Mid Trib rapture anyone?

[JohnD]

15 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

First, God knows where the 70th week will begin in Revelation, and He gives that wisdom to people who ask. I know where the 70th week begins. The entire 70th week is "marked" (His word, not mine) with 7's: it begins with the 7th seal, and ends with the 7th vial - and the exact midpoint is marked with the 7th trumpet. 

Yes, when the sacrifices are forced to end - because of the abomination event - all will know that the MIDPOINT has come: the week has been divided into two halves. It is not very difficult to find that spot either, for Jesus told those in Judea to flee the moment they see the abomination - and we see that fleeing in Rev. 12:6. Therefore that verse is only a second or two after the abomination. (We must allow for some reaction time.)

If you read carefully, Daniel 12:11 is NOT a "from / to" statement. There is no "to."  IN CONTEXT the "to" is understood to be "the end of these wonders." Verse 11 gives us TWO starting points, not a start and an end. In other words, the daily sacrifice will be stopped at the moment the abomination is set up.  Daniel was told the first time that the "end of these wonders" would be 3.5 years.  Daniel did not understand, so another time was given: an extra 30 days.  This is not so diffcult, for we have the book of Revelation that Daniel did not have. The WEEK ends at the 1260 day mark, but the man of sin turned Beast will not be caught and taken until 30 days later.  In Revelation the week ends on the 1260th day at the pouring out of the 7th vial and John wrote, "it is done." One translation says "it is finished." But notice in Revelation that is in chapter 16 and Jesus does not return to capture the Beast until chapter 16 - and there will be EVENTS between.  It seems then, Daniel gives us a strong hint that from the end of the week to His coming for Armageddon, there will be 30 days between. I suggest that 30 days is taken up with the marriage and supper in heaven. 

1290 days from the end (of human history) the Temple sacrifices will be abated.   You are counting backwards; Daniel was counting forwards from the midpoint. Daniel added 30 days to the 1260 days. The reason is simple: Jesus does not return on the last day of the 70th week. 

Counting back from the end 2520 days will determine  Again, You are counting backwards; Daniel was counting forwards.

By the way, this means your chart is myth and error. 

Okay. What are the seals?

Hitler?

World War?

The advent of telecommunications?

You will find the interpretation of these and the bowls applied to may subjective interpretations and opinions throughout history since John penned the Apocalypse. 

Some thought the Protestant Reformation was one of the seals being opened.

Personally I believe (but am not dogmatic about it) that Constantine was the riider on a white horse with a bow and no arrows. 

No doubt the seals and the bowls will align with the events centered on the defiling of the Tribulation Temple, but rather than being indicative prophecies, they appear (to me) to be affirmative / authentication prophecies.

The Temple is God's time piece on planet Earth ever since Solomon (with David's help) went against God's original design not to build one*.

Zechariah 6:12–13 (AV)
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:
13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.

Matthew 16:18 (AV)
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

1 Corinthians 3:16 (AV)
16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

* 2 Samuel 7:12–13 (AV)
12 And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom.
13 He shall build an house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever.

But just like the monarch (1 Samuel 8 )  God condescended to grant the people their wishes and to deal with them through that format / venue from that point on. 

Note in its dedication Solomon broke nearly every Levitical law for sacrificing to the LORD. And there is no mention of the Temple in:

Hebrews 8:5 (AV)
5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

 

 

 

[JohnD]

10 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

People will know when the week begins by when the trumpet judgments begin. They will be hard to miss. You are right, people can count backwards from the abomination event and point to a date on a calendar. 

When the Tribulation Temple is built, we can know the 70th Week has begun.  Show us scripture to back this up. It is very possible they will build the temple before the 70th week begins.

Hiroshima?

Nagasaki?

[iamlamad]

12 hours ago, The Light said:

So the rider on the white that carries a bow is Jesus? Sorry but Jesus carries the sword of the spirit. 

Secondly you pay absolutely no attention to what I am saying. Your comment about the 70th week being about the Jews And not the church is correct and if you read anything that I am posting you would know that’s what I’m saying. The church is raptured pretribulation.which of course is before any seals are opened. 

