Does “Counted Worthy to Escape” Prove the Pretrib. Rapture?

[frienduff thaylorde]

34 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

I hope you learn the truth once and for all: NO MEMBER of the Bride of Christ - those caught up - will even SEE the Beast.

Did you just not notice that the great crowd, too large to number (the raptured church) was seen in heaven before the week Begins?

According to men this is so ,  But this is not what THE WORD SAYS .     I have long fled and never looked back at the doctrines of men gone long wrong .

Let all start afresh and anew And read the bible for ourselves ,  I TELL US all , it comes together beautifully .   

[iamlamad]

1 hour ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

According to men this is so ,  But this is not what THE WORD SAYS .     I have long fled and never looked back at the doctrines of men gone long wrong .

Let all start afresh and anew And read the bible for ourselves ,  I TELL US all , it comes together beautifully .   

I did not get this from men, but straight out of the word of God.

Paul tells us HIS rapture will come just before God's wrath. From John we find that His wrath will begin at the 6th seal.

Also from John we can see that the 70th week does not start until the 7th seal. (The week is marked by 7's)

Also from John, we see that the great crowd, too large to number seen in the throne room (can ONLY be the gathered church) is in chapter 7, right after the Wrath of God begins .

As I said, GOD is pretrib. Therefore you should be too. Go back and study it again!

I will agree, classical pretrib had problems.  Everyone that can read well knew the rapture was NOT in Rev. 4:1.

 

If you wish to go verse by verse, we can.

Question: how will YOU get to the marriage and supper?

Edited June 29, 2019 by iamlamad

[frienduff thaylorde]

3 hours ago, iamlamad said:

I did not get this from men, but straight out of the word of God.

Paul tells us HIS rapture will come just before God's wrath. From John we find that His wrath will begin at the 6th seal.

Also from John we can see that the 70th week does not start until the 7th seal. (The week is marked by 7's)

Also from John, we see that the great crowd, too large to number seen in the throne room (can ONLY be the gathered church) is in chapter 7, right after the Wrath of God begins .

As I said, GOD is pretrib. Therefore you should be too. Go back and study it again!

I will agree, classical pretrib had problems.  Everyone that can read well knew the rapture was NOT in Rev. 4:1.

 

If you wish to go verse by verse, we can.

Question: how will YOU get to the marriage and supper?

YES the rapture occurs at the coming of our LORD  , when also HE lays down the wrath against all ungodly men .   YOU GOT IT

And at that time HE lays down wrath against the beast , and all who did worship this beast .   This beast will kill as  many true saints First

OH , but whether we live or die , DONT You fear it .  DONT fear this monster who is able to kill the body , who is able to throw us in prison

and have us killed . NAY ,  do not fear to suffer for Christ , FOR many will die in the days ahead .  

NO fear .     say it with me .  Say , I SHALL NOT FEAR what man can do to me ,     IN CHRIST WE WIN .    

[iamlamad]

40 minutes ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

YES the rapture occurs at the coming of our LORD  , when also HE lays down the wrath against all ungodly men .   YOU GOT IT

And at that time HE lays down wrath against the beast , and all who did worship this beast .   This beast will kill as  many true saints First

OH , but whether we live or die , DONT You fear it .  DONT fear this monster who is able to kill the body , who is able to throw us in prison

and have us killed . NAY ,  do not fear to suffer for Christ , FOR many will die in the days ahead .  

NO fear .     say it with me .  Say , I SHALL NOT FEAR what man can do to me ,     IN CHRIST WE WIN .    

YES the rapture occurs at the coming of our LORD  2nd coming, as in 1 Thes. NOT the 3rd coming as in Rev. 19.

This beast will kill as  many true saints First  NONE of the Bride will be here for him to kill. Now, if you wish to remain behind.....

Say it with me: "Thank God you have made no appointments for me with your wrath!"

[JLB]

On 6/28/2019 at 9:17 AM, Montana Marv said:

Are we talking about Christs Second Return (Advent) after His first Advent.  Or are we talking about a Coming of Christ, following His ascension; the first being on the road to Damascus, the next being the RAPTURE.  Later followed by His Second Coming (Advent), physically here on earth.

Yet, nowhere in Scripture is the true date for the Rapture given, known only by God the Father.  Many misinterpret the Second Coming and the Rapture; which are two separate events.  The lawless one will be revealed after the Rapture, followed by his demise 7 years later.

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

His coming.

 

The coming of the Lord that is mentioned in many places in the New Testament. 

 

The Resurrection and Rapture, as well as the destruction of the wicked, including the antichrist, take place at His coming.

 

The lawless one is destroyed by His coming, the “brightness” of His coming, not 7 years after His coming.

Jesus Christ personally destroys the antichrist by the brightness of His coming. This is irrefutable.

 

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8

 

• Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him,

 

• And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming.

 

The coming of the Lord is when He returns to gather His people together, at the resurrection and rapture, and destroy the wicked, in which He will take His place as King over all the earth in Jerusalem. 

