The Correct Chronology of Revelation Chapters 6 and 7

[The Light]

1 hour ago, DeighAnn said:

I think that would be me.  

but just as the Word says

And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.


SO HOW ARE THEY NOT OPENED IF WE KNOW WHAT WAS WRITTEN?  If they weren't opened we wouldn't know what was written.  

Are we saying that there has been no DEATH?  No unfair scales?  No one dying in the name of the LORD?  

I don't get it.  IT SAYS RIGHT THERE the Lamb got the book and OPENED ONE OF THE SEALS.  

WOW.  I truly read the Bible differently than most people it seems.  I read, WHEN THE LAMB OPENED ONE OF THE SEALS

and my BRAIN says OH, THAT SEAL HAS BEEN OPENED, no need to look to a future date for that....

If the fifth seal has been opened then the great tribulation has already occurred. 

If the 6th seal has already been opened then Jesus has returned for second harvest.

If the 7th seal has been opened then we are already in God's wrath. 

These events have not happened.

Revelation 1

19 Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter;

 

[DeighAnn]

Just now, The Light said:

If the fifth seal has been opened then the great tribulation has already occurred. 

No, they are told to WAIT 

9And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

They weren't at some specific time but they have to wait for a little season we don't know how long that is but we do know that people have been being crucified and eaten and beheaded for a couple thousand years already and I can't see there being 'a cut off date' of it happened to you BEFORE this date so it doesn't count, they just have to wait until it's time for Christ to return because the 2 witnesses should be the last 2 'raised up'


The question of HOW LONG tells us that they will have been there a while.  

What do you think it means that robes were 'given' to them?  Do you think that is a 'different' group than those who WASH their robes?

Certainly tells us we follow Him to heaven when we die and do it in bodies, doesn't it?  Would God let an 'unglorified' body be under the altar?  Would a death in the name of the Lord not give glory to God?  Never mind, another subject...

 

[The Light]

30 minutes ago, Brother Duke said:

  You can also follow the earthquake.  The Earthquake of Rev 6:12 is the same quake as Rev 11:13.  There seems to always be a Earthquake around the time of resurrection as it happened during Christ and also when the 2 Witnesses are resurrected.

This is not correct. The earthquake in Revelation 6 is completely different than in Revelation 11:13. The wrath of God has not begun at the 6th seal and cannot begin until the 7th seal is opened. The earthquake is Rev 11:13 is at the END of wrath. Two completely different earthquakes.

30 minutes ago, Brother Duke said:

Revelation 6:12 corresponds with Matthew 24:29. 

The wrath of God which is after the 2nd woe is shown in Rev 6 and in Rev 11.

Yes, Rev 6 corresponds with Matthew 24:29. However, this is the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal which is not the coming of Jesus at the 7th trump. And the wrath of God is not after the second woe. The wrath of God begins after the 7th seal is opened at the FIRST trumpet. All the trumpet are Gods wrath.

30 minutes ago, Brother Duke said:

 

Matt 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 

Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Rev 11:13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

Rev 11:14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

 

 

The day of wrath is one year long. What you see at the 6th seal is telling you it is time for wrath, but it does not begin until the 7th seal is opened. What you see in Revelation 11 is the end of wrath.

[The Light]

1 hour ago, DeighAnn said:

3Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

4And I heard the number of them which were sealed:


and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.


9After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number,

of all nations,
and kindreds,
and people,
and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

So, it isn't just the TRIBES but also those of ALL NATIONS... AKA 'GRAFTED IN' FOLKS.  

BUT wait, that doesn't work with the pre trib thing though, does it????

if that's the case, that has got to go away.... somehow, someway, that has GOT to have some OTHER meaning or something, even though 

THAT IS exactly WHAT IS WRITTEN.    

 

It all works perfectly for pretrib. You just don't know what you are reading. What you are reading in Revelation 7, the great multitude is the result of the GATHERING FROM HEAVEN AND EARTH. The Church is in heaven before the seals are opened.

Rev 5

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

And I'm pretty sure none of this made sense to you. 

[DeighAnn]

11 minutes ago, The Light said:

If the 6th seal has already been opened then Jesus has returned for second harvest.

