Rapture before the antichrist in Matthew 24

[OldCoot]

21 minutes ago, JoeMo said:

If I had my way, I would already be in the Kingdom!

You and me both!!!!!    Every day that is my desire!   To be with the Lord just can't come quick enough.

[kenny2212]

The first of the resurrections in Revelation 20 is the resurrection of believers that DIDN'T WORSHIP AND TAKE THE MARK OF THE BEAST BUT DIED DURING THE TRIBULATION PERIOD. It's not the resurrection of all believers through history.

Rev. 20:4 - ⁴ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. PLEASE NOTE THE EMPHASIS.

And they are the not only resurrections (the one talked about in verse 4 and the one after the 1000 years). There have been other resurrections - Jesus' (gospel accounts), resurrected saints (Matt. 27:52-53), the 2 witnesses (Rev. 11:11-12). 

God bless us all

[Revelation Man]

On 2/15/2020 at 2:53 AM, Diaste said:

It just read like a dark fantasy. The disconnect seemed funny to me.

You got schooled and you had no come back. So you did what all people to, you play make believe. Refute one point I made, YOU CAN'T so go to the laugh meter like Saul Alinsky's advice was on his 12 rules for radicals. 

He he he.....my points still stand. 

Edited February 17, 2020 by Revelation Man

[Revelation Man]

1 minute ago, kenny2212 said:

The first of the resurrections in Revelation 20 is the resurrection of believers that DIDN'T WORSHIP AND TAKE THE MARK OF THE BEAST BUT DIED DURING THE TRIBULATION PERIOD. It's not the resurrection of all believers through history.

Rev. 20:4 - ⁴ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. PLEASE NOTE THE EMPHASIS.

And they are the not only resurrections (the one talked about in verse 4 and the one after the 1000 years). There have been other resurrections - Jesus' (gospel accounts), resurrected saints (Matt. 27:52-53), the 2 witnesses (Rev. 11:11-12). 

God bless us all

The First Resurrection is the Resurrection of the Living. Since the Jews are raised at the very end {Dan. 12 says so} and the Church is Raptured pre 70th week, and the Jews {who are THE WHEAT} remain on earth with the WICKED TARES til the very end, then there are all Resurrections of those who belong to God, those are resurrected FIRST, the Wicked are the Second Death but guess what....The Anti-Christ and the False Prophet are judged at the same time as the Rev. 20:4 Saints who were Beheaded. 

People don't use logicf and they try to pigeonhole God via words that do not apply. 

[JoeCanada]

1 hour ago, OldCoot said:

I would add, Yeshua did not tell us to "stay awake" and keep an eye out for the antichrist and all the associated stuff.  He told us to stay awake for we do not know when our greater redemption comes.   There is no scripture that admonishes the redeemed to stay alert for the coming of the antichrist, the time of Jacob's trouble, etc.   It only admonishes us to stay alert for our gathering to Messiah.   To not get all caught up in the affairs of this life that we take our focus off of Him.   

Luke 21:28 (NKJV) Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near."

Notice how it says when all the calamities previously described begin to happen, not while or when they are happening.  Just like many of the Prophets wrote that at the beginning of the birth pains, the righteous dead would be raised and along with the living righteous would be hidden from that time.

Hey OC,

²⁵ “There will be ^[a]signs in sun and moon and stars, and on the earth dismay among nations, in perplexity at the roaring of the sea and the waves, ²⁶ men fainting from fear and the expectation of the things which are coming upon the ^[b]world; for the powers of ^[c]the heavens will be shaken. ²⁷ Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory......Luke 21: 25-27

Luke 21:28 (NKJV) Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near."

It seems,  to me anyways, that "these things" refer to the signs in the sun, moon, stars, etc.

If our redemption draws nigh when  those things begin to happen..... "the signs in the sun, moon, stars..... the roaring of the seas....the heavens being shaken......etc",  we are told to LOOK UP and LIFT UP our heads............then, we are right there, in the situation, at the time, otherwise we could not "LOOK UP" 

Are those the same signs from Matt 24:29....."⁹ “ the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from ^[r]the sky, and the powers of ^[s]the heavens will be shaken. ³⁰ And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory. ³¹ 

It seems that they are the same signs.

Now, when do those signs appear?................ "But immediately after the tribulation of those days"

And what happens after....."And He will send forth His angels with a great trumpet and they will gather together His ^[t]elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other.

Brother.....I'm very sorry to hear about your diagnoses. I will be praying for you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OldCoot]

2 minutes ago, JoeCanada said:

Brother.....I'm very sorry to hear about your diagnoses. I will be praying for you.

Thanks, Joe.  Appreciated.   I do relish prayers for me, but especially for my wife, Mischelle.  She is having a very tough time accepting this.   I think she will have a tougher time thru this than I will, irregardless of outcome.

Cliff

[Last Daze]

1 hour ago, OldCoot said:

 The statement by Yeshua is what is commonly known as an analogy, not a literalism.    Yeshua is the rock.  I don't need to build anything.

Look at it again.

• “Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock.  And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and yet it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock.  Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.  The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell—and great was its fall.”  Matthew 7:24-27

Everyone builds a house.  The contrast is between those who build their house by acting on Jesus' teachings and those who build ignore them. 

1 hour ago, OldCoot said:

And this is even more a wonderful thing now that I was diagnosed with advanced Esophageal Cancer yesterday by my doctor.  The Lord is to be praised in all things!

Amen!  Peace to you, brother.

