WHAT IS THE FALLING AWAY

[iamlamad]

4 hours ago, simplejeff said:

Not likely.   Even if it (so-called 'rapture')  is true as you think,  not many - hardly anyone will notice.

I disagree: I think every baby and child up to the age of accountability will go up also. It is harvest time to God and I think He will "harvest" all He can.  If this is true, maybe close to 30% up to 50% of earth's population will suddenly disappear. It will shake the world more than any event ever has. 

[simplejeff]

Do you think contrary to Scripture anything unclean (by YHVH'S JUDGMENT )  will "go up" as you put it< enter heaven ?! >

 

[iamlamad]

2 hours ago, Giller said:

The word harpazo is used to refer to the catching away or rapture, but not the word apostasy.

(Strong's concordance)

(G726
ἁρπάζω
harpazō
har-pad'-zo
From a derivative of G138; to seize (in various applications): - catch (away, up), pluck, pull, take (by force).
Total KJV occurrences: 13)

But the word apostasy means this:

(Strong's concordance)

(G646
ἀποστασία
apostasia
ap-os-tas-ee'-ah
Feminine of the same as G647; defection from truth (properly the state), (“apostasy”): - falling away, forsake.
Total KJV occurrences: 2)

The 2 occurrences that the word Apostasia appears in the new testament, are as follows:

2Th 2:3
(3)  Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
 

And

Act 21:21
(21)  And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs.
 

Forsaking Moses, is talking about a defection, a departing from Moses, but not a type of rapture, or catching away, and God uses the right word for the right thing, he is not a God of confusion.

Now Harpazo is a right word for a catching away or rapture.

And here are old English bibles via the word falling away:

(Bishop's bible)

(2Th 2:3

(3)  Let no man deceaue you by any meanes, for [the Lorde shall not come] excepte there come a fallyng away first, & that that man of sinne be reuealed, the sonne of perdition,)

(Tyndale bible)

(3 Let no ma deceave you by eny meanes for the lorde commeth not excepte ther come a departynge fyrst and that that synfnll man be opened ye sonne of perdicion )

(Wycliffe bible)

(3 [That] No man deceive you in any manner. For but dissension come first [For no but departing away, or dissension, shall come first], and the man of sin be showed, the son of perdition, )

(Geneva bible)

(2Th 2:3

(3)  Let no man deceiue you by any meanes: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sinne be disclosed, euen the sonne of perdition,)

(KJV-1611)

(2Th 2:3

(3)  Let no man deceiue you by any meanes, for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sinne bee reuealed, the sonne of perdition,)

Apo -stasia is a compound Greek word. Did you ever look up each word?

From STrong's: Apo:

of separation

1. of local separation, after verbs of motion from a place i.e. of departing, of fleeing, ...

2. of separation of a part from the whole

   1. where of a whole some part is taken

if that does not describe the rapture, no other words could. OF COURSE at the rapture, from the whole of the world's population, a part will be taken. And they will be taken SO FAST it will seem as if the world is standing still - as in stationary - the second part of Apostasia. In Other words, this word CAN mean "Rapture," or the departing of the church as she is "taken out of the way."

Edited February 20, 2018 by iamlamad

[iamlamad]

10 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Do you think contrary to Scripture anything unclean (by YHVH'S JUDGMENT )  will "go up" as you put it< enter heaven ?! >

 

Children are "innocent." Yes, of course they will go up. Many people who have been to heaven and came back to tell about it have SEEN all the aborted babies in heaven - millions of them. 

[iamlamad]

5 hours ago, Steve_S said:

That is not a localized or even broad context, though. That is taking a predetermined assumption and inserting it as context, instead of the scripture speaking for itself. Apostasia is used two times in the new testament and four times in the septuagint. This is the only time where anyone claims it means "departing" and it's because a developed theological assumption requires it.

The gathering or rapture is indeed the theme of this passage, and the very reason they wrote to Paul. Paul had taught them that the rapture will come before  the Day of the Lord, and then someone came along and told them that they were IN the Day of the Lord. Of course they were upset: I would be too. 

Paul's answer is to explain to them how to know for SURE when one would be IN the day of the Lord: if they see the man of sin enter the temple and be revealed as the Beast, then all will know the DAY has started.

[simplejeff]

5 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Children are "innocent." Yes, of course they will go up. Many people who have been to heaven and came back to tell about it have SEEN all the aborted babies in heaven - millions of them. 

I didn't ask you what children are.  I don't care if you think children are innocent or not.

I asked you if you think anything unclean, by YHVH'S JUDGMENT,  will enter heaven ?

[iamlamad]

2 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

I didn't ask you what children are.  I don't care if you think children are innocent or not.

I asked you if you think anything unclean, by YHVH'S JUDGMENT,  will enter heaven ?

You can answer your own question: children GO TO HEAVEN.

 

To answer, God must regenerate their spirit on the way up.  nothing unclean will EVER get into heaven.

Edited February 20, 2018 by iamlamad

[simplejeff]

5 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

To answer, God must regenerate their spirit on the way up.  nothing unclean will EVER get into heaven.

"God" never says He will regenerate their spirit on the way up.  No,  not ever.  Yes, nothing unclean will EVER get into heaven.   GOD says if the parents are not believers,  at least one of them,  the children ARE UNCLEAN.   Not without hope,  but they must have faith, repent, to be saved.  NOT possible after they die.

[iamlamad]

6 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

His coming , our gathering unto Him and The laying down of wrath.     ALL A ONE TIME EVENT . 

The coming of the Lord is a one time event .     Men , I know they teach otherwise.  

 

You can believe that if you want - God gives us a free will to believe anything - no matter how preposterous. 

However, you are right: He will come pretrib FOR His saints - a ONE TIME event and His second coming.  He will return to earth again WITH His saints, and it too will be a one time event. It will be His third coming. 

Can you explain how you are going to get to heaven for the marriage?

[iamlamad]

Just now, simplejeff said:

"God" never says He will regenerate their spirit on the way up.  No,  not ever.  Yes, nothing unclean will EVER get into heaven.   GOD says if the parents are not believers,  at least one of them,  the children ARE UNCLEAN.   Not without hope,  but they must have faith, repent, to be saved.  NOT possible after they die.

I simply disagree. There are many things God does and will do that is not specifically written. And as I said, many people testify of having seen millions of aborted babies in heaven. I don't believe they are lying or making up stories.