It is a book with INFORMATION about what will be going on in the world so we can know what TIME it is.  We know the 7th seal events and we know they haven't taken place.  BUT the KNOWING them is the 'being sealed' by them.

All I know, is what is put forth in the first 5 seals I can either know or actually see  taking place.  The 6th seal events I only KNOW they are coming, but have NEVER seen nor heard of them taking place before so I know it is future.

And I don't know how to say this any other way but the MOON AS BLOOD comes BEFORE the day of the Lord so the 6th seal isn't Christ return.  It can't be because it is at the 7 that all the things take place AND WHEN the kingdoms of the world become His.  If He were to return at the 6th, it would throw everything off.  

Not to mention the souls are told to wait for a season until their fellowservants are killed.  If Jesus comes in the 6th seal then Jesus would have to be the one killing them, right?  We know Satan comes before Christ so the 6th is when Satan comes and the sun puts on sackcloth, a sign of mourning which wouldn't happen when the CREATOR comes.   

But those are the pesky details that GOD made sure got in the way for those who don't want to believe lies.  But don't believe me, believe what is written

  "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come." Joel 2:31 KJV


what happens AFTER the tribulation (of Satan)

"Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:" Matthew 24:29 KJV

How could she, compared to the brightness of the return of Christ?

Can I get a second witness?  
"The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:" Acts 2:20 KJV

How about a 3rd?
"And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;" Revelation 6:12 KJV

and what did we just learn THE MOON BECOMES BLOOD BEFORE THAT GREAT AND NOTABLE DAY


It's those pesky pesky details that keep us on the NARROW path.  

But they DO.  We can count on it.  It's a fun little study and certainly helps to RIGHTLY divide...

It isn't about the words so much as the TRUTH and to get to the truth you have to SEE IT TAKING PLACE.  You have to see the system come into power.  You have to see the deadly wound you have to see the witnesses arriving followed by Satan and the angels.  You have to see the image set up and whole world worshipping the 'had two horns like a lamb but spoke like a dragon' LOOKS AND SOUNDS LIKE WHAT YOU WOULD IMAGINE AND if you didn't know better, if you didn't have on the gospel armor, you would believe it too.  But you are kept from believing the lies BY THE WORDs of God and they DELIVER you from the hour by KEEPING you from taking the mark of the beast EVEN if it means dying.  But we know that the 1st death isn't anything to worry about as we are just MOVING ON.  No death no hell for us, 

just a rising from our dead flesh and following Him to be where He is.  

Cause nothing can keep us from Him.  Well unless we are not found worthy because we were seeking to save our life and we didn't want to endure to the end.  

Do you know why being 'left behind' is a good thing?  

Because 
The {one} however having endured to {the} end, he will be saved.  
Matt 24:13
So you know who said it. 

AND IF YOU CAN'T TRUST THE WORDS OF THE WORD MADE FLESH....


 5278. hupomenó ►
Strong's Concordance
hupomenó: to stay behind, to await, endure
Original Word: ὑπομένω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: hupomenó
Phonetic Spelling: (hoop-om-en'-o)
Definition: to stay behind, to await, endure
Usage: (a) I remain behind, (b) I stand my ground, show endurance, (c) I endure, bear up against, persevere.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 5278 hypoménō – literally, remaining under (the load), bearing up (enduring); for the believer, this uniquely happens by God's power (cf. 1 Thes 3:5). See 5281 (hypomonē).



5281. hupomoné ►
Strong's Concordance
hupomoné: a remaining behind, a patient enduring
Original Word: ὑπομονή, ῆς, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: hupomoné
Phonetic Spelling: (hoop-om-on-ay')
Definition: a remaining behind, a patient enduring
Usage: endurance, steadfastness, patient waiting for.
HELPS Word-studies
5281 hypomonḗ (from 5259 /hypó, "under" and 3306 /ménō, "remain, endure") – properly, remaining under, endurance; steadfastness, especially as God enables the believer to "remain (endure) under" the challenges He allots in life.


WHO gives the rider on the white horse A CROWN?  With that alone we know GOD is sending Him.  God isn't worried about us because HE HAS GIVEN US ARMOR to withstand the fiery darts and power over all our enemies.  We have all it takes to make it through.  All we have to do is have faith and see it as Christ did, for the joy that comes after this....

