divorce and remarriage cancer worse than corona

[BeauJangles]

12 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Despite the inherent model of marriage between God and humans..... 

.....marriage goes awry almost immediately! 

While this certainly can occur, generally speaking, marriages crumble over numerous long time issues. The possibilities are countless, but there are many common factors. Infidelity if one of the major ones. Addictions whether substances or others less serious can make splitting factors to crack a relationship. Anger management on either spouse is yet another. Violence, one more. I could go on but this is getting too dismal to dwell upon. Breakup and divorce is very sad. Yes, God hates it.  

[vic66]

21 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Despite the inherent model of marriage between God and humans..... 

.....marriage goes awry almost immediately! 

In Genesis 3 we see Adam completely avoid both his marital responsibility (value, protection, and sanctification) and his own self-responsibility, culpability and accountability. The firs thing he does when erring is hide. The second thing he does is throw his wife under the bus. "This woman you gave me!" is horrifying! He should have been happy - overjoyed - God didn't erase his existence from the face of creation the minute. 

We understand much about the nature of sin in that account, but how many contemplate the effects on marriage both described and exemplified in that event? By disobeying God Adam instantly became estranged. He was estranged from God, himself, another, and the earth over which just moments earlier he and his wife had been divinely mandated stewards. All undone in that single moment of disobedience. He was supposed to wash his wife with God's word, presenting her holy (separate) and blameless, loving her as Christ would one day in the future love the qahal/ekklesia. He did not do so. 

This estrangement then becomes the existing context for every example of marriage found in the Bible. The first context, as I have already described, is the Trinity. The second is the created order and relationship between God and man-in-His-image-both-male-and-female-united-in-marriage-with-Christ. At Genesis 3:7 that becomes corrupted. 

As I have already noted it is 19 chapters into the Bible before we read anything explicit mentioning "marry" or "marriage." The words "wed" or "wedding" aren't explicitly mentioned until the Psalms! Look it up. The silence is worth contemplating. The Tree of Life that is Christ, the bridegroom foreknown before the world was created to whom the qahal/ekklesia are destined to wed is absent in word all that time. Yet we continue to read of husbands and wives from the beginning. Despite his murderous conduct Cain conceives Enoch and builds the first city. This was not the same Enoch sired by the descendants of Seth. Almost immediately this bloodline marries multiple wives and fails at the fidelity of one man and one woman - a man and a woman (Gen. 2:24; Matthew 19:15; Ephesians 5:31). Meanwhile Adam and Eve (A&E) conceive Seth in the place of Abel, who then sires Enosh and the scriptures report this is where men begin to call upon the Lord (Gen. 4:26). There is no covenant explicitly established between A&E in the Genesis account but most Christians understand the commands to multiply, rule, subdue, and the promise of life to be an implicit covenant. Most Christians also understand marriage as a covenant even though the Genesis husband and wife of A&E are nowhere called such a thing. The first explicit mention of a covenant is found in Genesis 6 with God initiating one with Noah (his wife, and their family of six). Humanity gets erased from history in the flood except for these eight people and almost immediately sin returns with Noah's drunkenness and Ham's sodomy. The first curse ensues. I mention these things so as to highlight the recurring context of corruption existing in most mentions of marriage that follow in the Bible.

Abraham marries his sister and lies about it. He commits adultery with his wife's servant. He lies supposedly to protect himself from the predations of a (pagan) king and thereby fails in his roles of ruling, leading, protecting, loving, sanctifying, and sacrifice. Lot, Isaac, Laban, Jacob, Judah, Moses, and all the rest have imperfect marriages by the standards of today's understanding of scripture. Many don't realize after Sarah died Abraham remarried and had several sons! With great patience, suffering, striving, and a moment of disobedience Abraham had one covenant child. With apparent ease he had many outside the covenant and in the end he was buried with Sarah, not Keturah. If we leap forward to David we find he has at least four wives and the accumulation of many concubines. David kills two of the husbands before marrying the wives. 

Again: this is simply a short summary of how things ensue marriage-wise following Genesis 2:23-24. Lots of ways to go wrong and none are ideal. 

Christ's bride will be made and presented holy and blameless but we are neither in and of ourselves. 

Question what do you say to married couples who have been married second time and the first spouse is still living?

Remember their in sin according the the word of God New testament. 

 

[BeauJangles]

1 hour ago, Josheb said:

Beau (and others), the passive-aggressive comments about geniuses, etc. aren't helpful.

Just a reminder, Josheb about the term: FAIL. Please try not to take my complimenting your articulations, expressive word skills, and expansive usage of vocabulary as, "passive-aggressive". You're not one to easily be insulted so don't take it as such. 

[vic66]

On 7/17/2020 at 12:02 AM, BeauJangles said:

Hi vic66,

I see you're still posting this doctrinal erroneous tripe. I supposed expecting an enlightening one with an element of truth is yet beyond your grasp. That kinda makes my heart sink for you. What a dismal thought to dwell on. Oh well. I guess getting over it will be my only recourse. By the way, do you still hold on to that other error of saying the Apostle Paul teaches pastors, bishops, elders, deacons, and anyone else in leadership of church being the body of Christ should only be married one time in their entire life? Or have you taken stock of yourself as a result and changed your mind on all that other associated nonsense? 

