The Intellect Verses The Heart

[Justin Adams]

2 minutes ago, enoob57 said:

It is His Word as He claimed it as such and like I have already stated God has stated it so
 

John 12:48-50

48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.

50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.
KJV
 

John 17:1-20

17 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.

14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
KJV
 

People can read for themselves and make up their own minds on this matter... I have!

Sorry, but that wall of words is confusing. 

[enoob57]

The understanding is satan wants to lead people away from Scripture (God's Word) so that he can be god... 
He does not want them to have faith in God which is produced by Scripture
Rom 10:17
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
KJV

satan knows this
Heb 11:6

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
KJV
So he, satan, strives to keep The Scripture from the hearts of people...

[Marathoner]

33 minutes ago, Heleadethme said:

I am not sure natural talents/abilities are the same as spiritual gifts.  However we can make use of our natural abilities in helping others and showing God's love to others or just for solving the practical problems of life.  Natural abilities are useful in the natural realm for practical things but it's usefulness in the spiritual realm seems to be greatly called into question by God.....the natural man receiveth not the things of God....the carnal mind is enmity with God and not able to be subject to His law.  I think these are the things that we are wanting to sort out with this subject.

God's strength is perfected in our weakness, not in our strengths....and this doesn't mean we are to be anti-intellectual or anti-whatever natural strengths a person has, but I think we need to understand the limitations of what is natural when it comes to the kingdom of God and spiritual things.  We are not to lean on our own understanding.  God's thoughts are not our thoughts, His ways are not man's ways....there are so many scriptures that point us away from the natural man and to Almighty God. 

We're not in disagreement. Everything you wrote is true. 

I was going to write about something which might strike some as a mystery, though nothing is a mystery in our Lord Jesus Christ. What was I going to write about?

We were meant to walk in His Spirit, dear sister. The talents which the Lord endowed upon us in the womb together with those gifts His Spirit gives to us serve His kingdom without end. 

I'm a pro at serving meals, cleaning tables, and washing dishes. Talents!

The Lord encourages me so I might encourage others. His gift! 

Together, we serve the Lord.   

Edited June 14, 2021 by Marathoner
typo

[enoob57]

When God spoke the creation into existence people became responsible to know God 'IS'  by what He has made
Rom 1:20-22

20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
KJV

However God wants us to know Him and have intimate relationship with Him and this can only be done through His Word
 

John 17:1-20

17 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.

14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
KJV
As this is clearly stated  in His intimate prayer between The Son to His Father... so it does not surprise me that satan wants us to give our reliance upon dreams, visions, intuitions, feelings, imaginations etc... anything other than Scripture!

[Justin Adams]

The WORD, who is Yeshua spoke it all into being. That is it. 

[Marathoner]

15 minutes ago, enoob57 said:

The understanding is satan wants to lead people away from Scripture (God's Word) so that he can be god... 
He does not want them to have faith in God which is produced by Scripture
Rom 10:17
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
KJV

satan knows this
Heb 11:6

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
KJV
So he, satan, strives to keep The Scripture from the hearts of people...

The scribes, lawyers, Pharisees, and even the Sadducees possessed the scriptures. What did the Lord say of them?

But you do not have His word abiding in you, because whom He sent, Him you do not believe. You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me. But you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life. (John 5:38-40 NKJV)

Do not forbid anyone from coming to the Lord so they might have life. Yeshua the Christ who is, was, and will always be the Word of God, is He who gives us life. If the scriptures gave us life and the Pharisees possessed those scriptures, why did the Lord say, "But you do not have His word abiding in you"? 

They didn't believe the Word of God and wouldn't come to Him for life. 

[Guest clancy]

1 hour ago, David1701 said:

The Lord Jesus Christ himself is the foundation.

 1 Cor. 3:11 (KJV) For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Yes, of course the Bible contains foundational teaching about him; but, He is the foundation from which that foundational teaching comes.

Christianity is a loving, trusting relationship with the Lord, not merely reading and accepting truths found in Scripture.

Absolutely...it’s a real intimate relationship with Christ.

There is none like it, I talk to the Lord about everything, all day everyday I involve him in everything....I know he hears me, don’t always get an answer  straight away, faith is active, trusting,knowing, waiting, resting only in him,? 

[Marathoner]

A wonderful topic and highly edifying, @clancy. You're a precious sister and I'm thankful that you're here on the forum.  

I'm a little off in the head but that's okay. The Lord has chosen the poor in spirit and contrite of heart as living stones in His temple. Our Father draws us to His Son...

His Son redeems us and justifies us, hiding us in Himself...

And His Son, who is the Lord God Almighty and the eternal Word of our Father, sends His Spirit to abide with us as our Comforter and Teacher. We're the resting place of God in the earthly realm!

I read this topic and encounter one good word after the other. A tremendous blessing. I'm off in the head of course, so I witness the Spirit of the Lord working through each one of you in turn. Ever watch a match head catch fire? 

That's me. I witness the work of Jesus Christ on earth and cry out to Him with joy! There was a time when I walked in darkness and ignorance until the Lord was pleased to reveal Himself to me, saying, 

Come to Me. 

I had no idea what was in store when I answered the Lord. The same is true of us all.

We walked in darkness and ignorance until the Lord was pleased to reveal Himself to us, saying, Come to Me. We had no idea what was in store when we answered the Lord. Yep, I'm off in the head but I'm in good company. Praise the Lord!

Edited June 14, 2021 by Marathoner
Many typos today

[Alive]

Scriptures are conveyed via language either written or spoken, but communicate information in the same way just as a cooking recipe does. Our minds read or hear the words that communicate the ideas. It takes the Holy Spirit to make those words come alive and bear the fruit of Life--which Life is Christ. In other words, the language is just words until the Word is involved.

Once we are regenerated and indwell by the Holy Spirit, He may communicate Truth to us in many ways, including using scripture.

One way that we can know this is that a great many people have read or heard the scriptures and yet remain in their sins.

[Starise]

@clancy Sorry to hear of the disagreement with your friend and I pray it gets cleared up soon. 

I'm guessing the disagreement might have been over this subject? 

I believe we need both intellect and the heart to make the right choices.

There has been much debate over what exactly the heart really is. I think the two are intertwined tightly. Intelligence and the Spirit.

Unsaved people have a heart. Their heart isn't open to the Spirit so it tends to fall into the natural state of the flesh. The Christian heart is much different because we were infused with God's Spirit.If we strive to follow His Spirit within us, we can go through life with His leadership in our lives. Christians often describe being "led by the Spirit". I believe this flows over into all of life's choices and decisions.

I would ask, how much does one need to know to follow Christ? My answer would be only enough to believe, accept and follow. 

No matter how intelligent a person is, lack of the Holy Spirit dams up the ability to use the knowledge to discern. A person with a mental handicap can accept Christ,  they may need to simply trust God for the answers they are incapable of obtaining due to their handicap. They might not even realize they don't know what they don't know. I don't believe God holds those people accountable for lack of knowledge.

Most of us don't fall into that category. Instead of plotting them both  in contrast to one another, I suggest we see them working in tandem with the Lords Spirit. In reality intellect and Spirit are a combined unit working together. Most of us don't look at one and say to ourselves," You know today is spirit day. I am totally ignoring my mind. I'm just going to sniff the spirit where ever it leads me."

Even this is a choice first made with the intellect. Even if it's a bad one.