INDULGENCES

[Patrick Miron]

17 hours ago, Concretecamper said:

Not sure what happened by I didn't quote what you attributed to me.

SORRY,

 

I don't understand how that happened

 

God Bless you,

Patrick

[Patrick Miron]

10 hours ago, Alan Hales said:

[1]Jesus wasn't speaking to Catholics, in Jn 20: 19--25, He was speaking to His people.

[2] No man can remit sins, What Jesus was saying Is, ANY Christian can tell a repented person that their sins have been remitted.

Jesus said it's when a person repents that their sins are remitted, NOT when a man remits them. You Catholics take ONE out of context verse to build your false doctrines on.

[3]You take out of context with the New Testament scriptures to build your erroneous doctrines, on.

We are in New Testament times now, Not under the Old Testament rules.

There s no New testament teaching of the erroneous sacrament of penance. The Catholics  taught penance in the 4th century. Catholics have there own Un-Biblical rules, laws and doctrines that bring bondage to there people.

 

Okee-Dokee, if you say so

God Bless you friend

Patrick

 

[Patrick Miron]

5 hours ago, Billiards Ball said:

Respectfully, the word "indulgence" contains the word "indulge", in sin, and there is "no more offering for sin [besides the Christ]".

Dear friend, I TRULY am grateful for your thoughtful reply.

PLEASE do yourself a favor and look up the lengthy and evidenced response I made on this topic eariler.

I'm 74 and not in great health, and have neither the energy of the time to keep repeating myself.

May Jesus guide our life paths,

Patrick

[Billiards Ball]

49 minutes ago, Patrick Miron said:

Dear friend, I TRULY am grateful for your thoughtful reply.

PLEASE do yourself a favor and look up the lengthy and evidenced response I made on this topic eariler.

I'm 74 and not in great health, and have neither the energy of the time to keep repeating myself.

May Jesus guide our life paths,

Patrick

Hello Patrick,

The Isaiah key is fulfilled in Revelation, where Jesus has the master key as described. I read your thoughtful notes on authority of the RCC and etc. but there is a bottom line (as I've found reading Catholic doctrine books stamped with the imprimatur of the Index of the Holy See, and therefore, official, binding Catholic doctrine):

1. The Roman gospel is different, works and faith, not just simple trust in Christ

2. Tradition trumps scripture in the Roman system, numerous scriptures warn of this practice

Thanks.

[Patrick Miron]

1 hour ago, Billiards Ball said:

Hello Patrick,

The Isaiah key is fulfilled in Revelation, where Jesus has the master key as described. I read your thoughtful notes on authority of the RCC and etc. but there is a bottom line (as I've found reading Catholic doctrine books stamped with the imprimatur of the Index of the Holy See, and therefore, official, binding Catholic doctrine):

1. The Roman gospel is different, works and faith, not just simple trust in Christ

2. Tradition trumps scripture in the Roman system, numerous scriptures warn of this practice

Thanks.

Thank you so much.

Salvation is a lifetime TEST.  {Isa. 43: 7 & 21}

Other than Christian Baptism, I can think of no other single act; single belief that by itself can {or does} have the power or authority to insure one’s {anyone’s} salvation. {The Sacrament of Final Anointing; similar to Baptism, includes as the NORM, Sacramental Confession; and like Baptism does also removes ALL Temporal Punishment as well is actually several actions inter connected.}

Sacred Tradition Does not so much “Trump” Scripture as act as confirmation of it. That said though the Catholic Church is a Church Of the Bible. There ought not to be contradictions when both are rightly understood.

An Imprimatur in and of itself does not make a book “OFFICIAL” Catholic Doctrine. Rather it is assurance that what it teaches and contains conforms with the Catholic Ordinary Magisterium.

God Bless you friend,

Patrick

[Billiards Ball]

7 minutes ago, Patrick Miron said:

Thank you so much.

Salvation is a lifetime TEST.  {Isa. 43: 7 & 21}

Other than Christian Baptism, I can think of no other single act; single belief that by itself can {or does} have the power or authority to insure one’s {anyone’s} salvation. {The Sacrament of Final Anointing; similar to Baptism, includes as the NORM, Sacramental Confession; and like Baptism does also removes ALL Temporal Punishment as well is actually several actions inter connected.}

Sacred Tradition Does not so much “Trump” Scripture as act as confirmation of it. That said though the Catholic Church is a Church Of the Bible. There ought not to be contradictions when both are rightly understood.

