Question On John 3:8

[Riverwalker]

When Jesus is talking about being born again he says the following

8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

And in all my years as a Christian, I have never really been able to wrap my head around it.  Love to hear your insight.

 

Scripture in context

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

[hdtwice]

Just as you can see after a wind has gone through and rearranged leaves etc., the same thing is with the Spirit. It has a way of rearranging lives. After a windstorm, you see the results. After a new birth in the Spirit, you see the results, as well.

So the point that Jesus was making was that just as the wind cannot be controlled or understood by human beings but its effects can be witnessed, so also it is with the Holy Spirit.

[Deborah_]

Like the wind, the Holy Spirit is invisible and unpredictable. We can’t dictate the time, place and manner of His manifestations.

Yet He has powerful effects on the lives of ordinary people - effects that can be readily observed.

[Billiards Ball]

15 hours ago, Riverwalker said:

When Jesus is talking about being born again he says the following

8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

And in all my years as a Christian, I have never really been able to wrap my head around it.  Love to hear your insight.

 

Scripture in context

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

1) Modern meteorologists are still sometimes surprised by wind behavior (scientific/prescient Bible accuracy).

2) We are sometimes surprised at who receives Jesus as Savior. We are to witness to many people, not knowing before we do who will be touched by the Spirit as we evangelize.

 

[johnthebaptist]

15 hours ago, Riverwalker said:

When Jesus is talking about being born again he says the following

8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

And in all my years as a Christian, I have never really been able to wrap my head around it.  Love to hear your insight.

 

Scripture in context

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

At first glance, my take is simply we can never fully understand God. I would add that we can understand his commandments, though.

[Walter and Deborah]

16 hours ago, Riverwalker said:

When Jesus is talking about being born again he says the following

8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

And in all my years as a Christian, I have never really been able to wrap my head around it.  Love to hear your insight.

 

Scripture in context

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

Amen, I have experienced, sometimes up or down, but I must move when He have made me to understand about an issue of what I must do.

Being born of His spirit means to me that I must take heed of myself to his sayings, before I do a certain thing.

Now! I think I can remember, when Jesus says "to take my yoke upon you and learn of me" I think what He meant is, how would He handle an issue.

And Paul said, whatsoever ye do in word or deed, to do all in the name the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

So I would say unless one is born of water and spirit, they can not enter the Kingdom of God, now what is your insight ?

Love, Walter

[enoob57]

The context begins with 
John 3:1-2
1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him. KJV
Identified as Pharisee and also the growing rift in their ranks about the reality of miracles being performed either by God or devil: (Matt 12:24)
We know these two things by (above) about Nicodemus:
1: Salvation by keeping law. (This the core of Pharisaical teaching) 
2: Reality of God by signs and wonders or other of the devil.
Keeping of law was the total of Nicodemus toward salvation but what drove him to Jesus was the division as to the evident power God or devil! Evident question in him as he sided with Jesus was by God doing these things thus Nicodemus reckoned Jesus more than himself in relation to God for being able to do these things... the stage is now set 

John 3:3
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. KJV
By Nicodemus revealing his own heart in believing by signs and wonders Jesus was of God... Jesus goes to the depth of what it takes to have salvation from God...
As the beginning sin caused separation from God by death of spirit thus man had to be reborn s/Spiritually...

John 3:4
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?  KJV
Because Nicodemus could only connect in flesh with truth; his understanding could only be flesh... (1Cor 2:14)

John 3:5-7
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. KJV
Jesus tells us here why unredeemed flesh cannot save for God is keeping none of it nor the place in which it was born nor even the memory of such... The number one understanding of God 'IS' His complete Holiness (1Jn 1:5) and God's intended judgment of such (Job 34:15-33)

John 3:7
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.  KJV
The absolute belief of Nicodemus- was Jesus, that was before Him, was closer to God than He by the signs an wonders yet the answer he was given was not by flesh... so all his understanding of salvation (his whole life was built upon law) was now made moot and he, himself had to look outside of all that he was to accept the necessary of salvation... His face must have radiated wonder, confusion, desperation, need of help etc... 

