JERUSALEM IS FALLING

[angels4u]

7 hours ago, wingnut- said:

 

It's easily refutable, and I have already refuted it, but just to expand on the point let's take a closer look.

 

Revelation 12:5 She gave birth to a male child, one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child was caught up to God and to his throne, 6 and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, in which she is to be nourished for 1,260 days.

 

Now what we see in verse 5 is a representation of Christ's resurrection, where it states the child was caught up to God, the Greek word harpazo is used.  And what follows that according to John?

 

Revelation 12:7 Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon. And the dragon and his angels fought back, 8 but he was defeated, and there was no longer any place for them in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world—he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

 

So satan was thrown down to earth in 33 AD following the resurrection of Christ, and then He pursues the woman.  Jesus spoke this just prior to His death and foretold the event was at hand.

 

John 12:30 Jesus answered, “This voice has come for your sake, not mine. 31 Now is the judgment of this world; now will the ruler of this world be cast out. 32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.”

 

Now when it comes to Petra we know quite a bit historically, for starters, Petra was the burial place of Aaron.  According to historians and archaeologists, Petra was originally occupied by bedouins that descended from Edomites, but it was the Nabataeans that developed the city and it served as their capital city.  It became wealthy because of its location midway between the Persian and Greek empires and thrived as a trade center in the region.

Petra became historically known in 312 BC when the Greeks decided to attack the city, most likely to seize the wealth for themselves.  The Greeks were defeated at that time and the Nabataeans would continue to rule Petra until 106 AD when the Romans took control of the area.  Somewhere in between 33 AD and 106 AD, Petra became Christian, which has been discovered through numerous archaeological digs at the site.  The temples within had been converted to a Christian theme, which prompted the Romans to burn them.

The area is renowned for its flooding, which prompted the Nabataeans to develop one of the most sophisticated and impressive water systems ever discovered.  Through a series of dams, cisterns, and aqueducts they devised a system that took in all the rainfall in the flood season and keep it constantly circulating so that even in the worst droughts they had water year round.  This water system that they designed offers explanation to what we are told in Revelation regarding this passage.

 

Revelation 12:15 The serpent poured water like a river out of his mouth after the woman, to sweep her away with a flood. 16 But the earth came to the help of the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed the river that the dragon had poured from his mouth.

 

The entire water system was designed from the mountainous terrain itself, and made it so that the earth, literally swallowed up the flood waters.  It also speaks to the fact that this ingenious plan for the system itself was divinely inspired.

Petra suffered two major earthquakes, the first in 151 AD, which reportedly led to the collapse of half the city.  The second major earthquake to hit Petra led to its demise, in 353 AD during the Byzantine period the quake was so massive that the water system was irreparably damaged and the city could no longer sustain life or keep the seasonal flood waters out.  Petra was largely abandoned at this time, though the bedouins continued to use the area during the dry season, but Petra was lost to the world until the early 19th century when a Swiss traveler stumbled upon it.

In 2007 UNESCO declared Petra to be one of the New 7 wonders of the world, and following that declaration the Jordanian government took control over the area, displacing the bedouins permanently.  Today Petra is the largest tourist attraction in Jordan, but is only accessible at certain times of the year and only those cleared by the Jordanian government are permitted to visit the site.

So, you see, Petra is no longer available in the 21st century, and it is no longer a livable area because of the constant flooding that continues to plague the area.

Wing, do you believe that prophecy happened  already? Look around what is going on in Israel, prophecy is being fulfilled there just like the Bible says it will happen,the child is Israel and God will protect her during the tribulation  in Petra, Petra still exist , all the things in Revelation still need to happen and it will mostly played out in Israel and the Middle East. God will make sure that the Jews will be protected during these days.

 

 

 

[Revelation Man]

11 hours ago, wingnut- said:

It's easily refutable, and I have already refuted it, but just to expand on the point let's take a closer look.

 

It takes you a week or so to try and come up with a plan to answer my points, it takes me mere moments to rebut. I refute all things that are not in accord with the Lord's word. God demands perfect symmetry in His word brother. 

