Who is Resurrected, and When?

[truth7t7]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

Ah. Where is line between allegory and reality drawn? So Jesus is ruling now? How do you know? 

If this is non literal then His coming is nonliteral. As would be the gathering, the mark, the image, the plagues, etc. 

You are going to be surprised.

 

Your claims are a false representation of my post, the words (Thousand Years)is non-literal and doing nothing more than explaining Gods eternal realm of "One Day Is A Thousand Years" No kingdom or mortal humans on this earth are seen in Revelation 20:1-6 and you know it

At no time did I claim the second coming, gathering, the mark, the image, or plagues,were non-literal, that's your false claim as a question in direct diversion from my post, all are "Future" and "Literal"

Like the magician waving his hand,as the rabbit is grabbed out of the hat with his other hand

[truth7t7]

2 hours ago, Diaste said:

Yeah, but all that is in your spiritual millennial kingdom. It doesn't happen on earth. So, the point is moot and does nothing to advance the discussion of Who and When concerning the primary resurrection.

 

Your claims are a false representation once again

My posting concerning Zechariah chapter 14 shows the (Eternal Kingdom) "After" the day of the Lord takes place, Zechariah 14:8 the river of life is flowing (Eternal)

[truth7t7]

2 hours ago, Diaste said:

Absolutely not; the kingdom isn't turned over immediately.

"Then the end will come, when He hands over the kingdom to God the Father after He has destroyed all dominion, authority, and power. 25For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet. 26The last enemy to be destroyed is death. "

Here Jesus must reign till the last enemy is destroyed and that only occurs at the GWTJ after fire comes down from heaven to destroy the armies of Gog led by Satan; which in the narrative only occurs after the 1000 years. 

But it doesn't matter cause this is all spiritual to you, it's not a real thing. We are so far apart in understanding I'm just going to leave it at that and bow out of this part of the discussion.

Good day and blessings to you.

D.

Yes the last enemy death is destroyed when Jesus returns and the resurrection takes place in the twinkling of an eye and that equals "Immediately" in anybody's book

When Jesus returns the resurrection takes place, at this time the dead are raised "Incorruptible" as "Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory"

"THE LAST ENEMY DEATH IS DESTROYED" (THE END)

Read It Again And Again, "You Are Wrong"!

"Then Cometh The End"

1 Corinthians 15:21-26 & 52-54KJV

21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

(Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory, The End)

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by truth7t7

[truth7t7]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

This is just getting kinda weird.  This is exactly what the Bible says:

Rev 20:4 - I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

I don't know what you might think "came to life" means, but it clearly means they were resurrected.  And then John wrote that they "reigned with Chrit a thousand years".

What do you think John meant by writing v.4?  What metaphors do you think he was using?

"as the Greek word "Zao"for "They Lived" was used and not the Greek "Anastasis" for resurrection, Strongs G386

Strongs G2198, Greek "Zao" for "They Lived" was used in Revelation 20:4 below in bold underline

Mark 12:27 below is just one example in the translation of the Greek "Zao" simply showing the Christian Martyrs in Revelation 20:4 are of the living in God,they aren't resurrected as claimed

Strongs G2198 "Zao" (The Living)"

When a BEHEADED person then LIVES, what ELSE would you call it but a resurrection from the dead.

I don't think you are being in the least reasonable.

The verse clearly describes them as having been beheaded for Christ and refusing the mark of the beast or his image.  All of this refers directly to the Great Tribulation.  So, they DIED in the Tribulation, and "lived again" at the Second Advent and "reigned with Christ for 1,000 years".

But you don't believe v.4, from all you've posted.  It is too clear to ignore or reject.

Thanks for your time, we disagree

Jesus Is The Lord

Edited November 27, 2022 by truth7t7

[truth7t7]

1 hour ago, FreeGrace said:

Actually, there is no assumption at all.  Rev 20 CLEARLY states that martyrs from the Tribulation will "reign with Christ for 1,000 years.  ps:  that is a "millennium".

"There are (Two) resurrections on this (Last Day) the righteous are blessed to be in the (First Resurrection) to eternal life, on such the (Second Death) resurrection has no power.

1.) (First Resurrection) To Life

2.) (Second Death) Resurrection To Damnation

Revelation 20:6KJV

Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

You skipped from v.4 to v.6.  In v.5 we see there will be 1,000 years between the first and second resurrections.

"John 5:28-29KJV

28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation."

You talk about posters "assuming" stuff and here you are, assuming, yourself.  The verses don't say the 2 resurrections occur at the same time, and Rev 20:5 says they are 1,000 years apart.  So why do you ignore the verse that doesn't fit your scheme of things?

"The (Last Day) Resurrection Of All Below

Daniel 12:1-2KJV

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt."

v.2 isn't about "the last day".  v.1 shows that Michael stands up, THEN "there shall be a time of trouble", which is the 7 year Tribulation.  You must explain why Daniel wrote "many of them that sleep (are dead) will wake up, some to life and others to shame, etc".  It is clear this wording doesn't include all of humanity.  

