Original Sin

[Alive]

7 minutes ago, Heaven_Bound said:

Are you trying to claim those who believe in the Gifts of the Holy Spirit are practicing Palagianism?

 

Tell me, will the Second Coming of Christ still happen?

If you say it will, you are telling me Prophecy is still active Today!

 

As a conglomerate group of people having access to the internet more intelligent today based upon the access of Knowledge available [after all, the meaning of Intelligence is based upon the AMOUNT of Knowledge one pertains]?

If we seem more advanced in Medical, Engineering, Understanding, General, Practical, then that means Knowledge is still active today?

 

And if those 2 are still active, are you discussing Speaking in Tongues?

I knew you were up to something...

Friend, I have no idea how in the world you got any of that from anything whatever I have written. Really off the wall! Wow!

Way, way off topic. Please start another OP and discuss, whatever you are thinking with someone else.

Seriously.

[enoob57]

2 hours ago, Alive said:

This is simply not true at all...yes study is important in many cases.

Pelagianism: The Boogie Man – SOTERIOLOGY 101

2 hours ago, Alive said:

It was about 150 years after Palagius that Augustine battled against Palagius' doctrine.

Augustine was a long way before the Reformation and Calvin. The church has long battled against the insidious ideas of man's moral integrity and pride.

These references only for dating sake as Pelagius and Augustine were of same time period...
Augustine of Hippo - Wikipedia

Pelagius - Wikipedia

not sure why dating was even mentioned as my post had no such?

 

Augustine roots were Manichean here is a good treatise on his beliefs
Saint Augustine (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

[Alive]

I Don't have time to properly address this now. Perhaps later.

You mentioned Calvin, not me and that was many years later.

Augustine was born approximately 30 years after Palagius died and wrote against those teachings many years later--so I do stand corrected. My memory was faulty. Not 150 years, but rather close to 100 years.

Sproule defending Palagius? If that is what is being expressed---ya gonna have to show evidence.

LOL

[Marathoner]

I'm not sure how the heresy of Pelagius was warped into a "Calvinist boogeyman." Sorry, but Pelagius was a 5th century individual who taught the essential goodness of human nature and the absolute freedom (and supremacy) of human will. 

Yeah, that was over a thousand years before John Calvin was born. Sheesh!

[Alive]

A point worth thinking about for each of us and examining ourselves.

Palagius was used of the enemy to push this lie to a crazy level, but yet he had a huge following that persisted even after his death. By all reports, he lived an admirable holy life as recognized by all…his followers and detractors. And yet, he believed it was by his own effort.

That teaching sets grace aside in place is the innate goodness and ability of the will of man.

The question for each of us, is whether or not there is a slice of that thinking in us and what would that mean.

IMo opinion, that bit that appeals to the flesh and pride of man is something to not just cast aside, but rather to seek the Lord about.

Search me, and see if there is a hidden thing.

God Bless

[enoob57]

4 hours ago, Alive said:

Augustine was born approximately 30 years after Palagius died and wrote against those teachings many years later--so I do stand corrected. My memory was faulty. Not 150 years, but rather close to 100 years.

your memory is still faulty you could have saved the embarrassment by just clicking on the links I provided
Augustine - 354 – 430
Pelagius - 354-418
 

I gave you a big clue

4 hours ago, enoob57 said:

These references only for dating sake as Pelagius and Augustine were of same time period...

 

[Hopefully]

58 minutes ago, Alive said:

The question for each of us, is whether or not there is a slice of that thinking in us and what would that mean.

“So do we destroy the law by following the way of faith? Not at all! In fact, faith causes us to be what the law actually wants.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:31‬ ‭
 

When I feel I’m being good this is what I think about it. That it is faith causing me to be what the law wants.

[Alive]

23 minutes ago, enoob57 said:

your memory is still faulty you could have saved the embarrassment by just clicking on the links I provided
Augustine - 354 – 430
Pelagius - 354-418
 

I gave you a big clue

 

Ah yes… why would I be embarrassed to learn. Further research contradicts a source. That said, does that timing matter for the points at hand?

The reason for dates was the result of your bringing Calvin into the picture.

Again, it becomes obvious that a discussion of our mutual understsnding of God’s Grace and our place in that context is difficult without the boogieman some often set the tent stakes.

I have hoped for more.

Their was a point I made for consideration, but alas, it has been lost…but for those who may hear and examine.

[OneLight]

Let's be honest, the "boogieman" lives in both camps as they are the camps of man.  Whenever you take the focus off scripture and place it on what this person or that person believed and taught, the "boogieman" just awaits for it's chance to leap, and it does.

As I said before, I don't believe either side has the full truth, which will be found when you takes all of scripture into account, not just what backs a theology.  For man, that is a very hard process to learn and stick to due to leaning onto our own understanding.

[Alive]

To be clear. I am not married to doctrine, but rather to My Lord.

I do seek to understsnd things. Some of which I am comfortable enough to be reasonably certain about, as I study scripture and thus will be somewhat dogmatic about.

i most always think in terms of principle, which has been helpful to me.

Nervertheless, I am ready to prwy for and have hearing ears on any particular points.

I see the fall of. Adam being a significant departure and pivot point, that requires a full understanding as God provides. These things are not necessarily on the same plane as eschatology, yet I am convinced vital as we stand before the Cross.

We all, seek His Truth. We all seek to be lights. Fruit born of Life and His work in us for those in our sphere to see is important. More so, than some other things.

More important than a correct understanding, is the Life and issue of the same in our lives. The Spirit of the Lord moves where barriers of men are abscent.