11 hours ago, wingnut- said:

Revelation 12:5 She gave birth to a male child, one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child was caught up to God and to his throne, 6 and the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, in which she is to be nourished for 1,260 days.

 

Now what we see in verse 5 is a representation of Christ's resurrection, where it states the child was caught up to God, the Greek word harpazo is used.  And what follows that according to John?

Nothing past Rev. 4:1 is about the past, or should I say before the Rapture, its all about the 70th week. What you do is take a "CODE" God and Jesus gave John that reveals to mankind what is being spoken of in Rev. 12:6-17, and you turn "THE CODE" (VERSES 1-5) into the point of emphasis, which it is not, the point of emphasis is on the Woman (Israel) Fleeing Judea to the Mountains of Petra/Bozrah. (No one says its just the Petra area, that is just the most well know name for the area, its all of the Bozrah area. In many of my posts I write in Petra/Bozrah.)

11 hours ago, wingnut- said:

Revelation 12:7 Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon. And the dragon and his angels fought back, 8 but he was defeated, and there was no longer any place for them in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world—he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

 

So satan was thrown down to earth in 33 AD following the resurrection of Christ, and then He pursues the woman.  Jesus spoke this just prior to His death and foretold the event was at hand.

Verse 6 should go with this, seeing as verses 1-5 is "THE CODE". Then we get "THE PROPHECY" which is "HEREAFTER" like Revelation 4:1 says...... Rev. 4:1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

This event is not about 70 AD, its about the 70th week end times that Jesus spoke of in Matt. 24:15-17 and Matt. 24:21-24.  Satan is not yet cast down man !! Where do you guys come up with this stuff? 

11 hours ago, wingnut- said:

John 12:30 Jesus answered, “This voice has come for your sake, not mine. 31 Now is the judgment of this world; now will the ruler of this world be cast out. 32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.”

 

Satan has not been judged, hes still in charge, he has not been cast down to earth, if you took the time to read Daniel 12:1-2 you would know this. Above Jesus is speaking about the fact the "HE PROVED" men with Flesh can resit the temptation of the devil. Thus he was a spotless Lamb without Sin, thus he defeated Satan that day, Judgment was passed, Satan had no more claim on mankind, now we were able to overcome the Wicked One by the blood of the Lamb. Its not about a Physical victory, but a Spiritual victory. 

I wonder how yo are going to make this go away? BELOW

Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up,(Rev. 12) the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Its the VERY END when Micheal STANDS UP, not 70 AD. No one was raised from the Dead in 70 AD !! This whole chapter is about the 70th week, the last 1260 days which brings an END TO THESE WONDERS (Second Coming). 

The 1335 comes first its the "Two-witnesses" who TURN Israel back unto God BEFORE the DOTL like Malachi 4:5-6 says.

The 1290 comes next, its the Jewish False Prophet (a Jewish High Priest like unto Jason under Antiochus) that FORBIDS Jesus Worship (takes away the Sacrifice/Jesus) and places the AoD Image of the European President/King in the Temple, he will be the Beast after he Conquers Jerusalem/Israel/Mediterranean Sea Region.

The 1260 is when the Anti-Christ Conquers the Nations in the Mediterranean Region and Israel (THE MANY) and thus rules for 1260 days over the Region as THE BEAST. The 1/3 of Jews who repent will flee unto the Petra/Bozrah area where God will protect them. We know this is where Jesus comes from when he returns by reading of all things SCRIPTURES. Notice, in Rev. 14 he has these Jews (144,000) with him on the Mt. of Olives (gathers them into his Fathers Barn so to speak).

THE QUESTION:

Isaiah 63:1 Who is this that cometh from Edom, with dyed garments from Bozrah? this that is glorious in his apparel, travelling in the greatness of his strength? (THE MESSIAH ANSWERS) I that speak in righteousness, mighty to save. (The Covenant people again INQUIRE)2 Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel, and thy garments like him that treadeth in the winefat?

(THE MESSIAH {Jesus Christ} ANSWERS)3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment. 4 For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.

