The Comings of the Lord Jesus For Believers... Part II

[Mary8]

The Comings of the Lord Jesus For Believers then in 7 Years Part II

- Regarding when He was "carried up into heaven" "while He blessed them"

Luke 24:50-52  50 And he led them out as far as to Bethany, and he lifted up his hands, and blessed them. 51 And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven. 52 And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy:

- He will return "in like manner" in "heaven," He lifted up His hands, "blessed them" - twice it says "blessed them."

Acts 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

- When He comes for His saints it is "in the clouds," "caught up together" "to meet the Lord in the air" (not on the ground)

I Thess. 4:17 we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air:

- A lengthy description of when He comes in judgment, heaven opened, with details (but no mention that He is blessing):
"heaven opened," He comes on "a white horse," "doth judge," His eyes "as a flame of fire," His vesture dipped in blood, "His Name is called the Word of God," the armies "followed him upon white horses" "clothed in fine linen" "out of His mouth goeth a sharp sword"  "He treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God"

Rev. 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. 12His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. 13And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Rev. 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him.  

Edited July 19, 2019 by Mary8
twice He blessed them also emphasis

[R. Hartono]

After the wedding in Rev 19 Our Lord Jesus with the raptured saints will first go to defeat antichrist's armies at the battle of Armageddon.

After that He will be landing at Mt. Olives, perhaps at the same spot where He ascended 2000 years ago.

Zechariah 14:4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 25, 2023 by R. Hartono

[Diaste]

12 hours ago, Mary8 said:

The Comings of the Lord Jesus For Believers then in 7 Years Part II

- Regarding when He was "carried up into heaven" "while He blessed them"

Luke 24:50-52  50 And he led them out as far as to Bethany, and he lifted up his hands, and blessed them. 51 And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven. 52 And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy:

- He will return "in like manner" in "heaven"

Acts 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

- When He comes for His saints it is "in the clouds," "caught up together" "to meet the Lord in the air" (not on the ground)

I Thess. 4:17 we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air:

- A lengthy description of when He comes in judgment, heaven opened, with details (but no mention that He is blessing):
"heaven opened," He comes on "a white horse," "doth judge," His eyes "as a flame of fire," His vesture dipped in blood, "His Name is called the Word of God," the armies "followed him upon white horses" "clothed in fine linen" "out of His mouth goeth a sharp sword"  "He treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God"

Rev. 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. 12His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. 13And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Rev. 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him.  

I have noticed that in the above it's assumed that Jesus cannot come for us, the elect, then a short time after, maybe a half hour or so, alight on the Mount of Olives. More than once I have heard this idea that coming in the clouds for believers both alive and dead cannot be associated with Jesus gathering us from the earth to the clouds then staying and coming to the ground to defeat His enemy. What prevents this?

Are we to believe it's impossible for Jesus to gather the elect and then within minutes or hours stand on the Mount of Olives, cleave the Mount, create a great valley where the remnant takes refuge, and then commence pouring the anger of God and Himself upon the rebels of the world? That's an impossible scenario? An all powerful God cannot do this?

So Jesus cannot come in the air where we all meet Him, then proceed to place his feet on the dirt and stone of the Mount shortly after? It's the same as a firefighter rescuing a person from a burning building, making sure they are far enough away from the fire so they are safe and sound, then returning to fight the fire then and there. Not 7 years later, not a month later, not tomorrow, right then.

And why are the armies that come with our Lord Jesus identified as resurrected believers both alive and dead? I have heard the argument that goes like this: "Jesus is going to take His bride off the earth before the tribulation because He loves His bride and would never let her come to harm." But now under the same doctrine that believes that, Jesus is going to take His bride to war. And how do we know the armies are not angels? Are not angels clothed in white? Is it only the elect that receives pure, clean, white linen vestment? 

No scripture or logical process prevents Jesus from appearing, gathering the elect, alighting on the Mount of Olives, hiding the remnant, then immediately commence to prosecute His enemies, all within the same day or hour.

 

 

 

[R. Hartono]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

Are we to believe it's impossible for Jesus to gather the elect and then within minutes or hours stand on the Mount of Olives,

 

Are you saying that Lord Jesus will gather the elect to the cloud and then make a U-Turn to return the saints to earth ?

[Diaste]

1 hour ago, R. Hartono said:

Are you saying that Lord Jesus will gather the elect to the cloud and then make a U-Turn to return the saints to earth ?

A u-turn? And go back to heaven? 

Not sure I understand your question. 

[R. Hartono]

13 minutes ago, Diaste said:

A u-turn? And go back to heaven? 

Not sure I understand your question. 

When the rapture takes place Lord Jesus will raise the saints to the clouds :

1 Thes 4:16 For the Lord himself shall ^adescend from heaven with ^ba shout, with the voice of the ^carchangel, and with the ^dtrump of God: and the dead in Christ shall ^erise first:

17 ^aThen we which are alive and remain shall be ^bcaught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the ^cLord in the ^dair: and so shall we ^eever be with the ^fLord.

You asked : Are we to believe it's impossible for Jesus to gather the elect and then within minutes or hours stand on the Mount of Olives,

Do you want Jesus to make a U-Turn to return the saints from the cloud to the earth again after raising them to the clouds ?

 

[Last Daze]

2 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

Are you saying that Lord Jesus will gather the elect to the cloud and then make a U-Turn to return the saints to earth ?

He gathers them from the four winds. 

Are you implying with a pretrib rapture that Jesus makes a U-turn and goes back to heaven?  That goes against Acts 1:11.

[Diaste]

16 minutes ago, Last Daze said:

 

Are you implying with a pretrib rapture that Jesus makes a U-turn and goes back to heaven?  That goes against Acts 1:11.

That's what I'd like to know as well.

[Diaste]

1 hour ago, R. Hartono said:

 

Do you want Jesus to make a U-Turn to return the saints from the cloud to the earth again after raising them to the clouds ?

 

I get it. You think the armies that come with Jesus are the resurrected dead and the translated living. 

No, the armies consist of the angels.

Jesus comes with His holy ones which are angels and not the elect. He does not rescue His bride and then bring her to war.

[WilliamL]

9 hours ago, Diaste said:

More than once I have heard this idea that coming in the clouds for believers both alive and dead cannot be associated with Jesus gathering us from the earth to the clouds then staying and coming to the ground to defeat His enemy. What prevents this?

The prophetic word prevents this. Specifically, Rev. 8-11:14, among many other passages, such as Isaiah 63:1-5 and 34:4-7. The latter explained here:

https://www.worthychristianforums.com/blogs/entry/1135-when-does-the-lord-smite-edom/