So, where is the resurrection of everyone else?

"John 6:39-40KJV

39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day."

These 2 verses are about the resurrection of the saved only.  So, the "last day" would be the last day before the MK.  When Jesus comes back to earth.

"1 Corinthians 15:21-24KJV

21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming."

This is about the resurrection of the saved ONLY.  Not about the unsaved.

"24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power."

So you seem to assume that "the end" will occur immediately after the resurrection of the saved then.  Why?  v.24 clearly speaks of the MK which Jesus will "deliver up to God" after finally defeating Satan.

"The (Last Day) Judgement

John 12:48KJV

48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day."

My hunch is that you think every mention of "last day" means the same thing.  That would be another assumption.

There is a "last day" of life on earth when Jesus comes.  When He comes, all believers will receive glorified bodies, and the MK begins.  That will be a different life on earth, with glorified believers having bodies higher than angels.  And reigning with Christ.  There will be a "last day" of the MK, when Jesus Christ defeats Satan at the battle of Gog and Magog.  

Context is king.

Thanks for your time, we disagree

Jesus Is The Lord

[FreeGrace]

49 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Thanks for your time, we disagree

Jesus Is The Lord

Yes, we do disagree.  I read Revelation literally, because it was written literally.

And yes, Jesus is Lord.

[FreeGrace]

48 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Thanks for your time, we disagree

Jesus Is The Lord

Hm.  Different post response, but the SAME response.  Seems you are out of answers, explanations, etc.  So now it's just "cut and paste", huh?

If you think the words we BOTH can read in Revelation 20:4-6 say something else, then can you at least explain what you are reading into the SAME words?

[truth7t7]

6 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Hm.  Different post response, but the SAME response.  Seems you are out of answers, explanations, etc.  So now it's just "cut and paste", huh?

If you think the words we BOTH can read in Revelation 20:4-6 say something else, then can you at least explain what you are reading into the SAME words?

We have spent the past 6-7 pages explaining our views,we disagree

Below is a post that I believe went unanswered by you a few pages back

Daniel 12:1-2 below shows at the time of the "Great Tribulation" is the time the resurrection takes place, it shows the book of life is opened in "Final Judgement", it shows two groups being resurrected, one to everlasting life, the other everlasting contempt?

1.) Do you deny the "Time Of Trouble" seen below is the future "Great Tribulation"?

2.) Do you deny that "At That Time" two different groups are seen being resurrected?

A ) Everlasting life?

B ) Everlasting contempt?

3.) Do you deny the book mentioned where names are written, is the book of life opened at the final judgement?

Daniel 12:1-2KJV

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Edited November 27, 2022 by truth7t7

[Diaste]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

Yes the last enemy death is destroyed when Jesus returns and the resurrection takes place in the twinkling of an eye and that equals "Immediately" in anybody's book

When Jesus returns the resurrection takes place, at this time the dead are raised "Incorruptible" as "Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory"

"THE LAST ENEMY DEATH IS DESTROYED" (THE END)

Read It Again And Again, "You Are Wrong"!

"Then Cometh The End"

1 Corinthians 15:21-26 & 52-54KJV

21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

(Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory, The End)

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

Appreciate your contributions.

I'm going to bow out. 

Blessings.

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

We have spent the past 6-7 pages explaining our views,we disagree

 

What I find interesting is that we have the VERY SAME WORDS yet you think they mean something different than I do.  But you won't explain what you think those VERY SAME WORDS mean to you.  Why?  What's the point of discussion if you don't explain yourself?

"Below is a post that I believe went unanswered by you a few pages back

Daniel 12:1-2 below shows at the time of the "Great Tribulation" is the time the resurrection takes place, it shows the book of life is opened in "Final Judgement", it shows two groups being resurrected, one to everlasting life, the other everlasting contempt?"

I did respond to that post, but didn't bother with every point.  We are very far apart on what the VERY SAME WORDS mean.  I disagree with your first sentence about the "time of resurrection" being the time of the Tribulation.  Scripture is clear that the resurrection of the saved is at the Second Advent.

1 Cor 15:23 and 2 Thess 2:1 plainly say so.

However, I'll answer your questions.

"1.) Do you deny the "Time Of Trouble" seen below is the future "Great Tribulation"?

2.) Do you deny that "At That Time" two different groups are seen being resurrected?

A ) Everlasting life?

B ) Everlasting contempt?

3.) Do you deny the book mentioned where names are written, is the book of life opened at the final judgement?"

1.  no.

2. yes.  There is 1,000 years between the resurrection of the saved and the unsaved.  I've already shown that.

3. no.  Rev 20:11-15 is very clear about the resurrection of the unsaved.

"Daniel 12:1-2KJV

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt."

I already explained this passage.  Too bad this forum doesn't number each post.  It's impossible to reference any response without post numbers.