Who resurrected Jesus?

[JohnD]

BTW,

The Father created the body (human life) of Jesus. John 1:14, Hebrews 1:5, Hebrews 10:5.

Jesus laid down his own (human) life. John 10:18

All three in the Godhead rose him from the grave. John 10:18, Galatians 1:1, Romans 8:11

[JohnD]

2 minutes ago, choir loft said:

"I and the Father are ONE." - Jesus as quoted by John 10:30

Sh'ma Yisrael

Adonai Eloheinu

Adonai Echad

- Deuteronomy 6:4

English translation: Hear O Israel the Lord thy God, The Lord is ONE.

The Hebrew word Echad is used here instead of the Hebrew word Yachid.   Yachid means an absolute one - as in the number one, as in a single person being one person alone. Echad means one as in a unity.   The most commonly used English term similar to this is the term used to describe the United States - E pluribus Unum, or One from Many, a union.  Echad therefore implies a unity of divine personality.  Jews don't extrapolate their oldest prayer into its meaning in Christ.  Gentiles continue to think of God as separate deities as illustrated by attempts on these pages to explain it.  Mostly they don't even know this ancient prayer exists or what it really means.  

Now, you do.

"Before Abraham was, I AM" - Jesus as quoted by John 8:58

Jesus declared Himself to be HASHEM, meaning the Name of God.   For this reason alone was the greatest contention created between Jesus and the priests of Israel.  In these five words alone, Jesus told us He is God.  He explains the mystery.

Jesus IS GOD.  

I have been with you all this time, and still you do not know Me? Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me? The words I say to you, I do not speak on My own. Instead, it is the Father dwelling in Me, performing His works. Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me—or at least believe on account of the works themselves. - Jesus as quoted by John 14:9 - 11

It was necessary for God to die upon the cross so that the requirement of the LAW be fulfilled.

If Jesus wasn't God, then the LAW is not fulfilled and no one is saved from their sins.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...

My way of getting my head around this is:

God cannot die. Jesus died in his body.

His body was in the tomb 3 days 3 nights

but his Spirit (God the Word) had gone to Gehenna, preached the victory to the lost on the fiery side

and he took the captivity on the side of Abraham's bosom to heaven (in their disembodied state) before

the sun set that day on Earth (over Jerusalem).

And Jesus rose in his eternally resurrected Spirit-Body on the third day.

Jesus is the last / second Adam = the prototype.

He never had the sin nature the children of the first Adam had / has.

To fulfill the Law (which he kept all his Earthly life) he laid down that life as a sacrifice. 

But if he was merely another prototype human, that sacrifice could not have been applied to

anyone else to pay for sin.

In fact, since he did not sin, the sacrifice would not have paid for any actual sin.

But!

He is in fact God the Word incarnate and not only that he is the sole Creator of all things created 

in the beginning... and even until the Father created his body.

That's why the scriptures say he (Jesus) is the ONLY begotten of the Father.

John 1:14 (AV)
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

John 3:16–18 (AV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

1 John 4:9 (AV)
9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

If this were not true or if there was not multiple individuals in the Godhead, this would not even be possible:

Luke 3:38 (AV)
38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

Jesus is the Lone Creator in the beginning (John 1:1-3, Colossians 1:13-16, Hebrews 1:1-2, ISAIAH 44:24*) 

And this is why he and not the Father or the Spirit became a man to lay down that human life to pay for the sin debt of humanity.

* God the Word (YHVH / THE LORD our Redeemer) created all things alone by himself in the presence of the Father (1 John 1:1-2) and of the Holy Spirit (Genesis 1:1-2).

But he acted alone.

[JohnD]

We are the children of Adam, and therefore the children of God (the Word) by nature. 

We are the children of God the Father only through the adoption of sons (Romans 8:15)

through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ his only begotten (actual) Son.

[choir loft]

31 minutes ago, JohnD said:

My way of getting my head around this is:

God cannot die. Jesus died in his body.

His body was in the tomb 3 days 3 nights

but his Spirit (God the Word) had gone to Gehenna, preached the victory to the lost on the fiery side

and he took the captivity on the side of Abraham's bosom to heaven (in their disembodied state) before

the sun set that day on Earth (over Jerusalem).

