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Posted
19 hours ago, Willa said:

In our society it is no longer shameful for a woman to have cut hair so it would seem it is not necessary to cover the head.  This is the current custom in most churches.  

However, social norms no longer require a woman to be in submission.  So I would suggest compliance simply to set ourselves apart from the rebellion in the world.  Even a turban would cover the hair.

What are women to do if we don't have husbands?  Do we now have Christ as our authority and honor Him by not covering our heads as men do?  This is where it becomes confusing to me.

You've brought up some excellent points. 

1. In our society it is no longer shameful for a woman to have cut hair so it would seem it is not necessary to cover the head.

First, although as Christians we live in a society with unbelievers we are to be set apart from it.  As Christians we are to be holy and give our lives to Christ and follow him. This does not mean sinless perfection, but we are different from the unbelievers.  Homosexuality is now accepted by society, but for God it is a sin.  So as Christians we are not to follow societies norms and dictates is they contradict that of the teachings of GOD.

The head covering was to be done during corporate worship.

Does head coverings apply now?

The local church, whether at Corinth, Colossae, Cleveland, or Cologne, is only part of the larger church (1:2d–f). This church is the church universal in its breadth. It is rooted in eternity and spread out through all time and space (1:2d). Most of its members are already in heaven. This larger church is the subject of his epistle to the Ephesians. Paul keeps it in mind, here, even though he is writing to a local church. For while he specifically addresses the church at Corinth, his letter is also for “all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ.” This letter, then, is as much for us, who dwell in lands of which Paul never dreamed and at a time as far from his age as was that of Abraham, as it was for those dear Christians in nearby Corinth in 1 Cor. A.D. 55.

 

Phillips, J. (2009). Exploring 1 Corinthians: An Expository Commentary (1 Co 1:1–9). Kregel Publications; WORDsearch Corp.

2.However, social norms no longer require a woman to be in submission.

So true... Again what society does or does not do is not applicable to a Christian who is set apart to be Holy and be a follower of Christ Jesus.

3. What are women to do if we don't have husbands?

Christ would be their head in that case and they should cover with veil as should women who do have husbands. Why? 

The reasons Paul himself gave found in the periscope of scripture 1 Corinthians 11 1-16. 

 

 

 

 


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Posted
On 3/16/2020 at 1:23 PM, missmuffet said:

Establishing hair length for submission is not something that is necessary today. It is legalistic. God looks at the heart not how long your hair is. 

Then why is it in the New Testament?


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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Firm Foundation said:

Then why is it in the New Testament?

Take a look at this. It might explain what Paul was saying. 

Question: "What does the Bible say about hair length? Do men have to have short hair, and do women have to have long hair?"

Answer: 
A passage that mentions hair length in the New Testament is 1 Corinthians 11:3-15. The Corinthian church was in the middle of a controversy about the roles of men and women and the proper order of authority within the church. In the Corinthian society, women showed submission to their husbands by wearing a veil. It seems that some of the women in the church were discarding their veils, something that only pagan temple prostitutes or other rebellious women would do. For a woman to come to church without her veil would be dishonoring to her husband, as well as culturally confusing. By the same token, for a man to wear a veil or to somehow have his head covered during worship was not culturally acceptable in Corinth.

Paul appeals to biology to illustrate the appropriateness of following the cultural standards: women naturally have longer hair than men, and men are much more prone to baldness. That is, God created women with a “natural veil” and men with an “uncovered head.” If a woman spurns the mark of her submission (the veil), she may as well shave her head (verse 6). His point is that if the culture says a woman should not be bald (going without her natural covering), then why would she reject that same culture’s standard of wearing a veil (going without her cultural covering)?

For the man’s part, it is unnatural for him to have “long hair” (verse 14). His hair is naturally shorter (and thinner) than the woman’s. This corresponds to the Corinthian tradition of men not wearing a head covering during worship. Paul urges the church to conform to the generally held ideas of male and female appearance.

While hair length is not the main point of this passage of Scripture, we glean the following applications from it: 1) We should adhere to the culturally accepted indicators of gender. Men should look like men, and women should look like women. God is not interested in, nor does He accept, “unisex.” 2) We should not rebel against the culture just for the sake of rebelling, in the name of some sort of Christian “liberty.” It does matter how we present ourselves. 3) Women are to voluntarily place themselves under the authority of the male leadership of the church. 4) We should not reverse the God-ordained roles of men and women.

