Do We Still Have A Sin Nature

[Waggles]

Edited March 17, 2021 by Waggles

[grahampaul]

20 minutes ago, Waggles said:

hed for the hills!! oops, i mean Stand and Resist.

[Who me]

On 3/16/2021 at 9:46 PM, OneLight said:

What made you think Waggles was addressing you when he quoted WhoMe?

Guilty as charged. 

[Peterlag]

On 3/17/2021 at 3:10 PM, grahampaul said:

i find no account of your status with God in all that you have said.as in it is Christ in you,your sonship(your standing) a son of God,(redemption).a one time happening that cannot be undone or redone.And you in Christ,your fellowship,( your status).the Word tells me that redemption is for the unsaved sinner whilst confession is for the saved sinner.

When we are born again our sins are forgiven us,wiped out.so what happens when we sin again?as surely we will for all have fallen short of the glory of God.we fall out of fellowship.bit like the prodigal son,wandered away for a bit realised his mistake went back to the farther and said sorry..thats confession.

take 1 john 1v9

If we confess our sins he is faithfull and just to fogive us our sins,and to cleanse us from all unrightiousness.

this verse has nothing to do with being saved.to confess our sins is not salvation,to confess the savior is salvation.this verse is about a saved person confessing his sins and being cleansed again.

peace.

 

 

 

The offering of the animals under the Old Testament Law had only temporary effects, and thereby had to be offered year after year. In the new covenant, we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ, who entered into the holy of holies, the glorious presence of God’s heart once and for all.

[Waggles]

[Peterlag]

The New Testament epistles have words like "remission of sins" and "sins may be blotted out" and "the forgiveness of sins" and "wash away thy sins" and "whose sins are covered" and "impute sin" and "are dead to sin" and "condemned sin in the flesh" and "take away their sins" and "Christ died for our sins" and "purged our sins..." Romans begins with Jews and Gentiles being both under sin and this should not be anything new to us since both are still broken without the spirit of God. And yet for some mysterious reason I live on a planet where many Christians think their flesh is justified by the deeds of the law even after Romans tells us plainly that everyone except the Christian is under sin (Romans 3:20 says Jews and Gentiles).

Romans tell us "sin is not imputed when there is no law" and "that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin." And then there's verse 7 with "For he that is dead is freed from sin." I never understood Romans 6 because I was taught I was a sinner saved by grace. Let's look at what Romans is saying: Christ died unto sin once and now he lives unto God. How are we who are still alive going to be able to likewise reckon ourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God? It seems to me it must be done through Jesus Christ our Lord. It's not about us or our broken selves. It's him we must function in. Here's the verse "Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord."

It appears both Catholic and Protestant churches do not teach that "sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace." Nor do they teach "For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness." And so "Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness." I'm going to skip over Romans 7 because it tells us right up at the top of the chapter that Paul is talking to them who are into or know the law. And then by the context of the whole chapter is how we can see it's all about human's and how they toy with their flesh.

[Waggles]

@Peterlag I do agree with what you have posted above. But my understanding is that this sinless relationship is conditional upon us doing what is right with God as Spirit-filled Christians: 

Romans 8:1  There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 
8:2  For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. 
8:3  For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, 
8:4  in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 

Gal 5:16  But I say, Walk in Spirit, and ye shall in no wise fulfill the lusts of the flesh.  
5:18  But if ye are led by the Spirit, ye are not under law. 
5:21  envyings, drunkennesses, revelings, and the like of these; of which I forewarn you, as also I did forewarn, that they who practise such things shall not inherit God’s kingdom. 
5:24  And they of Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with the passions and the lusts. 
5:25  If we live by the Spirit, by the Spirit let us also walk. 
 

1John 1:6  If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: 
1:7  but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 
 1:8  If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 
1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 

[Peterlag]

1 hour ago, Waggles said:

@Peterlag I do agree with what you have posted above. But my understanding is that this sinless relationship is conditional upon us doing what is right with God as Spirit-filled Christians: 

Romans 8:1  There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 
8:2  For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. 
8:3  For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, 
8:4  in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 

Gal 5:16  But I say, Walk in Spirit, and ye shall in no wise fulfill the lusts of the flesh.  
5:18  But if ye are led by the Spirit, ye are not under law. 
5:21  envyings, drunkennesses, revelings, and the like of these; of which I forewarn you, as also I did forewarn, that they who practise such things shall not inherit God’s kingdom. 
5:24  And they of Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with the passions and the lusts. 
5:25  If we live by the Spirit, by the Spirit let us also walk. 
 

1John 1:6  If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: 
1:7  but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 
 1:8  If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 
1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 

You list good Scripture.

The verse in 2 Corinthians 5:21, is talking about the "righteousness of God in him." It's the "in him" that nobody seems to be able to understand. This whole thing functions "in him." It's in Christ and therefore in the new nature that is mentioned just a few verses above this in verse 17 where it says "new creature:" It's not that we do not sin in our old man nature. It's that we do not sin in the new man that we are told to put on. The churches have destroyed this idea by teaching we put on the new man by following the teachings of Jesus as we walk in our flesh. So this is a lost art.

In Colossians we read "putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:" We did not put it off. It was the circumcision of Christ. Two verses later we read "together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;..." Again, it's "in him" or "with him." I also want to get Hebrews in here where we see Christ offered himself once "for this he did once" and not like the high priest who offered up the sacrifice daily. The Lord Christ "after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;..."

Peter has the same mindset as Paul when he writes in 1 Peter "that we, being dead to sins,..." Peter goes on to say that Christ suffered once for sins so as to bring us to God, and so this is why the Scripture reads "being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:" Again, the old man crucified and the new man put in its place. Peter again, "ceased from sin;..." Put that mindset on or as Peter writes "arm yourself likewise with the same mind:" Because he that has suffered in the flesh or was crucified in the flesh has put on the new man because the other one is dead. That new person "hath ceased from sin;..."

I see this 1 John chapter 1 and 2 as we are either walking in our old dead nature if we are into sin. Or we are walking in the spirit if we are not into sin.

Chapter 1
6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:"
6. Not in him because we are either not saved or have not put on the new man.

7 "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin."
7. In him because we are saved and have put on the new man.

8 "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."
8. Not in him because we are either not saved or have not put on the new man.

9 "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."
9. In him because we are saved and have put on the new man.

[Waggles]

[Peterlag]

On 3/24/2021 at 2:31 AM, Waggles said:

You need to get born again so as to be filled with the spirit of Christ to be able to be happy in heaven.