Permitting Muslim Abuse of Tommy Robinson

[Guest shiloh357]

4 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

You keep making this about me, but I have proven with 100% certainty that frontpagemag lied, so why do you continue to put so much faith into sites like frontpagemag when they have been proven beyond a shadow of doubt to be liars? Regardless of your opinion about me and the sources I provided, why can't you just answer the question? 

Again, as others point out, you promote websites that lie about Trump, lie about Islam, lie about Israel that promote the lies of anti-Zionism. You have not proven any websites to be "liars."   So frankly, most of us here don't see you as someone who cares about the truth.   You only care about protecting Islam from criticism and none of the sites you consider credible tell the truth about Islam.     So frankly, because we know that the websites you call reliable do lie, you don't really have the moral authority to lecture us about which sites we should or should not post from.    We are not listening to you about what websites we should use. It's really that simple.

[Guest shiloh357]

9 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

I have proven frontpagemag and gatestone Institute liars on three different stories using solid evidence in past threads. Why is it so difficult for you to answer that question? I will make it easier. Based on the evidence against frontpagemag's story about a Christian genocide taking place in the Philippines, did frontpagemag lie? Yes or no? 

No, you simply use websites you trust to discredit the ones you don't like.   That doesn't prove that they are liars.   Again, you support websites that lie about Trump and Israel, so you really aren't interested in truth.   You are interested only in running interference for Islam to protect it from criticism and any site that does such is condemned by you.  I am not the only one that notices it.  The list of sites you rattled off earlier, are pretty much left wing sites and that tells me all I need to know.   

[Guest PinkBelt]

1 hour ago, Badjao33 said:

I have proven frontpagemag and gatestone Institute liars on three different stories using solid evidence in past threads. Why is it so difficult for you to answer that question? I will make it easier. Based on the evidence against frontpagemag's story about a Christian genocide taking place in the Philippines, did frontpagemag lie? Yes or no? 

What are you trying to achieve by arguing with these people?

[Guest PinkBelt]

7 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

I would hope they would recognize these sites for what they are and stop sharing links to them. These sites intentionally distort the truth and are deceiving our brothers and sisters in Christ. 

Well that won't happen no matter what you say or can prove. Arguing is not a good witness and is bad for your spirit.

 

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-7xBv80kvOzo/USPPbijTg-I/AAAAAAAAAIg/EQmUcaNelUI/s1600/Internet_argument.jpg

Edited August 5, 2018 by PinkBelt

[Guest shiloh357]

1 hour ago, Badjao33 said:

I understand and that is a valid point. While I also agree that arguing among believers is not the best thing for our personal witness, sharing lies like the example I gave in this thread and others, and using sources that tell such lies makes the entire Church look foolish to the unbelieving world and harms our witness to Christ to them. I find that to be a far bigger issue than arguing/debating among one another. If we don't point out the lies and expose them, then they will continue to run rampant. As ambassadors of Christ, we are literally representatives of Truth and need to point out such blatant error. 

Another thing I have a problem with is how these sites exploit the suffering of others to promote their agendas. Take the frontpagemag story I have used in this thread for example. They are not only attempting to make Muslims look bad, they are also falsely claiming that Christians were the victims when they weren't.

Muslims Ethnically Cleanse 60,000 Christians in the Philippines? Really? Everyone in this country knows that isn't true and while there was a very small percentage of victims who were Christians, the vast majority (90-95%) were Muslims and Animists. The people in this country know the truth of what happened in 2013, so how do you think they would view the west and Christians from the west who share such lies or use websites that make such ridiculous claims as sources if they found out they were using them? It makes us all look bad and this is the point I am trying to get across.

 

You support other sites that lie all of the time.   It's just that they tell the lies you don't really have a problem with.   As long as they are anti-Israel, anti-Semitic, anti-Trump and spew those kinds of lies, you consider those sites "reliable."    So you are not really worried about the truth.

Anti-Zionism is a pack of lies, but you are anti-Zionist and you promote those lies, so really don't have the moral authority you think belongs to you.  You don't have the authority to lecture us about truth and what Christians should do so long as you promote the racism of anti-Semitism and the lies that come with that vile perspective.  An anti-Zionist is NOT an ambassador for Christ.

So, we will just keep pointing out the lies that you promote and that continue to run rampant against Israel and president Trump.

[Guest shiloh357]

20 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

This is only your opinion of me based on your interpretation of scripture and your political views. 

No, it is based on truth.   Anti-Zionism is racism and promotes racism against Jews.  Even if we were to remove the Bible from the equation, anti-Zionism is a vile, racist view.

Unfortunately, is the only form of racism in our world that is socially acceptable.   And it is the only form of racism that has become theologically acceptable.