Our culture today does not use veils or head coverings to indicate submission to authority. The roles of men and women have not changed, but the way we symbolize those roles changes with the culture. Rather than establish legalistic standards of hair length, we must remember that the real issue is our heart condition, our individual response to the authority of God, His ordained order, and our choice to walk in submission to that authority. Men and women have different, God-ordained roles, and part of that difference is shown by their hair. A man’s hair should look masculine. A woman’s hair should look feminine.

https://www.gotquestions.org/hair-length.html

Edited by missmuffet

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Posted
On 3/18/2020 at 12:59 PM, missmuffet said:

Take a look at this. It might explain what Paul was saying. 

Question: "What does the Bible say about hair length? Do men have to have short hair, and do women have to have long hair?"

Answer: 
A passage that mentions hair length in the New Testament is 1 Corinthians 11:3-15. The Corinthian church was in the middle of a controversy about the roles of men and women and the proper order of authority within the church. In the Corinthian society, women showed submission to their husbands by wearing a veil. It seems that some of the women in the church were discarding their veils, something that only pagan temple prostitutes or other rebellious women would do. For a woman to come to church without her veil would be dishonoring to her husband, as well as culturally confusing. By the same token, for a man to wear a veil or to somehow have his head covered during worship was not culturally acceptable in Corinth.

Paul appeals to biology to illustrate the appropriateness of following the cultural standards: women naturally have longer hair than men, and men are much more prone to baldness. That is, God created women with a “natural veil” and men with an “uncovered head.” If a woman spurns the mark of her submission (the veil), she may as well shave her head (verse 6). His point is that if the culture says a woman should not be bald (going without her natural covering), then why would she reject that same culture’s standard of wearing a veil (going without her cultural covering)?

For the man’s part, it is unnatural for him to have “long hair” (verse 14). His hair is naturally shorter (and thinner) than the woman’s. This corresponds to the Corinthian tradition of men not wearing a head covering during worship. Paul urges the church to conform to the generally held ideas of male and female appearance.

While hair length is not the main point of this passage of Scripture, we glean the following applications from it: 1) We should adhere to the culturally accepted indicators of gender. Men should look like men, and women should look like women. God is not interested in, nor does He accept, “unisex.” 2) We should not rebel against the culture just for the sake of rebelling, in the name of some sort of Christian “liberty.” It does matter how we present ourselves. 3) Women are to voluntarily place themselves under the authority of the male leadership of the church. 4) We should not reverse the God-ordained roles of men and women.

Our culture today does not use veils or head coverings to indicate submission to authority. The roles of men and women have not changed, but the way we symbolize those roles changes with the culture. Rather than establish legalistic standards of hair length, we must remember that the real issue is our heart condition, our individual response to the authority of God, His ordained order, and our choice to walk in submission to that authority. Men and women have different, God-ordained roles, and part of that difference is shown by their hair. A man’s hair should look masculine. A woman’s hair should look feminine.

https://www.gotquestions.org/hair-length.html

This is the temple prostitutes argument. This is a violation of adding a reason why Paul wrote the reasons WHY within 1 Corinthians 11 1-16.

 

In 1 Corinthians 11 1-16 the apostle Paul discusses women wearing prayer veils. Should women wear prayer veils? After much research and prayer, I was moved by the Spirit that half a chapter of Holy Scripture should not be ignored or treated as “incidental” and not preached by the churches.

What are some of the common arguments heard against women wearing prayer veils in the church? One of the most common is that the women’s hair is their covering. Another is that it was a custom of the time and not a principle. Let’s discuss these one at a time.

Many read only one verse v.15 out of the entire 16 verses and decide that women's hair is their covering, but such an interpretation would contradict itself and make the entire scripture nonsense.

Let’s take a closer look about what I am referring to. If her hair has been given to her as a natural covering verse 15 then in verse 5 why would it read if her head is uncovered meaning "bald" let her be more bald? See the contradiction to such an interpretation? Obviously, two different types of coverings are being discussed here. One is her hair, her natural covering for the outside world and her veil inside the church.