5 And I looked, and there was none to help; and I wondered that there was none to uphold: therefore mine own arm brought salvation unto me; and my fury, it upheld me. 6 And I will tread down the people in mine anger, and make them drunk in my fury, and I will bring down their strength to the earth.

(The Prayer of the Remnant or 1/3 who Repent) 7 I will mention the lovingkindnesses of the Lord, and the praises of the Lord, according to all that the Lord hath bestowed on us, and the great goodness toward the house of Israel, which he hath bestowed on them according to his mercies, and according to the multitude of his lovingkindnesses. 8 For he said, Surely they are my people, children that will not lie: so he was their Saviour.

9 In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them (Micheal STOOD UP): in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; and he bare them, and carried them all the days of old. 10 But they rebelled, and vexed his holy Spirit: therefore he was turned to be their enemy, and he fought against them. 11 Then he remembered the days of old, Moses, and his people, saying, Where is he that brought them up out of the sea with the shepherd of his flock? where is he that put his holy Spirit within him? 12 That led them by the right hand of Moses with his glorious arm, dividing the water before them, to make himself an everlasting name? 13 That led them through the deep, as an horse in the wilderness, that they should not stumble? 14 As a beast goeth down into the valley, the Spirit of the Lord caused him to rest: so didst thou lead thy people, to make thyself a glorious name.

(A voice calls out from an estranged people bringing an appeal to the Father, and to the throne of God in the heavens, in accordance with the covenant of Abraham)  15 Look down from heaven, and behold from the habitation of thy holiness and of thy glory: where is thy zeal and thy strength, the sounding of thy bowels and of thy mercies toward me? are they restrained?

16 Doubtless thou art our father, though Abraham be ignorant of us, and Israel acknowledge us not: thou, O Lord, art our father, our redeemer; thy name is from everlasting. 17 O Lord, why hast thou made us to err from thy ways, and hardened our heart from thy fear? Return for thy servants' sake, the tribes of thine inheritance. 18 The people of thy holiness have possessed it but a little while: our adversaries have trodden down thy sanctuary. 19 We are thine: thou never barest rule over them; they were not called by thy name.

 

When Jesus comes to save God's Sheep in Bozrah, he does so with BLOOD STAINED GARMENTS for a reason. Of course its just prose, Jesus will just SPEAK VICTORY and defeat them WITHOUT HAND as Daniel is told in many places.

Micah 2:12 I will surely assemble, O Jacob, all of thee; I will surely gather the remnant of Israel; I will put them together as the sheep of Bozrah, as the flock in the midst of their fold: they shall make great noise by reason of the multitude of men. 13 The breaker is come up before them: they have broken up, and have passed through the gate, and are gone out by it: and their king shall pass before them, and the Lord on the head of them.

Revelation 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

11 hours ago, wingnut- said:

Revelation 12:15 The serpent poured water like a river out of his mouth after the woman, to sweep her away with a flood. 16 But the earth came to the help of the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed the river that the dragon had poured from his mouth.

 

The entire water system was designed from the mountainous terrain itself, and made it so that the earth, literally swallowed up the flood waters.  It also speaks to the fact that this ingenious plan for the system itself was divinely inspired.

As per the Water out of the mouth of the Dragon, that is of course referring to an ARMY, the Anti-Christs Army, not a flood of actual water. This is a well known idiom sir. When Jerusalem is SACKED in 70 AD it was by a FLOOD ALSO, but it was the Roman Army. 

Dan. 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

Its referring to an Army that FLOODS a city, or SWAMPS it like a flood would do. The same type FLOOD is referred to in Revelation chapter 12, where you are saying its about an actual flood. Its not. Satan sends the Anti-Christs Army to try to kill the Fleeing Jews, that is why they FLEE Judea of course, they are in peril.  

P.S. NOTICE whom the Anti-Christ/Beast/Little Horn/ King of the North can't defeat in Daniel 11......

Daniel 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.

41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon. (Central and Southern Jordan/the Petra/Bozrah area)

42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape. 43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps (All North Africa).

