Presidential Voting 2020

[simplejeff]

1 hour ago, Sower said:

Did God not use a deeply flawed man

No.  As noted:  King David was a man after God's Own Heart - quite different from all the recent presidents, politicians, and so forth.   Righteous.  Beloved.  Chosen.  Anointed.  sinned and repented.   Don't go overboard accusing God's anointed..... and then

===================================================

=======And it is not good to trust nor quote a false statement when it is from an opponent of TRUTH >

1 hour ago, Sower said:

Thomas Paine

Two quick excerpts from internet search:

"Thomas Paine on Christianity Thomas Paine makes three primary arguments against Christianity in the opening pages of The Age of Reason: 1) Paine charges that the legends surrounding Jesus, including the Virgin Birth and the Resurrection, are "hearsay upon hearsay.""

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" Modern atheists find a champion in the classic writings of Thomas Paine,"

52 minutes ago, PepperS said:

My conscience says I can vote for either. 

Correct.   This is very good.

52 minutes ago, PepperS said:

Trump was going to win here no matter what I did.

Correct.  In the last two or three or more elections,  it was widely revealed that the number of votes did not matter.

The results were chosen BEFORE the election even started.

Basically God is in Charge,  and God raises up , as God Says in His Word.  It is not man's decision, not even by voting in a wicked system.

[simplejeff]

2 hours ago, Jostler said:

IMO both parties and all candidates are fully owned and controlled by the developing beast system.  Donald Trump is doing exactly what he was installed to do.  That does not mean God is not using him.  But IMO to see him as some divine deliverer is  horrifically flawed, and many Christians do seem to see him that  way.

Yahweh delivered ,  Yahweh did not make someone divine.   Trump is doing exactly what Yahweh knew he would do.    

So it is good to see that Yahweh delivered.   The darkness was put off for a while.  It will come soon enough, in full, more than ever before.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, PepperS said:

Unless you live in a swing state (I don't) the winner of your state election is predetermined. Trump was going to win here no matter what I did.

My congressman is a disgrace. But since I live in a Red State, there is no getting rid of this man who is a republican.

This man is a doctor. While married he had several affairs with women who he got pregnant. He urged each of these women to get abortions. When his own wife became pregnant, he urged her to get an abortion as well. But since he runs on the republican ticket, there is no getting rid of him.

So here's the problem, My choice is a democrat or this man who has affairs and then covers them up with abortion. 

My conscience says I can vote for either. 

I think the real problem is both the east and west coast states want to rule the rest of the country imposing there lack of morals on the rest of us.

[other one]

On ‎2‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 6:47 PM, Willa said:

1.  It's nobody's business.  That is why we have secret ballots.

2.  I am so sick of politics and the pathetic conduct of the progressives that I avoid the subject.  Not good for blood pressure.

3.  Tired of solicitation for republican campaign which come several times a day in spite of call block, so I am fed up with the lot of them.  

Satan, the father of lies, has been hard at work.

My phone calls have cycled to getting extended warranties on my 2006 chevy with 150,000 miles on it and a 95 Silverado with 200,000 miles on it...   when I feel like playing with them I'll go along with them and ask what it will cost.....   when they find out what I'm driving they promise me they won't call back....   but they do..

[SavedByGrace1980]

On 2/26/2019 at 11:20 PM, Jostler said:

IMO both parties and all candidates are fully owned and controlled by the developing beast system.  Donald Trump is doing exactly what he was installed to do.  That does not mean God is not using him.  But IMO to see him as some divine deliverer is  horrifically flawed, and many Christians do seem to see him that  way.

I believe God is using him to expose a LOT of the truly demonic things that have  taken over and characterize  our  government now.  We are a republic in name only and one of the biggest deceptions is the belief our votes matter at all.  They don't.  The system has been long past any real representation of the will of the people...long past.

I think God is working out  many of His  purposes through the  Trump administration.  As He did through Obama's.   And every other President or world leader.

He has a history of judging and disciplining His own people THROUGH the actions of some of the  most Godless nations  and kings.  But their ultimate judgement is not sleeping.  Even if the  Lord uses them  where His will and their schemes align, it does not mean He approves them.

Some years ago I heard Steve Quayle make a statement that INSTANTLY rang off in my spirit and identified the statement as coming from Him.  Steve  said God told him

"I will reveal the  sins of the  politicians to the people, and the sins  of the people before a holy God"

Trump is going to be  (has been already  to a degree) His agent for revealing the sins of the politicians, and I'm willing to bet the revelation will get far out  of hand compared  to  what  these world government elites really want to see.

Judgement is coming to this nation, and discipline, a severe wake  up  call to His own within her.  Trump will be used  to usher that in. 