Just curious, 

The BeauMeister

Marriage is a covenant between one man and woman  and God for life. 1cor6:9-10,luke16:18, mark10-11, 1cor7:10-11, 39, romans7:2-3, Heb13:4

Your problem is with Christ.

Edited July 18, 2020 by vic66

[Gideon]

30 minutes ago, vic66 said:

We must repent of the sin of adultery  forsake

Give it up, the wages of sin / adultery is death

But the gift of God is eternal lift you can't have both.

We must do that with unbelief as well. We are limiting tbe Holy One of Israel, refusing to believe we are new  creatures with new natures. knock off some rotten apples may seem like the. correct solution, but the problem is, the tree will just crank out more, maybe different ones, hut still sin. 

Until we come to finally HATE our old nature and its constant bringing forth bad fruits, divorce included, and lay the axe to the  root of the tree of self by reckoning it dead, we will simply sit here debating one another with our religious wisdom and the world will continue to refuse to listen to us or seek the Savior, because rhey do not see Him IN us, divorced or not. 

blessings, 

Gids

[BeauJangles]

17 minutes ago, vic66 said:

Your problem is with Christ.

Vic, this is by far the hugest statement in error you have made on this forum. EVER. You don't know me or my deep love for Jesus, or my heart after God for that matter. I forgive you for this insult. But, as is the commonality of this Jewish statement, "Forgive, but do not forget." 

[vic66]

5 minutes ago, Gideon said:

We must do that with unbelief as well. We are limiting tbe Holy One of Israel, refusing to believe we are new  creatures with new natures. knock off some rotten apples may seem like the. correct solution, but the problem is, the tree will just crank out more, maybe different ones, hut still sin. 

Until we come to finally HATE our old nature and its constant bringing forth bad fruits, divorce included, and lay the axe to the  root of the tree of self by reckoning it dead, we will simply sit here debating one another with our religious wisdom and the world will continue to refuse to listen to us or seek the Savior, because rhey do not see Him IN us, divorced or not. 

blessings, 

Gids

cant be in second marriage and preaching sorry wont work.

[BeauJangles]

10 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Marriages in the Bible go awry almost immediately. I wasn't talking about marriages outside the Bible. 

Perhaps I missed this. If your lengthy posts weren't so laborious making the point you're wishing to convey and cut to the chase, it might be less a chore for readers. Long posts tend to bore me quickly. No, I do not have an attention deficit disorder, by the way. 

P.S. I'm referring to posts that tend to ramble. Sorry, I missed placing this in. 

Edited July 18, 2020 by BeauJangles

[vic66]

6 minutes ago, Josheb said:

That depends on the circumstances of the first marriage and that divorce. There aren't any universal or "cookie-cutter" conditions. I have already stated many marriages are marriages in name only; they do not meet the scriptural standard of a covenant. 

having intercourse with a woman who  your not married to doesn't make you lawfully wedded to her.

[vic66]

 

 

  Source:  www.DivorceAndRemarriageBook.com

Josiah's Scott 

Death Has Always Loosed a Spouse

What Makes Remarriage Lawful? – Only Death Ends The Covenant

 

 

 

It is very clear throughout the Bible that death has always loosed a person so that they could lawfully marry a second spouse without defilement.

 

 

(1) The “Levirate Marriage” of The “Kinsman Redeemer”

 

Gen_38:6-8 CAB And Judah took a wife for Er his firstborn, whose name was Tamar.  7  And Er, the firstborn of Judah, was wicked before the Lord; and God killed him.  8  And Judah said to Onan, Go in to your brother’s wife, and marry her as her brother-in-law, and raise up seed to your brother.

 

 

We see that Er was lawfully married to Tamar, but Er died. Tamar was then able to lawfully marry Er’s brother, Onan, without sin.  It is clear from this that the ancients understood that death loosed a person to marry another.  This is reinforced in the Law of Moses:

 

 

Deu_25:5 CAB And if brothers should live together, and one of them should die, and should not have seed, the wife of the deceased shall not marry out of the family to a man not related: her husband’s brother shall go in to her, and shall take her to himself for a wife, and shall dwell with her.

 

 

In the same way, Luk_20:27-34 shows us that this could theoretically result in a woman having seven successive husbands without sin!

 

 

(2) Ruth and Naomi – Two Widows Contemplating Remarriage

 

In Rth_1:11-13 Naomi understood that she and her two widowed daughter-in-laws could theoretically get lawfully married to other men, but Naomi did not do this herself because she considered herself to be too old.  On the other hand, because Ruth was a young widow she married Boaz after her first husband died (Rth_1:4-5; Rth_3:9-11, Rth_3:18, Rth_4:1-13).

 

 

(3) 1Sa 25 – David and Abigail – No Matter How Challenging and Difficult it May Be, Only Death Looses

 

In first Samuel 25 we are given the account of David, Nabal, and Abigail. Abigail was a very wise woman who, ironically, was initially married to an exceedingly foolish and wicked husband named Nabal who opposed David in the midst of his hardships in the wilderness. But things drastically changed at the end of this chapter.