1 Corinthians 11:1-16 (KJV)
1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.
2 Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.
3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
4 Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head.
5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
7 For a man indeed ought not to cover 
his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
8 For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.
9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.
11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.
12 For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.
13 Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?
14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?
15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.
16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

When we read scripture, we tend to come to the scriptures with natural biases whether we realize it or not. We currently live in a post-feminist society. This world view has also infiltrated into the churches. It is difficult in our current society to interpret certain scripture when it goes against what societal norms and dictates. In our post-feminist society women wearing prayer veils would be considered sexist. Yet, so would many other teachings of the bible such as Pastors being men and the divine order discussed not only here 1 Corinthians but throughout the bible.

A veil may be whatever covering is customary for the day, other than hair. As long as the woman's head is covered is what the Apostle Paul was driving home in this half a chapter of Holy scripture regarding the topic. I try not to be dogmatic about what type of head covering it should be.

As I stated earlier another common argument against head coverings is that it was a custom at the time and does not apply to us today.

Principles are those commands of God that apply to all people at all time in every culture and in every life situation.

Customs are those things that are variant local applications of principles.

For example, in the NT the principle of tithing was there and in those days it was done in the Denarius or the Shekel. Does that mean that the only way we can please God today is by paying our tithes in Denarius or Shekel? Of course not! The monetary unit was customary the clothing styles those are the things that are subject to change from culture to culture from place to place. The principle of modesty applies to all generations, but how that modesty is manifested will differ from one country to another and from one time to another. We understand that those things are customary. Many times, distinguishing between custom and principles is a relatively easy matter, but not always sometimes it is excruciatingly difficult to make that distinction.

Here is the Principle to apply if you can't decide if something is a custom or principle. The biblical principle would be whatever is not of faith is a sin. The burden of proof is always going to be on those who argue that such and such a command is custom and not principle. If you are not sure then the principle that applies is treat it as a principle, because if you treat a custom as a principle then the only guilt you bear is being overly scrupulous, but if you take a principle of God and treat it as a local custom and don't observe it you have sinned against God.

Every serious student of the Word of God first seeks to discover its meaning and standards and then, and only then, to bring practice into conformity with it. Biblical principles determine Biblical practice. 

It would appear the church had a rich history of veiling for women up until the feminist movement launched a specific attack against the practice.

It was the "meaning" of this act that the feminist movement took offense to as does our current day society regarding "male headship in the home & church," which is God's order of creation that the Apostle Paul touched on in several of his epistles.

Excerpt used for EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY:  from Gardiner, Jeremy. Head Covering: A Forgotten Christian Practice for Modern Times Head Covering Movement. Kindle Edition.

The National Organization for Women (NOW) is a feminist organization founded by Betty Friedan (author of The Feminist Mystique). In 1968 they rallied their troops to have a “national unveiling.” Here’s what they said: “Because the wearing of a head covering by women at religious services is a symbol of subjection with many churches, NOW recommends that all chapters undertake an effort to have all women participate in a "national unveiling" by sending their head coverings to the task force chairman. At the spring meeting of the task force of women and religion, these veils will be publicly burned to protest the second class status of women in all churches.” [25] NOW rallied their various chapters to “undertake an effort” to stop the practice of head covering. They were so disgusted with the symbol and what it represented that they had a public burning of women’s veils. Sadly, their efforts achieved what they hoped it would.

 


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Posted (edited)

As Dr. Daniel Wallace (professor at Dallas Theological Seminary) wrote, “The argument that a real head covering is in view and that such is applicable today is, in some respects, the easiest view to defend exegetically and the hardest to swallow practically... The real danger, as I see it, is that many Christians simply ignore what this text says because any form of obedience to it is inconvenient.” However, obedience to Scripture is important – not only because disobedience dishonors God, but because His commands exist for a purpose. Paul states that the purpose of the headcovering is to honor the Lord's structure of headship and to promote His glory during communication with Him. Indeed, God's authority and glory are highly valued among His people. They are to be especially evident within marriage, a covenant intended to reflect the relationship between Christ and the Church (Ephesians 5:22-33).

One of Jesus' concerns with the Jewish leaders of His time was that they had let go of the “commands of God” in order to “hold onto the traditions of men” (Mark 7:8-9). Similarly, it can be tempting to forgo God's direction in v.2-16 in order to maintain conformity to the norms of modern Western culture. Knowing that some Christians would resist God's instructions in this passage, the Lord inspired Paul to promote unity in the practice of headcovering: “If one is inclined to be contentious, we have no other practice, nor have the churches of God” (v.16).

Phillips, David. Covered Glory: 1 Corinthians 11 & The Christian Use of Headcoverings .  

 

Edited by Servant of the Lord
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