He Conquers Jerusalem, all of North Africa, no doubt Lebanon and Syria, but the Petra/Bozrah area is OFF LIMITS to him, he is not allowed to Conquer this area. The Jews (144,000 = ALL Israel) flee here and God protects them in the Petra/Bozrah area for 1260 days. 

Edited August 23, 2020 by Revelation Man

[abcdef]

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

It is useless to continue with someone that sees everything as symbols. I hope your theories work out well for you.  

Walk towards the light, don't turn away and return to darkness,

Especially now that the Bridegroom is coming.

-----

He will be here exactly 3 1/2 days after Jerusalem falls to Iran and Russia at the 7th trumpet/2 Witnesses (2W's).

If you want to understand, I can tell you.

If you don't want to understand, then you will see it happen anyway without understand the application of the scriptures.

-----

These prophecies are like a jigsaw puzzle.

People have tried to put the pieces together for 1900 years.

They try to identify events in the time line of history, to identify where we are in relation to the coming of Jesus at the resur/rapt.

Some pieces fit, but there were some pieces that did not seem to fit together.

The reason that they didn't fit together is because not all of the pieces were there.

Some of the events shown in the Revelation, had to take place and be history, before it was revealed, where we were in the prophetic time line.

That is, it is easier to identify events in the time line of history years after they have past, rather than looking into the future to identify them and understand the details of how they relate to the scriptures.

--------

The 6th trumpet is an example of this.

The story of the 2W's is given after the 6th trumpet.

This seems to imply that the story of the 2W's would not be understood until after the 6th trumpet blows.

The scroll of the 7 seals is revealed and understood as the story of the 2W's.

The 2 witnesses (2W's) are the people of Israel.

The story of the 2W's is that Jerusalem is restored to Israel after the 70 AD- 1967 tribulation period.

But in the past, before 1967, It was always unknown whether Jerusalem would be restored or not.

But since Jerusalem has been restored since 1967, that place in the Revelation time line can be positively identified and confirmed.

 -------

The good news is Jesus is coming for the kingdom at the 7th trumpet.

The bad news is that after His coming this planet ends in fire and no one survives.

--------

The Bridegroom is coming,

You want to sleep while the trumpet blows? 

That is up to you.

 

[abcdef]

9 hours ago, wingnut- said:

Revelation 12:15 The serpent poured water like a river out of his mouth after the woman, to sweep her away with a flood. 16 But the earth came to the help of the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed the river that the dragon had poured from his mouth.

May I suggest, that the waters that are sent out are people, armies of the Roman Empire chasing the woman Israel into the wilderness of the gentile nations after the 70 AD destruction of Jerusalem.

[wingnut-]

2 hours ago, angels4u said:

Wing, do you believe that prophecy happened  already?

 

I know it did.

 

2 hours ago, angels4u said:

Look around what is going on in Israel, prophecy is being fulfilled there just like the Bible says it will happen,the child is Israel and God will protect her during the tribulation  in Petra, Petra still exist

 

At its height Petra was home to a maximum of 30,000 people, now 85% of that city is buried by the earthquakes.  How many people live in Israel today?  1/3 of them today wouldn't have fit in Petra when the whole city was available.  Now it is impossible for anyone to be there because it floods, consistently, and the water system was destroyed.  On top of that, since people keep saying this is where the Jews would go, how good of a hiding spot would it be lol.

Best to follow what scripture says, Jesus told us that satan was being cast out of heaven as a result of the crucifixion, believe it.

[wingnut-]

2 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Satan is not yet cast down man !! Where do you guys come up with this stuff? 

 

I believe Jesus, and I posted one of the passages where He told us that satan was about to be cast out of heaven.  Jude confirmed this had already taken place by the time he wrote.

 

Jude 1:6 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day—

 

2 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Dan. 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

 

And this is why your theory goes sideways, that passage is about the Messiah, not the boogeyman.  Like I said, you don't understand Daniel.

[abcdef]

Satan was cast down on the day of Pentecost.

The war in heaven was between Jesus being taken up in Acts 1:9 and the day of Pentecost.

This is shown in Rev 12:10 where it says, "Now is come salvation", "and the kingdom of our God", at the time when Satan is cast down.

