23).
N.F. Earth not made empty (Gen. 6:18-22 ; 8:16).

L.F. Earth made totally dark (Gen. 1:2-5 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Not made totally dark (Gen. 8:6-22)

L.F. No light from heaven (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Light from heaven (Gen. 8:6-22).

L.F. No day and night (Gen. 1:2-5).
N.F. Day and night (Gen. 8:1-22).

L.F. All vegetation destroyed Gen. 1:2 ; 2:5-6 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Vegetation not destroyed (Gen. 8:11, 21 ; 9:3, 20).

L.F. No continued abating of the waters off the earth (Gen. 1:6-12).
N.F. Continued abating of the waters from the earth by evaporation (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. Waters taken off the earth in one day (Gen. 1:10).
N.F. Months of waters abating off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. God supernaturally takes waters off the earth (Gen. 1:6-12).
N.F. Natural work of evaporation of the waters off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. No rebuke or miraculous work in fled away (Gen. 1:6-12 ; Ps. 104:7).
N.F. No rebuke or miraculous work is taking waters off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. The waters on earth in Gen. 1:2, hasted away when rebuked (Gen. 1:6-2 ; Ps. 104:9).
N.F. The bounds already eternally set for waters in Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. All fish were totally destroyed in flood of Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. No fish were destroyed of created again after Noah's flood (Gen. 1:20-23 ; 6:18-22).

L.F. No Fowls left on the earth after (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Fowls were left after Noah's flood (Gen. 6:20 ; 8:7-17).

L.F. No animals left after (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Some of all animals kept alive (Gen. 6:20 ; 8:17 ; 9:2-4, 10-16).

L.F. No man left on earth in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Eight men and women left after Noah's flood (Gen. 6:18 ; 8:15-22 ; 9:1-16 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. No social system left at all in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. A social system left after Noah's flood (Gen. 8:15-22 ; 9:1-16 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. No ark made to save men in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. An ark made to save men and animals alive (Gen. 6:8-8 : 22 ; 9:1-16 ; Heb. 11:7).

L.F. Cause: fall of Lucifer, now Satan (Isa. 14:12-14; Jer. 4:23-26; Ezek. 28:11-17 ; Luke 10:18).
N.F. Cause: wickedness of men (Gen. 6:5-13) ; and fallen angels (Gen. 6:1-4; Jude 6-7 ; 2 Pet. 2:4).

L.F. Result: became necessary to make new life on earth (Gen. 1:3-2 : 25 ; Isa. 45:18 ; Eph. 3:11).
N.F. Results: no new creation made, for all men and animals were not destroyed (Gen. 6:18-8 : 22 ; 9:1-16).

Hi Hazard,

That’s quite a list! At glance, I see a number of compared verses that that would certainly catch someone’s attention in trying to figure out how it all fits together. You’ve done quite a study with all that, and organized them quite well to allow others to follow your steps in researching this.

I’m actually interested in analyzing any possible relationships among the list of scriptures you’ve provided. It allows me to see what you’re presenting and weigh your understanding with actual scripture. I see some in the list that I’ve already completed language and syntax studies on in the past. 

I’ll confess that I may go into this with some bias, but I approach my own research that way as well.  

 

[HAZARD]

3 hours ago, hmbld said:

Friend, I have read all you present, years ago. You stand on dangerous ground, for you are opposing scripture, for in six days God created all, then rested. Even in Eden, God provided cover for Adams nakedness, a shadow of what was to come:  pointing to Christ. 

Tell me, how does this theory you present point to Christ?

Anyone can say "Your standing on dangerous ground," I could say the same to you but that would not prove anything. I have given hundreds of checkable scriptures. Tell me when do you think Lucifer convinced one third of God's angels to join him to invade Heaven, seeing he was already a fallen creature when he entered Adams Eden?

Isa. 14: 12- 13, V. 12, How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

V. For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

When did Lucifer fall? Can you answer that question?

 

While your at it, read these scriptures again, and tell me what you don't see here regarding the fact shown by many scriptures that there were two universal floods. If you say you have already read this then you just don't get it, simple as that.

Noahs flood which I will post as . 'N.F.' Lucifers flood, 'L.F.'

L.F. Earth made waste (Gen. 1:2; Jer. 4:23-26; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Earth not made waste (Gen. 8:11-12, 22 ; Heb. 11:7 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. Earth made empty (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23).
N.F. Earth not made empty (Gen. 6:18-22 ; 8:16).

L.F. Earth made totally dark (Gen. 1:2-5 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Not made totally dark (Gen. 8:6-22)

L.F. No light from heaven (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Light from heaven (Gen. 8:6-22).

L.F. No day and night (Gen. 1:2-5).
N.F. Day and night (Gen. 8:1-22).

L.F. All vegetation destroyed Gen. 1:2 ; 2:5-6 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Vegetation not destroyed (Gen. 8:11, 21 ; 9:3, 20).

L.F. No continued abating of the waters off the earth (Gen. 1:6-12).
N.F. Continued abating of the waters from the earth by evaporation (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. Waters taken off the earth in one day (Gen. 1:10).
N.F. Months of waters abating off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. God supernaturally takes waters off the earth (Gen. 1:6-12).
N.F. Natural work of evaporation of the waters off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. No rebuke or miraculous work in fled away (Gen. 1:6-12 ; Ps. 104:7).
N.F. No rebuke or miraculous work is taking waters off the earth (Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. The waters on earth in Gen. 1:2, hasted away when rebuked (Gen. 1:6-2 ; Ps. 104:9).
N.F. The bounds already eternally set for waters in Gen. 8:1-14).

L.F. All fish were totally destroyed in flood of Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. No fish were destroyed of created again after Noah's flood (Gen. 1:20-23 ; 6:18-22).