And Jesus rose in his eternally resurrected Spirit-Body on the third day.

Jesus is the last / second Adam = the prototype.

He never had the sin nature the children of the first Adam had / has.

To fulfill the Law (which he kept all his Earthly life) he laid down that life as a sacrifice. 

But if he was merely another prototype human, that sacrifice could not have been applied to

anyone else to pay for sin.

In fact, since he did not sin, the sacrifice would not have paid for any actual sin.

But!

He is in fact God the Word incarnate and not only that he is the sole Creator of all things created 

in the beginning... and even until the Father created his body.

That's why the scriptures say he (Jesus) is the ONLY begotten of the Father.

John 1:14 (AV)
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

John 3:16–18 (AV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

1 John 4:9 (AV)
9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

If this were not true or if there was not multiple individuals in the Godhead, this would not even be possible:

Luke 3:38 (AV)
38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

Jesus is the Lone Creator in the beginning (John 1:1-3, Colossians 1:13-16, Hebrews 1:1-2, ISAIAH 44:24*) 

And this is why he and not the Father or the Spirit became a man to lay down that human life to pay for the sin debt of humanity.

* God the Word (YHVH / THE LORD our Redeemer) created all things alone by himself in the presence of the Father (1 John 1:1-2) and of the Holy Spirit (Genesis 1:1-2).

But he acted alone.

You touch on many subjects, most of which I agree with.   I'm going to respond to just one.

Jesus didn't "go to gehenna" to liberate captives there while He was in the tomb.   This is a fabrication invented by the church.  It is not Biblical.

1 Peter 3:19 says only that He 'made proclamation' to the imprisoned spirits AFTER BEING MADE ALIVE.  (Translations vary on this point.)  The simple truth is that we do not know what Jesus was doing while He was dead.   One may be close to the truth, however, if one assumes Jesus slept in sheol.

According to the Old Testament, those that died would sleep in a place called SHEOL.  Sheol was the place of the sleeping dead.  Little or nothing is said of this place in the OT.  The expanded version of what happened after one dies happens in the New Testament.  Sheol was a simple term and description, nothing more and nothing less.

Use of the word gehenna is a translational aberration generally interpreted to mean hell or the abode of the dead.   Again, this is a Greek myth based upon ancient Egyptian religion.  It is not Biblical and is often employed by publishers of Bibles to push their agenda.

Gehenna was in fact a city dump outside Jerusalem.  

Everybody knew about it because sooner or later everybody dumped their trash in that place.   Because it was a city dump, the fires never went out - being constantly fed by the waste products dumped there.   The worms never stopped eating because garbage was always thrown away there.   Therefore Jesus' reference to gehenna as the place where fires never went out and where worms never stopped eating was understood by one and all.   By everyone except gentiles who've been infected by church fear mongering myths and legends.  Gehenna was also the place where in older times children were sacrificed to the pagan god Molech.  (see 1 & 2 Kings and the book of Leviticus)

Rabbinic literature first linked gehenna to a place where the wicked were sent.  Jesus did NOT give credemce to Rabbinic literature at all, but restricted His teaching to the Torah and Tanakh (LAW & Prophets).  Therefore when Jesus referred to gehenna, He was talking about the city dump.  Everyone who heard Him understood His meaning.

In the same way references to hades are likewise based upon pagan myth.  Hades is the name of the king of the underworld - of the dead according to Greek myth.  Hades is not the name of a place, its the name of a mythical character.   Translations and interpretations of hades as meaning hell are likewise wrong.

There is no hell.

The Bible speaks of the Second Death, the Lake of Fire, where satan and sinners are consumed, burned up, utterly destroyed, annihilated and deleted permanently.  It is the Lake of Fire (gehenna) that burns forever - NOT those thrown into it.  Those sentenced to the Second Death are utterly destroyed.  Not even ashes remain - as in the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah.   Fire burns as long as it has fuel.  Fuel is always consumed.  If you know of a fuel that isn't consumed by fire let me know as I'd like to use it in my car.

The fiction of hell assumes that sinners will endure perpetual torture at the hands of Jesus, but the Bible nowhere describes Jesus as being the owner and operator of a subterranean torture chamber.

