So called immigration to USA

[ayin jade]

6 hours ago, Neighbor said:

And as to languages, I don't see that speaking English is an answer to a problem of poverty and desperation. Language barriers have been with us for quite some time- since Babylon was broken up  by God I guess.

Even English speaking lands have trouble agreeing on  English language. The New Amsterdam  maritime convention is testimony to the problems of even a common language in contracts.

Seems to me that it is more than the irritation of hearing Korean jibber jabber in the grocery store that needs be resolved.  If all the immigrants spoke pristine American English ( If that even exists ) there would still be the same problem of desperate American English speaking people rushing toward the borders and seeking to get to the interior of the USA.

 Ha- If all  immigrants spoke pristine American English, then they would be at WalMart making fun of my Bostonesse accent and I suppose my  clothing attire too.

Language barriers are a problem though. It is a hardship to try to get a job for a us citizen when the requirement on many of the jobs one wants is "must speak spanish". That is a reality my hubby faced last year when he was trying to get a job, before he had to stop when I got cancer. 

[Guest PinkBelt]

Exodus 22:21

You shall not wrong a sojourner or oppress him, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt.

Leviticus 19:33-34

When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

Malachi 3:5

“Then I will draw near to you for judgment. I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, against the adulterers, against those who swear falsely, against those who oppress the hired worker in his wages, the widow and the fatherless, against those who thrust aside the sojourner, and do not fear me, says the Lord of hosts.

 

[ayin jade]

1 hour ago, PinkBelt said:

Exodus 22:21

You shall not wrong a sojourner or oppress him, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt.

Leviticus 19:33-34

When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

Malachi 3:5

“Then I will draw near to you for judgment. I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, against the adulterers, against those who swear falsely, against those who oppress the hired worker in his wages, the widow and the fatherless, against those who thrust aside the sojourner, and do not fear me, says the Lord of hosts.

 

If you read it within its context, those passages also specifically state a condition .... IF they reside in peace among you. 

And that was within the context of a theocracy. The us is not, as so many continue to point out to conservatives, we are not a theocracy.

[other one]

2 hours ago, diane32 said:

And then Jesus came and He fought for us and He fights for us...we are called to love...pray for our government's yes but anything that involves pride stay away cos pride is why satan was threw out of heaven remember...I don't agree with Christians being in the Army either but then again that's my opinon...when I look at Jesus and His disciples I see something completely different than what you are talking about...but Pride is a massive thing isn't it..

You would have fit right in with those of Israel when Moses told them to prepare to enter the promise land and with the Jews in Germany in 1939...

[other one]

2 hours ago, PinkBelt said:

Exodus 22:21

You shall not wrong a sojourner or oppress him, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt.

Leviticus 19:33-34

When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

Malachi 3:5

“Then I will draw near to you for judgment. I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, against the adulterers, against those who swear falsely, against those who oppress the hired worker in his wages, the widow and the fatherless, against those who thrust aside the sojourner, and do not fear me, says the Lord of hosts.

 

sojourn means a temporary stay....    not a move in and take care of me.

[Neighbor]

2 hours ago, ayin jade said:

Language barriers are a problem though. It is a hardship to try to get a job for a us citizen when the requirement on many of the jobs one wants is "must speak spanish". That is a reality my hubby faced last year when he was trying to get a job, before he had to stop when I got cancer. 

Yes I do know that one pretty well.  I dealt in sales contracts in California where the contract must be in the language of the presentation. We had  an English, Korean, and Spanish speaking sale force. So we had English, Korean, and Spanish, language contracts to prepare and hopeful understand ourselves. I read only English, made for a real challenge for me personally.

 

BTW- I do so enjoy seeing your name appear on Worthy, it is to me knowledge that someone is still hanging in there winning the fight  for the day. Been in that fight as a husband myself. Both you and your husband are brave heroes to me.