[The Light]

11 hours ago, Diaste said:

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In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, on the seventeenth day of the second month, all the fountains of the great deep burst forth, and the floodgates of the heavens were opened. And the rain fell upon the earth for forty days and forty nights.

This is true.

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On that very day Noah entered the ark,

OOOH, nice out of context cherry pick. Maybe you should post the rest of the verses that follow and earlier verses so that a clear picture can be seen.

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Apparently Noah embarked on the same day as the flood began.

Apparently you should do a little more study. Did Noah disobey God? The first thing that God told Noah to do is enter the ark. Did he wait 7 days before he entered?

Gen 7

1 And the Lord said unto Noah, Come thou and all thy house into the ark; for thee have I seen righteous before me in this generation.

Here we can see that Noah entered and 7 days later the flood came.

Gen 7

⁹ There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.

¹⁰ And it came to pass after seven days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth.

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According to the evidence.

According to what you cherry picked out of context. Now let's find the truth.

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You are taking about the time it took the animals to arrive and embark. That's the 7 days. 

No, the Word says they embarked in one day. That day happened to be 7 days BEFORE the flood. I'll post the rest of the scripture that was conveniently left off that prove that Noah and his family and ALL THE ANIMALS entered on the same day.

Gen 7

¹³ In the selfsame day entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah, and Noah's wife, and the three wives of his sons with them, into the ark;

¹⁴ They, and every beast after his kind, and all the cattle after their kind, and every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind, and every fowl after his kind, every bird of every sort.

¹⁵ And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.

 

 

Edited February 15, 2020 by The Light

[OldCoot]

3 hours ago, Last Daze said:

Everyone builds a house.  The contrast is between those who build their house by acting on Jesus' teachings and those who build ignore them. 

Thanks, LD.

But I think it is much simpler than you suggest.

The will of the Father is that we believe and trust on the Son.  While I would never argue that we are to follow His guidance and in doing so we are building up rewards.   Redemption is a once and for all event.  Else there is the risk of falling into a works righteousness gig.  And even worse, some can allow pride to intervene and exhibit a superiority schtick over other believers.  

So in fact, we may be just talking past each other to some extent.  If one sees the redemption as the base and rewards as being the house, then what you say would be correct.   If one sees the works are rewards as part of redemption, then not so much.

I like things a more simple.....

1 John 3:23 (NKJV) And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment.

So I guess the question still somewhat remains....  what is the house built of and what is it built on.    It seems the focus of the statement by Yeshua is the rock and not the house.   However from your comment I get the feeling you are focusing more on the house than what it is built on.

Edited February 15, 2020 by OldCoot

[Diaste]

1 hour ago, The Light said:

OOOH, nice out of context cherry pick. Maybe you should post the rest of the verses that follow and earlier verses so that a clear picture can be seen.

You might be the first person to ever say I cherry pick. Of course my own daughter once said I was a neat freak, that was truly terrifying.

I highlighted the order. One cannot say this is in any way inaccurate or incorrect;

 

In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, on the seventeenth day of the second month, all the fountains of the great deep burst forth, and the floodgates of the heavens were opened. And the rain fell upon the earth for forty days and forty nights. On that very day Noah entered the ark...

This is truth and it must be dealt with. On the 17th day in the 2nd month the deluge began and that's the day Noah entered the ark. To what other day could this be referring except the preceding description?

"Then the LORD said to Noah, “Go into the ark, you and all your family, because I have found you righteous in this generation. You are to take with you seven pairs of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate; a pair of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate; and seven pairs of every kind of bird of the air, male and female, to preserve their offspring on the face of all the earth. For seven days from now I will send rain on the earth for forty days and forty nights, and I will wipe from the face of the earth every living thing I have made.”'

I'm convinced the command here to into the ark is because Noah was found righteous, not a specific command to go into the ark that moment. God says in 7 days the deluge comes; like saying, "You have 7 days to get ready."

"And Noah did all that the LORD had commanded him." That's not going to be possible unless Noah is in and out of the Ark during this time period of 7 days. Someone had to count and make sure the proper number of clean and unclean animals was correct. I mean, the deluge had not yet occurred and Noah and family not yet shut in. That only happened 7 days later...

"On that very day Noah entered the ark, along with his sons Shem, Ham, and Japheth, and his wife, and the three wives of his sons— 14they and every kind of wild animal, livestock, crawling creature, bird, and winged creature. 15They came to Noah to enter the ark, two by two of every creature with the breath of life. 16And they entered, the male and female of every living thing, as God had commanded Noah. Then the LORD shut him in."

And you have you noticed the repeat?

1) "Go into the ark, you and all your family...You are to take with you seven pairs of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate; a pair of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate; and seven pairs of every kind of bird of the air, male and female, to preserve their offspring on the face of all the earth." -Gen 7:1-3

2) "And Noah entered the ark, along with his sons and his wife and his sons’ wives, to escape the waters of the flood. The clean and unclean animals, the birds, and everything that crawls along the ground came to Noah to enter the ark, two by two, male and female, as God had commanded Noah." - Gen 7:7-9

3) "On that very day Noah entered the ark, along with his sons Shem, Ham, and Japheth, and his wife, and the three wives of his sons— they and every kind of wild animal, livestock, crawling creature, bird, and winged creature. They came to Noah to enter the ark, " - Gen 7:13-15

So which is it? Can have it both ways. Can't enter the ark for salvation from the deluge 7 days before when the scripture says 'the deluge began on the same day Noah entered the ark'.