I did not say Jesus is the rider. How on earth do you come up with this? The white horse and rider represent the CHURCH with the GOSPEL. No one knows what the bow without arrows represents, (unless God tells them) for John does not explain. However, when we go by CONTEXT, this white horse and rider can be nothing else BUT the church with the gospel. The context proves a 32 AD event. 

You are right, I pay very little attention to myth. Now, if you quite a scripture, I will pay very close attention to see what you SAY about that scripture.  

You are mistaken again about the seals. I suggest you camp out on chapters 4 & 5 and learn the context of this first seal. Did you know that John used the color white 17 times - and 16 of those 17 was to represent RIGHTEOUSNESS? Think about it! 

[iamlamad]

Just now, JohnD said:

Hiroshima?

Nagasaki?

Have you researched "wormwood?" Do you know what happened at Chernobyl? 

[JohnD]

26 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Myth.  Rapture Pretrib is truth. Midtrib is when Satan loses and Jesus gains the kingdoms of the world back again to the rightful owner. Posttrib rapture is for the Old Covenant saints - not seen by John so not written. 

Pre"trib" means pre-70th week. It is what Paul teaches and John proves.

As I stated repeatedly, the Bible (not myth) divides the 70th Week in two (1260 days, 42 months, time, times, and half a time).

I also invite you to read carefully what Paul actually wrote in 2 Thessalonians  2:1-4 (and even to verse 11). That the coming of the Lord Jesus and our gathering to him will NOT precede the revealing of the lawless one.

 

[iamlamad]

Just now, JohnD said:

Okay. What are the seals?

Hitler?

World War?

The advent of telecommunications?

You will find the interpretation of these and the bowls applied to may subjective interpretations and opinions throughout history since John penned the Apocalypse. 

Some thought the Protestant Reformation was one of the seals being opened.

Personally I believe (but am not dogmatic about it) that Constantine was the riider on a white horse with a bow and no arrows. 

No doubt the seals and the bowls will align with the events centered on the defiling of the Tribulation Temple, but rather than being indicative prophecies, they appear (to me) to be affirmative / authentication prophecies.

The Temple is God's time piece on planet Earth ever since Solomon (with David's help) went against God's original design not to build one*.

Zechariah 6:12–13 (AV)
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:
13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.

Matthew 16:18 (AV)
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

1 Corinthians 3:16 (AV)
16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

* 2 Samuel 7:12–13 (AV)
12 And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom.
13 He shall build an house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever.

But just like the monarch (1 Samuel 8 )  God condescended to grant the people their wishes and to deal with them through that format / venue from that point on. 

Note in its dedication Solomon broke nearly every Levitical law for sacrificing to the LORD. And there is no mention of the Temple in:

Hebrews 8:5 (AV)
5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

I am out of time. I have work. But I will answer: the first 5 seals are CHURCH AGE. The church has been waiting for the final church age martyr. 

[JohnD]

Just now, iamlamad said:

I am out of time. I have work. But I will answer: the first 5 seals are CHURCH AGE. The church has been waiting for the final church age martyr. 

Church age?

What scripture?

[JohnD]

2 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Have you researched "wormwood?" Do you know what happened at Chernobyl? 

Um, yeah. But it is a subjective interpretation at best.

The Bible again focuses the time of the last tribulationS on the Jewish Temple.

Wormwood could be an interpretation of the antichrist polluting the nations of the earth.

The star falling from heaven and the waters being many peoples and all.

[iamlamad]

3 hours ago, JohnD said:

Church age?

What scripture?

It is found in the context of the first seal: chapters 4 & 5 prove that Jesus began opening the seals as soon as He ascended - around 32 AD.

[iamlamad]

4 hours ago, JohnD said:

Um, yeah. But it is a subjective interpretation at best.

The Bible again focuses the time of the last tribulationS on the Jewish Temple.

Wormwood could be an interpretation of the antichrist polluting the nations of the earth.

The star falling from heaven and the waters being many peoples and all.

Does a nuke burn up all the grass and destroy trees? Can radiation poison water?  Yes, of course. Agreed: subjective. 

Did you know, people erected an angel sounding a trumpet at Chernobyl.  I think for good reason. 

I am not sure how a nuke could turn water to blood. 

Edited March 27, 2019 by iamlamad