This all happens before the woman Israel is chased into the wilderness of the gentile nations by the Roman Empire dragon/beast in 70 AD.

[Revelation Man]

1 hour ago, wingnut- said:

I believe Jesus, and I posted one of the passages where He told us that satan was about to be cast out of heaven.  Jude confirmed this had already taken place by the time he wrote.

 

No you didn't, because it doesn't say that. You think it says that.

 

1 hour ago, wingnut- said:

Jude 1:6 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day—

 

This is about the Demonic entities that did not refrain from going with Human women. Nothing more.

1 hour ago, wingnut- said:

And this is why your theory goes sideways, that passage is about the Messiah, not the boogeyman.  Like I said, you don't understand Daniel.

The passage is about the Anti-Christ, of course you dodged the FLOOD PART which proves your other understanding to be in error.

1 hour ago, wingnut- said:

At its height Petra was home to a maximum of 30,000 people, now 85% of that city is buried by the earthquakes.  How many people live in Israel today?  1/3 of them today wouldn't have fit in Petra when the whole city was available.  Now it is impossible for anyone to be there because it floods, consistently, and the water system was destroyed.  On top of that, since people keep saying this is where the Jews would go, how good of a hiding spot would it be lol.

Best to follow what scripture says, Jesus told us that satan was being cast out of heaven as a result of the crucifixion, believe it.

Its not just Petra, its the whole Mountain Range !!

Ammon, Moab and Edom is a HUGE AREA !! Jesus states they flee to the Mountains. This area is capable of hosting literally millions of people. Sela is the Petra city, but its not the whole area. Edom is bigger than Judah. It is said you could put all 8 Billion people in New York City (under cramped conditions. 

[wingnut-]

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

No you didn't, because it doesn't say that. You think it says that.

 

I know it says that.  I am not given over to my imagination.

 

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

2 hours ago, wingnut- said:

Jude 1:6 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day—

 

This is about the Demonic entities that did not refrain from going with Human women. Nothing more.

 

LOL and yet it says angels, major fail on your part.  As I said previously, I know you are given over to your own imagination and I'm not posting for your benefit, others can read for themselves.  All I know is it is time for Christians to walk in victory and let go of imagination.

[iamlamad]

4 hours ago, abcdef said:

Walk towards the light, don't turn away and return to darkness,

Especially now that the Bridegroom is coming.

-----

He will be here exactly 3 1/2 days after Jerusalem falls to Iran and Russia at the 7th trumpet/2 Witnesses (2W's).

If you want to understand, I can tell you.

If you don't want to understand, then you will see it happen anyway without understand the application of the scriptures.

-----

These prophecies are like a jigsaw puzzle.

People have tried to put the pieces together for 1900 years.

They try to identify events in the time line of history, to identify where we are in relation to the coming of Jesus at the resur/rapt.

Some pieces fit, but there were some pieces that did not seem to fit together.

The reason that they didn't fit together is because not all of the pieces were there.

Some of the events shown in the Revelation, had to take place and be history, before it was revealed, where we were in the prophetic time line.

That is, it is easier to identify events in the time line of history years after they have past, rather than looking into the future to identify them and understand the details of how they relate to the scriptures.

--------

The 6th trumpet is an example of this.

The story of the 2W's is given after the 6th trumpet.

This seems to imply that the story of the 2W's would not be understood until after the 6th trumpet blows.

The scroll of the 7 seals is revealed and understood as the story of the 2W's.

The 2 witnesses (2W's) are the people of Israel.

The story of the 2W's is that Jerusalem is restored to Israel after the 70 AD- 1967 tribulation period.

But in the past, before 1967, It was always unknown whether Jerusalem would be restored or not.

But since Jerusalem has been restored since 1967, that place in the Revelation time line can be positively identified and confirmed.

 -------

The good news is Jesus is coming for the kingdom at the 7th trumpet.

The bad news is that after His coming this planet ends in fire and no one survives.

--------

The Bridegroom is coming,

You want to sleep while the trumpet blows? 

That is up to you.

It's useless to post against imagination. Total waste of time.