 

 

Well stated.

I'm curious however about the first phrase I bolded, above:

Is it your opinion that he was put in place by (for want of a better term) "the deep state"?  If so, you and I may diverge slightly there but that's okay.  In the end, all we hold are opinions which can not always be proven. 

I happen to think that Mr. Trump's election came as a surprise to (what I call) the ruling class.  That to me is evidenced by the level of ferocity and hatred toward him exhibited by the entire D party, a sizable portion of the R party, and the entire mainstream media (save for Fox News and talk radio).  Add to that the entertainment media and most of academia. I'm old enough to have lived through the Reagan and even the Nixon administrations.  While those men were hated by the 'intelligentsia" as well (Nixon's wounds were largly self-inflicted due to his paranoia), I don't believe the hatred then was anywhere near the level we're seeing now.

I  liked what you wrote in the second phrase I bolded - I've pretty much said the same thing for years:  "We're past the point where elections matter".

Our founders were believers in IDEALS - not necessarily men.  In fact, they knew how corruptible mankind was.  They wanted no part of a "king" (i.e. a celebrity cult figure). The Constitution and the set of laws it put in place was supposed to prevent that.  We were supposed to be a nation of laws; not men.

But it really didn't last long. A litany of larger than life presidents attest to the fact that it seems to be a flaw of human nature to want to 'worship' men rather than ideals. One can argue that men like Lincoln, FDR, JFK, Reagan, Obama and now Trump did many positive (or negative) things.  But some of these men did what they did contrary to The Constitution.

And once the Constitution was breached the first time, it became easier and easier to ignore it when it suited an agenda.

I used to comment frequently on politics; now, not so much.  First I find few people beyond the "well, when MY guy (or gal) gets in, things will be different" variety.  Or it's the "when my party wins" variation.  

Both parties (I refer to them as the 'D and R branches' of the ruling party) are corrupt.  In fact, with few exceptions, I believe the entire government is corrupt. One needs to look no further than the size of the national debt. So, in my mind, thinking the government can be fixed by elections is akin to believing a rusted hulk of a car can be fixed by a coat of paint.

Governments and nations and come and gone over the millennia - I suspect eventually the USA will follow suit.  But that said, I (as a Christian) have Great Hope.

And I - like you - believe that God has His plan and it is being worked out.  PTL!

Blessings,

-Ed

 

 

 

 

[Jostler]

18 hours ago, SavedByGrace1981 said:

And I - like you - believe that God has His plan and it is being worked out.  PTL!

Blessings,

-Ed

 

I'm going to bounce off your post just because I enjoy the discussion, while also admitting it's an opinion    I do believe Trump to be a deep state plant.  I can point to the day the decision to dump Hillary was made.  It was obvious in the stock market.  And long before the election.

This is kind of a long story, and in no way proof, but just an explanation of how I got to where I am with it.  I'd noticed one time when Jesus rebuked the Scribes and Pharisees for their inability to discern the "signs of the  times".   Here they were the stewards and guardians  of the Word and they  couldn't see the Messiah standing right in front of them, when of ALL people on earth they  HAD the evidence. 

Quote

Mat 16:2-3

He answered and said to them, “When it is evening you say, ‘It will be fair weather, for the sky is red’; and in the morning, ‘It will be foul weather today, for the sky is red and threatening.’ Hypocrites! You know how to discern the face of the sky, but you cannot discern the signs of the times.

 

But Jesus basically told them "If you can see the  sky red at morning, you can guess it'll be a rainy day and be right.  You see a red sky at night  and know it'll probably be a sunny day tomorrow.  If you can tell the weather by  those signs, you got  no excuse for not seeing Me."  The implication being discerning prophetic  "signs of the times" is easier than predicting the weather, for those that have the Word.

So I asked Him how  I could avoid earning that same rebuke and asked for understanding of the  signs of the times.  Did I get it?  Well....that remains to be seen.  But based on His faithfulness alone I bet I can see better than if I had not asked    That still doesn't say I got it right  

But, the reasoning goes that if this beast system is intending to institute one world government (and of course that's exactly  what it's preparing for - not much controversy there I don't think.)  Then my question was "What is the BIGGEST hurdle now standing in the way  of that goal?"

My answer was "national sovereignty".   As far as we've fallen as a nation, I don't think you  could convince the  average American to willingly submit to a foreign government run by people that cared nothing for our culture, didn't even speak the  same language, and over whom we had no real control....could neither elect nor depose.

So,  if you're the beast you got three options I can think of.

1.) Military  overthrow which I submit is nearly impossible, and far beyond the current capabilities of the current state of the beast system,

2.) a coup of some sort ending up with a head of state willing to submit to this world ruler when he appears.  But  that presents the  same problem.  If it was a coup that resulted in a dictator with  the power to submit the whole nation to the  beast, I can't imagine Joe Sixpack standing idly by for that either.  We have WAY too many guns.