L.F. No Fowls left on the earth after (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26).
N.F. Fowls were left after Noah's flood (Gen. 6:20 ; 8:7-17).

L.F. No animals left after (Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Some of all animals kept alive (Gen. 6:20 ; 8:17 ; 9:2-4, 10-16).

L.F. No man left on earth in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. Eight men and women left after Noah's flood (Gen. 6:18 ; 8:15-22 ; 9:1-16 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. No social system left at all in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. A social system left after Noah's flood (Gen. 8:15-22 ; 9:1-16 ; 1 Pet. 3:20).

L.F. No ark made to save men in Gen. 1:2 ; Jer. 4:23-26 ; 2 Pet. 3:5-6).
N.F. An ark made to save men and animals alive (Gen. 6:8-8 : 22 ; 9:1-16 ; Heb. 11:7).

L.F. Cause: fall of Lucifer, now Satan (Isa. 14:12-14; Jer. 4:23-26; Ezek. 28:11-17 ; Luke 10:18).
N.F. Cause: wickedness of men (Gen. 6:5-13) ; and fallen angels (Gen. 6:1-4; Jude 6-7 ; 2 Pet. 2:4).

L.F. Result: became necessary to make new life on earth (Gen. 1:3-2 : 25 ; Isa. 45:18 ; Eph. 3:11).

N.F. Results: no new creation made, for all men and animals were not destroyed (Gen. 6:18-8 : 22 ; 9:1-16).

And, 2 Peter 3:5-7 expresses this clearly in plain human language, "For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing (emerging) out of the water and in the water:

Whereby the world THAT THEN WAS, being overflowed with water, PERISHED:

But the heavens and the Earth, WHICH ARE NOW, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."

Peter also said these scoffers were / and now also, are willingly ignorant.

Help me out here, What were the scoffers Peter talks about in 2 Peter 3:5-7, willingly ignorant of, in your opinion?

 

[enoob57]

17 minutes ago, HAZARD said:

When did Lucifer fall? Can you answer that question?

Yes I can it was after God Sanctified all that He had ever made!

Genesis 2:3 (KJV)

[3] And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

No matter how you slice your extra Biblical reasoning- you have God sanctifying sin and that is not The God of The Bible... 

[HAZARD]

3 hours ago, enoob57 said:

Yes I can it was after God Sanctified all that He had ever made!

Genesis 2:3 (KJV)

[3] And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

No matter how you slice your extra Biblical reasoning- you have God sanctifying sin and that is not The God of The Bible... 

Sorry, that doesn't cut it. The first use of this word proves that sanctification means separation from profane to a sacred purpose, and that is not limited to the sin question.

Here God told Adam and Eve to go forth and "REPLENISH THE EARTH," just as He told Noah and his family the same thing, to go and replenish the earth.

Gen 1:28, And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Gen 9:1, And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.

Now why would God  tell Adam and Eve, and Noah and his family to replenish the Earth if it had not been plenished before?

[Guest]

35 minutes ago, HAZARD said:

Gen 1:28, And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth,

Great catch HAZARD,

I’d not noticed the word “replenish” before used in some versions. It is the Hebrew word male’ that means “fill.” There’s no indication of “re-“ in any Hebrew text I’ve seen or any context that would indicate a repeat of an action. That is a a prime example of a significant mistranslation found in some versions of the Bible.

To be fair, it is the same form of the word that is used in Noah’s instruction to “fill the earth,” so it is possible to compare those two verses and misinterpret how that word is used.

You’ve made an unspoken point here, though, and that is how often we read scripture and can overlook something that should catch our attention. 

[enoob57]

5 hours ago, HAZARD said:

Sorry, that doesn't cut it. The first use of this word proves that sanctification means separation from profane to a sacred purpose, and that is not limited to the sin question.

Here God told Adam and Eve to go forth and "REPLENISH THE EARTH," just as He told Noah and his family the same thing, to go and replenish the earth.

Gen 1:28, And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Gen 9:1, And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.

Now why would God  tell Adam and Eve, and Noah and his family to replenish the Earth if it had not been plenished before?

sanc·ti·fy

[ˈsaNG(k)təˌfī]

VERB

sanctified (past tense) · sanctified (past participle)

1. set apart as or declare holy; consecrate:

   "a small shrine was built to sanctify the site"

   synonyms: consecrate · bless · make holy · hallow · make sacred · dedicate to God

   • make legitimate or binding by religious sanction:
     "they see their love sanctified by the sacrament of marriage"
     synonyms: approve · sanction · condone · vindicate · endorse · support · back · permit · allow · authorize · legitimize
   • free from sin; purify.
     synonyms: purify · cleanse · free from sin · absolve · unburden · redeem

      

     This is what sanctify means and to the replenish 
     
     Genesis starts with 'In The Beginning' ... The Beginning and you can find no other beginning in The Bible thus you are not Biblically based but other!

      

[HAZARD]

Question?

1. Gen. 1:1, In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2. John 1:1, In he beginning was the Word and the word was with God and the word was God.

Which came first?

The Word, God is an eternal being, always was, always will be. Do people really believe He sat around for eternity past doing nothing and then decided to start creating about 6000 years ago?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, HAZARD said:

Do people really believe He sat around for eternity past doing nothing and then decided to start creating about 6000 years ago?

Your question here invalidates itself.... if you believe God was in eternity past, it wouldn’t matter if He’d started creating 6000 years ago or 6million years ago- He was still in eternity past from any starting point.  He still had an eternity “doing nothing” based on the logic of your question. You could ask that same question based on any starting point. There’s no answer to that because no one knows what His activities were prior to creation...