ONLY THE RIGHTEOUS are granted immortality.    The pagan concept of hell suggests that sinners likewise live forever albeit in torment.  The Bible nowhere asserts this idea.

Ancient Egyptians taught that humans had a quality that survives death.   The Bible says otherwise.  It says only God is immortal.

“who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light” - 1 Tim 6:16

The Bible says humans do NOT have a quality that survives death.  The Bible says people are mortal - they die.

Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with humans forever, for they are mortal; - Genesis 6:3a

Therefore, since the nature of man is to die spiritually, physically and mentally, THE GOOD NEWS of the gospel is that God has decided to grant or cloth those who surrender to Him with immortality - and only them.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...

Edited November 3, 2019 by choir loft

[Alive]

Choir---I find myself in total agreement with you. I went through a catharsis of sorts over this some years back.

I have tired to explain to people from the principle of justice, love and righteousness. In the end, it was the Lord Himself. I could no longer reconcile the Lord that I have gotten to know, with that cruelty.

It became impossible and settled.

[choir loft]

21 hours ago, Alive said:

Choir---I find myself in total agreement with you. I went through a catharsis of sorts over this some years back.

I have tired to explain to people from the principle of justice, love and righteousness. In the end, it was the Lord Himself. I could no longer reconcile the Lord that I have gotten to know, with that cruelty.

It became impossible and settled.

You may find the book THE FIRE THAT CONSUMES by Edward William Fudge to be quite interesting.  I recommend it to you.

Edward Fudge is also the subject of a biographical movie called HELL AND MR. FUDGE.

The book is 210 pages and pours a lot of cold water on the myth of hell.

The movie describes the hell Mr. Fudge experienced from the protestant church as he developed his research from the entire context of the Bible.   

To this day, despite Biblical evidence to the contrary, protestants refuse to let go of the Greek myth they believe to be gospel.   The RCC is flirting with abandonment of the doctrine, but hasn't come out with any bull on the subject (Papal bull or official pronouncement, that is.)

As for me, I believe the traditional Christian idea of hell as an eternal torment of sinners is indeed bovine excrement.   It stinks on many levels.

God kills (and doesn't even enjoy the act).  God doesn't torture.   

Catholics have loved to torture, as evidenced by the inquisition.  Protestants love to torture as evidenced by the holocaust.

Neither consult the Bible because it cannot justify their demonic persuasion.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...

Edited November 4, 2019 by choir loft

[JohnD]

Quote from Randall Ricker Great Lakes Church of God:

"There is a punishment for sinners who refuse to repent. In Revelation 20:13-15 we read of a resurrection where people will be judged, “And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.” The incorrigibly evil persons whom God cannot work with will be put into hellfire. Read Malachi 4:1-3. Notice, “all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up,” and “ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet.” They will be burned up, and only ashes will remain; they will not be tortured forever."

Those who espouse the no such thing as hell belief usually do what this gentleman did, quote verses about only one aspect of humanity.

We are made up of three aspects:

1 Thessalonians 5:23 (AV)
23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The general resurrection will occur to glorify the Lord Jesus:

Philippians 2:10–11 (AV)
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Isaiah 66:23–24 (AV)
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.
24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall THEIR fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Then the condemned shall be cast into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:11-15) where the flesh is burned (Malachi 4:1-3) up but the spirit lives on:

Mark 9:43–49 (AV)
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
49 For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.

Matthew 3:11 (AV)
11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and* with fire:

John 3:16–18 (AV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

* a better rendering would be the word "or"

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 4, 2019 by JohnD

[Know Jah]

Hmmm I must disagree..God is from everlasting to everlasting and cannot die..Therefore Jesus is not Almighty God. Jesus has been and will always be subjected/submissive to the Father.

[Prycejosh1987]

On 10/30/2019 at 2:38 AM, Lee_ said:

Who resurrected Jesus? Was it the Father, Jesus Himself, and the Holy Spirit?

He was and is God, he committed his spirit to the father. I am assuming he received honour when he died and he came back himself. He said in John that he will tear down the temple and raise it up in 3 days. This assumes to me that Jesus rose himself up.