3.) OR...they could create a problem/reaction/solution situation that will end up making people BEG for what "they" have wanted all along.  And  anyone who has studied their methods already knows that Hegelian dialectic is one of their FAVORITE tactics.

Assuming my identification of the biggest roadblock is correct, then obviously the two nations that MUST go are the US and Russia.  Both are military superpowers and between the two control some 90% of the nuclear weapons in existence.  Neither could be overcome militarily by the  current "deep state - international globalist elite - beast system".

The utter destruction of both  the military might and economic dominance of both nations is a must.   China is an economic superpower now, and they are developing their military  VERY rapidly, but to date, they are not a global threat.  They have men in abundance but little in the way of ability to move them world wide in significant numbers and even less ability to maintain supply lines to  keep them in beans and bullets for a long term, high  intensity conflict.   I suspect China is where the elites will hide their wealth while Russia and most of the modern West are brought to heel.  They have a few more years before dealing with China will be a necessity.  India is  in a similar situation but still a ways behind even  China.

I am probably boring people to death.  This is turning into a book

But, Trump is doing his part to provoke Russia, Iran, NK  and  China while literally alienating every European nation  we've relied on as allies for a hundred years.  If it comes to  a Russia and allies showdown with the US, we will not have any allies left.  They'll be standing back saying "About time the  arrogant bastards got their due..."  and happily looking forward to buying Russian energy.   He's pretending to be all pro-life when he never has been til he got political.  He's pushing the homosexual agenda on other countries that still criminalize homosexual activity via threat of economic sanctions.  He's appointed two Jesuit Supreme Court Justices which  now gives the  Vatican veto power over anything that comes before the court.  They can  get any  ruling they want  now (the Vatican). 

I DO think some of the  left/right combat is real, but I believe it's the result of two FACTIONS fighting each  other for the highest seats in the coming global government.  The same factional infighting has  been visible in the Catholic hierarchy in the past two years.  What I perceive is happening there is based on the understanding that when the  global government comes, a lot of satan's current servants will be just so much dead weight.  He won't need near as many people in high  places so letting them eat each  other serves two  purposes.  It reduces the  number of people expecting to feed at his trough, and it identifies which  organization  is the  craftiest, most underhanded and vile.  I think he's like an evil, drunk father sitting  around drinking with his friends while making his 8 and 9 year old sons fight each other while he and his friends bet on the outcome.  But as I said, I don't believe this is  righteousness vs. wickedness.  I think it's factional infighting to see who gets the power and benefits in the  next phase.

I'll quit there     I could go on for ages but won't unless someone is actually interested

Edited March 2, 2019 by Jostler

[Guest PinkBelt]

I hope Bernie Sanders runs, I will vote for him if I can.

[Debp]

13 hours ago, PinkBelt said:

I hope Bernie Sanders runs, I will vote for him if I can.

President Trump is hoping Sanders will get the nomination, too, I have read, as he will be easy to beat.   Sanders is a Socialist....seeing the problems and eventual downfall of Socialistic countries such as Venezuela, I wouldn't vote for Sanders.   Venezuela has had a Socialistic government since 1999.   People are starving and fleeing the country if they are able to.

 

 

[Guest PinkBelt]

10 hours ago, Debp said:

President Trump is hoping Sanders will get the nomination, too, I have read, as he will be easy to beat.   Sanders is a Socialist....seeing the problems and eventual downfall of Socialistic countries such as Venezuela, I wouldn't vote for Sanders.   Venezuela has had a Socialistic government since 1999.   People are starving and fleeing the country if they are able to.

 

 

Please stop watching Fox news. There is a reason they are obsessing over bringing up Venezuela and not talking about the Scandinavian countries. Venezuela, unlike all the other countries you don't hear about is run by a corrupt wannabe dictator. I am a capitalist but I also believe in social programs to end poverty and improve life. Bernie Sanders would have won the election against Trump as he had far better support then Clinton, and she beat Trump be three million votes.

[Debp]

44 minutes ago, PinkBelt said:

Please stop watching Fox news. There is a reason they are obsessing over bringing up Venezuela and not talking about the Scandinavian countries. Venezuela, unlike all the other countries you don't hear about is run by a corrupt wannabe dictator. I am a capitalist but I also believe in social programs to end poverty and improve life. Bernie Sanders would have won the election against Trump as he had far better support then Clinton, and she beat Trump be three million votes.

I don't watch Fox news....I don't have cable TV. 

 

https://www.austriancenter.com/shattering-myth-nordic-socialism/