An Imprimatur in and of itself does not make a book “OFFICIAL” Catholic Doctrine. Rather it is assurance that what it teaches and contains conforms with the Catholic Ordinary Magisterium.

God Bless you friend,

Patrick

Hi, salvation is not a test, else Christ lied in saying whoever trusts Him will never perish. Both testaments agree, trust I God is the key.

[Mike Mclees]

4 hours ago, Patrick Miron said:

Thanks friend for sharing you're  thoughts

Patrick

Im willing share the truth any time. May the Lord help you to see it .

[Robert William]

On 4/10/2018 at 11:12 PM, KiwiChristian said:

INDULGENCES.

Definition: A person after confessing his sins to a priest, in order to be free from the punishment still due for his sins, requires the church to pray for his rehabilitation. 

The person must do penance works such as fasting, making pilgrimages, giving money, making prayers or inflicting pain on oneself, as a penalty for sins committed.

Historically, people found it easier to pay money to the Roman Catholic church than to pray for long hours. The Roman Catholic church preferred money because the Pope ran out of cash in building St Peter’s Basilica in Rome. So the Roman Catholic church issued the person with an official statement that he had received release from the penalties through the payment of money. This document was called an indulgence. They could be bought for
friends and relatives who had died and passed into purgatory, thus shortening the time that they would have to spend there.

Martin Luther objected to Tetzel, a Catholic indulgence seller, who publicly announced to people that if they put a coin in a box, a dead relative's soul would immediately pop out of purgatory. His advertising slogan was: "As the coin in you pop, a soul from purgatory doth hop."

Answer: Obviously, this teaching cannot be found in the Bible. After Word War II, the Archbishop of Winnipeg asked mothers who had sons killed in the war, to pay $40 to have masses said on behalf of their sons to guarantee their salvation and entrance to heaven.
This practice continues in many parts of the world, and accounts 
for the great wealth of the Catholic church as seen in the big cathedrals it builds.

Which Bible verses forbid indulgence selling?

1. Jesus warns against this practice in Matthew 23:14, a verse that Catholics have cut out of modern Bible versions. "Woe unto you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For ye devour widows houses, and for a pretense make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation."

The Pharisees of Jesus' day, as well as Catholic priests of today, tell widows that their dead husband has gone to purgatory. They ask her if she wants him to go to heaven.

If yes, she will have to pay the priest to say a mass to pray for his soul to leave purgatory. Widows don't usually have much money, so he tells her to sell her house to pay for it. This is how widows houses are devoured by priests who for a pretense make long prayers.

2. The Israelites were forbidden to give money for the dead. "None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him." Psalms 49:7. No gift of money can save another person. Only the blood of Christ can.

3. Peter says: "Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold ... but with the precious blood of Christ." 1 Peter 1:18,19. Nobody is redeemed with indulgence money.

4. Simon the sorcerer offered the apostles money so that anyone that he laid hands on would receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 
Peter rebuked him strongly in Acts 8:20-23 saying: "Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the GIFT OF
GOD may be purchased with money. Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God. Repent therefore of this thy wickedness."

Salvation is the gift of God that each of us must claim freely for ourselves when we call on Christ to be our Saviour. No baptism, eucharist, confessional to a priest, penance, extreme unction, or paying money can save us, only faith in Christ's precious saving blood to pay for our sins.

Indulgences are just a deceptive lying way of earning more money.

Just the very thought of Romanites teaching that their traditions are equal to scripture is blasphemous!

[Mike Mclees]

It apereas as a narcissistic order intent on vanity of authority exalting itself as the  worlds priest and vicar  for God.   

[Concretecamper]

4 hours ago, Billiards Ball said:

2. Tradition trumps scripture in the Roman system, numerous scriptures warn of this practice

Tradition does not trump scripture.  Scripture is born of Tradition so they do not differ at all.

Tradition may differ from your interpretation of scripture, but that is your problem.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Concretecamper