[Guest shiloh357]

6 hours ago, Badjao33 said:

I fully support the state of Israel's right to exist and I support it's people. I just don't support the current policies that the Israeli government has against non-Jewish citizens and the people in Gaza and the West bank. How is that position promoting racism? There are also plenty of Israeli Jewish citizens who share the same position as I do on the issue. 

Anti‑Semitism/Zionism and criticism of Israel's policies are not the same.  That would be like saying someone is anti-American because they don't support all of the American governments's policies. 

First of all criticism of Israel's policies is not anti-Zionism.  Criticizing the policies of the Israeli government is a favorite past time of Israelis.  So that is not what anti-Zionism is.  

Zionism is:

• The National Liberation movement of the Jewish People.
• It is the modern expression of the ancient longing by the Jewish People to return to their land and live as a free people once again.
• It is the desire to secure a modern state for the Jewish nation. It is the conviction that the Jewish people have the right to live in freedom and security in its homeland.
•  It is the determination to aid and encourage the return of any and all Jewish refugees of the Diaspora who wish to return home.
• It is the concern for the safety and security of that modern state, and the desire to see it strong enough to defend itself and the Jewish people as a whole from any present or future existential threat.

Zionism is about the existence of Israel and its right to exist as a nation and as an equal member of the community of nations.   Anti-Zionism is the denial of that right.      If those above bulleted items were denied to any other people, it would be considered racism.   But when Jews are denied those things, it suddenly isn't "racist." 

Zionism is not about the Israeli government's policies.   The Israeli government has no policies that aim at persecuting or abusing/mistreating the Palestinians whatsoever.   The Palestinians are part of an Arab war of attrition against Israel's existence.   

You don't get to redefine anti-Zionism to mask the racism that is inherent in it.   

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Badjao33 said:

Exactly. That's why I'm not an anti-Zionist. 

Which is a lie.

[Guest PinkBelt]

10 hours ago, Badjao33 said:

I understand and that is a valid point. While I also agree that arguing among believers is not the best thing for our personal witness, sharing lies like the example I gave in this thread and others, and using sources that tell such lies makes the entire Church look foolish to the unbelieving world and harms our witness to Christ to them. I find that to be a far bigger issue than arguing/debating among one another. If we don't point out the lies and expose them, then they will continue to run rampant. As ambassadors of Christ, we are literally representatives of Truth and need to point out such blatant error. 

Another thing I have a problem with is how these sites exploit the suffering of others to promote their agendas. Take the frontpagemag story I have used in this thread for example. They are not only attempting to make Muslims look bad, they are also falsely claiming that Christians were the victims when they weren't which glosses over the plight of those who were the actual victims of this atrocity.

Muslims Ethnically Cleanse 60,000 Christians in the Philippines? Really? Everyone in this country knows that isn't true and while there was a very small percentage of victims who were Christians, the vast majority (90-95%) were Muslims and Animists. The people in this country know the truth of what happened in 2013, so how do you think they would view the west and Christians from the west who share such lies or use websites that make such ridiculous claims as sources if they found out they were using them? It makes us all look bad and this is the point I am trying to get across.

This frontpagemag story is just one of many I have pointed out in the past on this forum, so it is not just an isolated problem. Unfortunately it is widespread and the problem needs to be addressed. If people in the unbelieving world start associating the Church with such sites because Christians use them as sources to support their arguments, then the Church will begin to loose its credibility at a time in history when the unbelieving world needs to see the Truth more than ever.  

When we as believers begin accepting lies and false facts as truth from sites like frontpagemag rather than exposing them for it, we drive a wedge between us and the people we are supposed to be reaching out to and it becomes a major stumbling block for the gospel

Unfortunately frontpagemag has been used as a source 185 times on this forum. 

 

"Whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things... (Love) does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth” (Philippians 4:8)(1 Corinthians 13:6)

You have already pointed it out and rather than move on you are consumed with arguing until you "win". At some point you have to learn to let people be wrong and trust others to have good judgement. The church has already lost it's credibility because of the odious, anti-Christian behavior of "Christians", not because some website is fibbing. 

 

I have learned that there is a huge difference between a person who is wrong because of misinformation and someone who is wrong because they are filled with hate. Misinformation can be corrected, however hate clouds judgement and corrupts ones thinking. Arguing with those types is a waste of energy because they will never ever admit they're wrong and fighting with them actually makes them more entrenched in their views. I've been to the middle east also and I know a lot of what gets said by certain people here is total bunk, but I'm not gonna waste my time braying back an forth with people who cannot take on board what's being said.

Either you think people who might surf through these forums are not bright enough to do their own critical thinking when seeing these types of "sources" or this is really just about your ego and trying to "win" an argument.

[Steve_S]

This one has ran its course, locked.