 

 

1Sa_25:38-42 CAB And it came to pass after about ten days, that the Lord struck Nabal, and he died.  39  And David heard it and said, Blessed be the Lord, who has judged the cause of my reproach at the hand of Nabal, and has delivered his servant from the power of evil; and the Lord has returned the mischief of Nabal upon his own head. And David sent and spoke concerning Abigail, to take her to himself for a wife.  40  So the servants of David came to Abigail to Carmel, and spoke to her, saying, David has sent us to you, to take you to himself for a wife.  41  And she arose, and bowed down with her face to the earth, and said, Behold, your servant is for a handmaid, to wash the feet of your servants.  42  And Abigail arose and mounted her donkey, and five maidens followed her. And she went after the servants of David, and became his wife.

 

 

1Sa 25 – Application – DEATH is the Only Way Out of a “Bad Marriage”

 

We see from this account that David did not speak one word about marrying Abigail until after it was clear that God had killed her first husband. No matter how bad Abigail’s marriage to Nabal was, David understood that only death would loose Abigail to be a lawful candidate for marriage to himself. And just as Abigail was faithful to her marriage to Nabal, so also (at a time when polygamy was allowed) David remained faithful to his difficult marriage to Michael until the day of her death (2Sa_6:16-23; 1Ch_15:29).

So what should we understand from this? No matter how bad of a marriage two people may have, it is God’s divine institution which we must reverence until He himself ends it. In one case we see that God was faithful to deliver Abigail out of her difficult marriage by killing Nabal. In the other case we see that even when David was not delivered from his difficult marriage, David still remained faithful to the one flesh covenant which God had bound him in. This is what it actually means to be a person of faith; this is what it means to be a real man or woman of God, who obeys God’s commandments even if it costs them all the comforts of this life.

And especially because we are commanded to love and pray even for our enemies in the New Covenant (Mat_5:43-48) it is clear that we cannot go about praying for the death of our spouse, but rather, we ought to pray for the heart of supernatural courage as David and Abigail had, who reverenced God’s covenant by faith under the most disheartening circumstances, because they made obedience to the righteous demands of God to be their sole consolation and refused to gratify the raging insanity of the whimsical demands of the flesh to have circumstantial peace and comfort in this short and temporary life. They believe the testimony of God above the agony of their very own souls, so God wrote down their righteous souls in His Holy Scripture as a standard for us to this day.

 

 

>> Add: God can get you out of a bad marriage... Through death. - I actually use this when counseling despairing spouses.

 

 

(4) Roman Seven

 

Rom_7:2-3 CAB For the woman who is under a man has been bound by law to the living husband. But if the husband should die, she is released from the law of the husband.  3  So then, while the husband is living, she will be called an adulteress if she becomes married to a different husband; but if her husband should die, she is free from the law, so that she is not an adulteress, having become married to a different husband.

 

 

(5) First Corinthians Seven

 

1Co_7:8-9, 1Co_7:27-28 – Encourages celibacy for widows (during the current distress) but permits marriage

 

 

1Co_7:39-40 WEB  A wife is bound by law for as long as her husband lives; but if the husband is dead, she is free [ἐλευθέρα – lit. a loosed type of person (the word “free” is somewhat figurative)] to be married to whoever she desires, only in the Lord.  40  But she is happier if she stays as she is, in my judgment, and I think that I also have God’s Spirit.

 

 

(6) First Timothy

 

1Ti_5:14 CAB Therefore I desire that the younger widows to marry, to bear children, to manage the house, to give no opportunity to the adversary because of reproach.

 

 

A Summary of Being “Glued”/ “Joined” and “Bound,” Together

We see that the Bible says that being joined and bound in marriage by God produces a permanent, God-performed, one flesh bond for life. Some have attempted to interpret the Bible as to contradict its self by saying that marriage bonds could be broken by a divorce. But we can clearly see from Scripture that being bound in the marriage covenant cannot be undone by anything but death, and this is without exception (Rom_7:2; 1Co_7:39)!

No wonder it’s permanent! God is the one that makes the two one! And it says, “... he shall open, and there shall be none to shut; and he shall shut, and there shall be none to open,” (Isa_22:22 CAB). This is repeated in Job_12:14, and in Rev_3:7. (Also see Job_9:12; Job_11:10). Scripture also clearly says that you cannot change what God says. See Deu_4:2; Deu_12:32; Rev_22:18-19; Joh_13:16. So whatever He says and or does concerning marriage sticks despite all the efforts of man.

Galatians 3:15 says, “Brothers, I speak like men. Though it is only a man’s covenant, yet when it has been confirmed, no one makes it void, or adds to it.” (Gal_3:15 WEB). If this is the case with a human covenant, which is merely witnessed by men, (and afterward enforced by God) then how much more absolutely unbreakable is a covenant that is both established and enforced by God Himself? And this we can clearly see to be the case even with the Scriptures concerning marriage quoted so far.

 

Edited July 18, 2020 by vic66