 

 

JLB 

[JLB]

11 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

YES the rapture occurs at the coming of our LORD  , when also HE lays down the wrath against all ungodly men .   YOU GOT IT

And at that time HE lays down wrath against the beast , and all who did worship this beast .   This beast will kill as  many true saints First

OH , but whether we live or die , DONT You fear it .  DONT fear this monster who is able to kill the body , who is able to throw us in prison

and have us killed . NAY ,  do not fear to suffer for Christ , FOR many will die in the days ahead .  

NO fear .     say it with me .  Say , I SHALL NOT FEAR what man can do to me ,     IN CHRIST WE WIN .    

 

 

Amen. 

 

 

[JLB]

On 6/28/2019 at 10:46 AM, iamlamad said:

How can I come to this conclusion?  By an in-depth study of all end times scriptures, praying in the Spirit and asking God to reveal His intent.

 

Sorry brother, I think you were persuaded by the popular teaching that has been circulating in the west for the last 100 years.

 

All you have to do is simply read what Paul plainly wrote here in 1 Thessalonians.

 

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

 

• that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord

 

Paul Plainly teaches the rapture and resurrection occur at His coming. 

 

 

JLB 

[JLB]

On 6/28/2019 at 12:39 PM, frienduff thaylorde said:

Many folks don't want to see this truth .    They got the kings kids mentality .

But if we read the second chapter of second thess ,   IT beings with THE COMING of the LORD < HIS DAY and our gathering unto HIM .

Everything in between is saying WHAT MUST HAPPEN before HE , JESUS IS REVEALED FROM HEAVEN.

look how paul ends that . SO NOW YOU KNOW CHURCH , what must occur BEFORE HE , JESUS IS REVELAED .   RIGHT THEIR IN BLACK AND WHITE .

but folks want to believe they KINGS KIDS , and BY GOLLY KINGS KIDS are NOT APPOINTED UNTO TRIBULATION , BUT UNTO MONEY and EASY TIMES .

NOT what JESUS SAID .     IN THIS WORLD ye shall HAVE TRIBULATION .  NOT if you GOOD ENOUGH you will escape tribulation .

IN fact   ALL WHO LIVE GODLY IN CHRIST will suffer persecution , NOT ESCAPE IT .   THE ONLY THING we do not go under IS THE WRATH OF GOD .

But not to KINGS KIDS ,  they got them crowns , NOW  GIVE THEM THE EASY LIFE .  

 

Amen. 

[Montana Marv]

1 hour ago, JLB said:

 

His coming.

 

The coming of the Lord that is mentioned in many places in the New Testament. 

 

The Resurrection and Rapture, as well as the destruction of the wicked, including the antichrist, take place at His coming.

 

The lawless one is destroyed by His coming, the “brightness” of His coming, not 7 years after His coming.

Jesus Christ personally destroys the antichrist by the brightness of His coming. This is irrefutable.

 

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8

 

• Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him,

 

• And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming.

 

The coming of the Lord is when He returns to gather His people together, at the resurrection and rapture, and destroy the wicked, in which He will take His place as King over all the earth in Jerusalem. 

 

 

JLB 

In your theory, your time frame is off.  First of all the "He/One" of v. 7 must be taken out of the way before the A/C makes his appearance, he later sits in the temple in Jerusalem saying he is god.  The clock begins to tick after the A/C makes his appearance, we know there are 7 years remaining.  And you say you know the time/date of the Rapture, which only God the Father knows.  May I then call you God the Father.  Now if this is the case, when did God the Father reveal this information to Jesus Christ the Word, the Scriptures.  Jesus Christ said, Only God the Father knows the timing for the Rapture.  So you do not have a grip on things yet.  Why, read Rev 9:20 - The rest of mankind that were not killed by these plagues still did not repent..., they did not stop worshiping demons and idols, neither did they repent.....  What does one take from this.  ALL mankind continued to worship demons and idols from before the 6th Trumpet.  And the Bowl judgments are still to follow. 

There is a gathering of His People Israel at the end of the 70th Week, for they do not believe until they see the one who they have pierced.  He, Jesus gathers the Church, saints which were indwelt by the the H.S. from one end of heaven to the other when He make His return, not from on the earth.

So are you included in this group of "The Rest of Mankind" which were not killed by these plagues.  For even before the 6th Trumpet, Scripture say they ALL were worshiping demons and idols. This part of Scripture really puts you in a predicament.  Are you gathered from this group, or are you already in heaven and Christ gathers you from one end of heaven to the other.  You can make your own mind up.

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

Edited June 30, 2019 by Montana Marv
sentex

[JLB]

7 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

In your theory, your time frame is off.  First of all the "He/One" of v. 7 must be taken out of the way before the A/C makes his appearance, he later sits in the temple in Jerusalem saying he is god. 

 

How can the “timing” be off to His coming since I have assigned no “timing” to His coming.

 

i have only pointed out what the scriptures say about The resurrection and rapture, occurring at His coming.  

 

You are attempting to project your preconceived idea onto the passage.

 

The scripture plainly states the resurrection and rapture occur at His coming.  

 

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

 

The scripture also teaches that the destruction of the antichrist also occurs at His coming. 

 

And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8

 

You are only putting yourself against what the scriptures so plainly say.

 

 

 JLB