[other one]

19 hours ago, PinkBelt said:

I used the English Standard Version which chose to translate "ger" as "Sojourner". The meaning of the word is complicated but in a nutshell a "ger" is a person who moved to Israel and converted to Judaism. They had full rights in ancient Israel and were to be treated as fellow citizens. "Ger" has also been translated as "alien" and "foreigner", but as ancient languages are not easy to translate there is no perfect analogue in English. Regardless the bible is clearly not talking about temporary visitors, nor did such a thing really exist in the ancient world unless you were a merchant. But by all means please continue trying to lawyer God.

Your animosity towards border jumpers is obvious by your constant characterization of illegals as drug cartel criminals. I'm from California which has by far more illegal immigrants then any other state in the union, including Arizona. While some of them are certainly criminals, most are fleeing poverty or violence. Christians follow the bible regardless of if they live in a theocracy or not so your argument, an attempt to try and throw my own words back at me is not valid. When I say "we are not a theocracy" is in the context of people trying to pass laws to force non-believers to conform to Christian beliefs, which I do not support or endorse.

I do not know who you are confusing us with but I really don't characterize most of those people coming here as drug cartel criminals.....    most of those hire the cartel to deliver them to the border...   I didn't say that they were part of the cartel...    actually they are being abused by them, but without the cartel most of them would never reach the border...

[choir loft]

On 5/17/2019 at 12:11 PM, Neighbor said:

Hi, This is question within me more than general discussion points , but I don't know a better place to put the interest concern and question. So I place it here for discussion.

Please hold back  for a bit anyway  from delivering your own present conclusion about the politcs, and instead enter into the question; are there really desperate people fleeing into the USA today? If so are their reasons so greatly different from the people's reasons for fleeing to  America so long ago that founded this country?  

I know the concern over crime and criminals and drugs. I am also greatly concerned - I am trying to also see the individual faces of poverty to near death, and perhaps the desperation that leads one to make the "run" to the USA today for the purpose of learning;  do I have a call to be involved and if so at what level to what cause and towards what end?

I am an old man. I speak only English, I do have a bride younger than myself who is fluent in Spanish, and has traveled  a large portion of the areas from which people are fleeing. I feel I am largely ignorant of the land and of the peoples especially so by comparison. I also think I need be less detached, and perhaps be much  more involved, but I do not even have a  concise thinking, nor any basis for any conclusion other than what  passes as politics in the USA.

 I perhaps do not need  just a what would Jesus do moment for myself as I do need a what  will I do if anything  moment  so  that I prepare and if led to do so get more than passively involved.

How is it all affecting your own mind and heart? I'd like to read of it, - in hope that  I may be better enlightened and gain more than an abstract prayer to my creator to present in my concern over the plight of others with their need, and with their desires.

 

Jesus never sanctioned lawLESSness.

Would you happily allow a stranger to break into your home and steal that which does not belong to him?    That's two laws broken right there and that's exactly what illegal immigration is all about.

Illegals are entering the US in ways not according to our laws and customs.   Once within our borders they steal from the common purse by demanding or using resources they have not contributed to by means of taxes or service.

If the reader is in favor of illegal entry into the US, then he or she should prove it by deeds and not words.   Remove all the locks on your home's doors and windows and place a sign in front of your home.  Your sign should read, "Come and take anything of mine you want."

Let me know when you have your open house because I'll be there with all the rest to take what you have so foolishly thrown to the dogs.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...

[Neighbor]

 

16 hours ago, choir loft said:

Let me know when you have your open house because I'll be there with all the rest to take what you have so foolishly thrown to the dogs.

Really? 

Surely not.

[other one]

On 5/18/2019 at 6:17 AM, Neighbor said:

Hi, and Thanks all,

 I did get to thinking about the word illegals. Illegals, are "they" illegals though? The Cubans that fled to Florida were illegal if caught while still in the water, but quite legal if they had one foot on the shore and asked for asylum. Seems to me it is similar now all along the southern lands border. A person may be illegal  until they  ask for asylum. Then  they are legally inside the USA for  having asked.

 

Problem is that they ask for asylum and get a court date but never show up for that court date then they are illegal..