John 3:8
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.  KJV
So Jesus takes the creation by His Word and adorns Nicodemus the reality of s/Spiritual life and the substance from which it is born out of 'faith'... In the beginning, before sin, Adam received The Word Witnessed- that being the all that was around him was By God's Breath, Jesus Speaking out that which is (from that which was not) and with all the wonder that 'IS' Adam accepted as so (Heb 11:1-3) (for no lie had been formed at this point by Lucifer...) (Gen 2:1-3) It is the essence of faith, (born out of God's Word), which leads us to God but never can encompass God... as we were began in God's infinite not understanding the source from which God has come, (for there is none), nor the eternal in which we are being taken... (2Cor 2:9-13)

[missmuffet]

It is the inward purification and renewal produced by the Holy Spirit that brings forth spiritual life to the dead sinner. 

[David1701]

20 hours ago, Riverwalker said:

When Jesus is talking about being born again he says the following

8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

And in all my years as a Christian, I have never really been able to wrap my head around it.  Love to hear your insight.

 

Scripture in context

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

John 3:1-10 (EMTV)

1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees whose name was Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews.
  2 This man came to Him by night and said to Him, "Rabbi, we know that You have come from God as a teacher; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him."
  3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
  4 Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born, being old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?"
  5 Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
  6  That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
  7  Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
  8  "The wind blows where it wills, and you hear its sound, but you do not know from where it comes and where it goes. So is everyone who has been born of the Spirit."
  9 Nicodemus answered and said to Him, "How can these things be?"
  10 Jesus answered and said to him, "Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not know these things?

1) Nicodemus starts with, "Rabbi, we know...", implying that there had been conversation amongst the Pharisees, regarding Jesus, and that Nicodemus had come to Jesus as a result of that conversation, possibly as a representative.  He then mentions the signs that Jesus was doing (the signs being physically visible miracles, pointing to something very important).

Jesus responds by answering Nicodemus' point about what could be seen with the physical eyes, by telling him about what is needed to "see" the kingdom of God - being born again.

Summary: Nicodemus - outward, visible signs -------------- Jesus: - spiritual sight of the kingdom of God

2) Nicodemus again speaks about the physical and outward, asking how it is possible to be physically born, entering his mother's womb again, once one is old.  Jesus responds by telling him that, unless someone is born physically (born of water is a Hebraism referring to normal, natural birth) and born of the Spirit (i.e. born again, becoming spiritually alive, with spiritual senses), he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

Summary: Nicodemus - outward, physical birth and re-entering his mother's womb ------------- Jesus: spiritual birth needed, not merely normal, physical birth, to enter the kingdom of God.

3) Jesus then tells Nicodemus about a third comparison of the physical with the spiritual - wind with Spirit.  The physical wind blows about, creating effects that can be felt and seen, but without being seen itself; so it is, in the spiritual realm, with the Holy Spirit, who makes people born again; but He cannot be predicted or seen, yet the effects are felt and seen spiritually.

4) Nicodemus, although the foremost teacher in Israel, could not understand spiritual realities, because he was not born again, so he lacked the spiritual senses with which to perceive them.

1 Cor. 2:14 (EMTV) But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

 

 

[Walter and Deborah]

8 hours ago, Walter and Deborah said:

Amen, I have experienced, sometimes up or down, but I must move when He have made me to understand about an issue of what I must do.

Being born of His spirit means to me that I must take heed of myself to his sayings, before I do a certain thing.

Now! I think I can remember, when Jesus says "to take my yoke upon you and learn of me" I think what He meant is, how would He handle an issue.

And Paul said, whatsoever ye do in word or deed, to do all in the name the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

So I would say unless one is born of water and spirit, they can not enter the Kingdom of God, now what is your insight ?

Love, Walter

Also, I was reading from Enduring Word Bible Commentary about John 3:8:

(5-8) Jesus explains the new birth.

Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

a. Most assuredly… you must be born again: Jesus was emphatic in saying that man does not need reformation, but a radical conversion by the Spirit of God. We must be born of water and the Spirit.

i. “In verse 3 Jesus has spoken of ‘seeing’ the kingdom of God, whereas here He speaks of ‘entering’ it. There is probably no great difference of meaning.” 

ii. Most assuredly: “The words add solemnity to and underline the truth of what follows. The modern expressions, ‘In truth I tell you’, ‘Believe me when I say’, ‘I do assure you’, convey the meaning.” 

iii. Unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God: If a nation passed a law that said no one could live there except those who were born in that nation, and someone wanted to live there who was not born there.

· It wouldn’t matter if he took a name that was common in that nation.

· It wouldn’t matter if he spoke the language.

· It wouldn’t matter if he observed some of the customs.

· It wouldn’t matter if he dressed like those in that nation.

· It wouldn’t matter if he practiced some of the religious traditions of that nation.

· It wouldn’t matter if his parents were born in that nation.

· It wouldn’t matter if his children were born there.

· It wouldn’t matter if he had many friends in that nation.

· All that would matter was if he was actually born there.

iv. “A man may cast away many vices, forsake many lusts in which he indulged, and conquer evil habits, but no man in the world can make himself to be born of God; though he should struggle never so much, he could never accomplish what is beyond his power. And, mark you, if he could make himself to be born again, still he would not enter heaven, because there is another point in the condition which he would have violated — ‘unless a man be born of the Spirit, he cannot see the kingdom of God.’” 

b. You must be born of water: We know from John 3:10 that whatever being born of water was, it should have been familiar to Nicodemus from the Old Testament.

i. Some have thought born of water means to be baptized. Water here may represent baptism, but there is no real Old Testament foundation for this.

ii. Some have thought that born of water refers to our physical birth, since we come forth from a sack of water. This approach is more attractive, but doesn’t it simply state the obvious? However, it does make a good parallel with the idea of that which is born of the flesh in John 3:6.

iii. Some have thought that born of water means to be born again by the Word of God. In other passages of Scripture, water represents the Word, as we are washed by the water of the word (Ephesians 5:26).

iv. Some have thought that born of water means to be regenerated by the Holy Spirit, the living water of John 7:38-39.

v. Some have thought that born of water means to receive the water of cleansing prophesied in Ezekiel 36:25-28 as part of the New Covenant. This is the approach has the most weight (though it is a tough call), because of its firm connections to Old Testament prophecy – which Jesus says Nicodemus should have know to understand these things.

c. That which is born of the flesh is flesh: Without the new birth of the Spirit, the flesh taints all works of righteousness. Yet, everything that a Spirit-led man does can be pleasing to God.

i. “In this flesh is included every part of that which is born after the ordinary method of generation: even the spirit of man, which, receptive as it is of the Spirit of God, is yet in the natural birth dead, sunk in trespasses and sins.” 

d. Do not marvel that I said to you, “You must be born again”: Again, Nicodemus did marvel at this statement, because he – like most all Jews of his time – believed they already had the inner transformation promised in the New Covenant. Jesus wants him to take hold of the fact that he does not have it, and must be born again.

i. We should not forget whom Jesus said this to. Nicodemus was a religious leader, a Pharisee, an educated man, and an earnest man. By all outward appearance, he was already transformed unto God – yet he was not.

ii. “These solemn words for ever exclude the possibility of salvation by human merit. Man’s nature is so gripped by sin that an activity of the very Spirit of God is a necessity of he is to be associated with God’s kingdom.” 

e. The wind blows where it wishes: Jesus’ idea to Nicodemus was “You don’t understand everything about the wind, but you see its effects. That is just how it is with the birth of the Spirit.” Jesus wanted Nicodemus to know that he didn’t have to understand everything about the new birth before he experienced it.

i. Since we can’t control the Spirit, “It should lead us to be very tender and jealous in our conduct towards the Holy Ghost, so that we do not grieve him and cause him to depart from us.”

Edited January 12, 2021 by Walter and Deborah
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