With what death will you glorify GOD?  The death of the saints is precious in the eyes of God.  Does that sound like something He would change? 


God never changes. God is just.  We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.  ANYTHING AND ANYONE WHO SAYS THAT IS NOT GODS TRUTH FOR ANY REASON WHAT SO EVER IS NOT PUTTING FORTH GODS TRUTH.  


 

I said in my haste, All men are liars.

12What shall I render unto the LORD for all his benefits toward me?

13I will take the cup of salvation, and call upon the name of the LORD.

14I will pay my vows unto the LORD now in the presence of all his people.

15Precious in the sight of the LORD is the death of his saints.

16O LORD, truly I am thy servant; I am thy servant, and the son of thine handmaid: thou hast loosed my bonds.

17I will offer to thee the sacrifice of thanksgiving, and will call upon the name of the LORD.

18I will pay my vows unto the LORD now in the presence of all his people,

19In the courts of the LORD'S house, in the midst of thee, O Jerusalem. Praise ye the LORD.


 

17He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

18Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not.

19This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

 

 

[DeighAnn]

31 minutes ago, The Light said:

The Church is in heaven before the seals are opened.

That would put the CHURCH in heaven before THE LAMB WAS SLAIN.

[The Light]

57 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

It is a book with INFORMATION about what will be going on in the world so we can know what TIME it is.  We know the 7th seal events and we know they haven't taken place.  BUT the KNOWING them is the 'being sealed' by them.

All I know, is what is put forth in the first 5 seals I can either know or actually see  taking place.  The 6th seal events I only KNOW they are coming, but have NEVER seen nor heard of them taking place before so I know it is future.
 

 

 

You can think it is a book of information OR you can UNDERSTAND that the 1st six seals are EXACTLY what Jesus is telling you in Matthew 24.

[The Light]

1 hour ago, DeighAnn said:

And I don't know how to say this any other way but the MOON AS BLOOD comes BEFORE the day of the Lord so the 6th seal isn't Christ return.

Great, awesome. You understand that the moon as blood comes before the day of the Lord. Good Job.

Whoa now! Pull back on those reins. Christ returns at the 6th seal.

Revelation 6

12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

Matthew 24

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

How many times do I need to post this BEFORE THE LIGHT GOES ON, that Jesus returns at the 6th seal. 

[The Light]

14 hours ago, tatwo said:

You are correct...because what you said was..."I believe in common sense and reading what the Word says and accepting what it says. The Bible explains the Bible."

My response is "MY" response to what you said...I was not trying to cause you to be confused...as it may seem that you are...quite the contrary actually...In some ways you act Baptist.

 

Nope not Baptist as I believe the spiritual gifts are active today. Though I am not Baptist, I have great respect for them as I know of no denomination that pushes the salvation message stronger. However, that said, since I believe what the Word says, I believe that the Baptists are leaving many tools in the shed.

For you, I'll go with Pentecostal though I know nothing about Pentecostal end time beliefs.

[Revelation Man]

3 hours ago, The Light said:

You seem to be confusing my beliefs with someone else. No seals are opened. They will not be opened until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in. Then they will be opened one at a time, just as the Word says. 

So, lets see, you think the the Martyrs in the 5th Seal are the Church Age Saints right? Even if not, you are basically wrong on pretty much everything but the Pre Trib Rapture. So, I may have just crossed you up on the Seals timing, so that might be the only other thing we agree on, but you are so all over the place its hard to get a grasp on anything from you tbh. I overcome easily all of your points and you just dodge them, now I remember, that is why I quit engaging with you, it wasn't the seals, that is why I quit engaging (via Eschatology) with Imlammad (close) because of the Seals.

I quit engaging with you because I overcome your points and you pretend you don't understand I overcome your points and jus dodge what you cant defend. From my POV you are not called to Prophecy, I am and have been for 37 years. That is why you can see the 10 Virgin Brides as the COMPLETE Church but you can't see the 144,000 male Virgins as COMPLETE Israel.

You seemingly don't understand that if the 1260 in Daniel 12:7 is 1260 days from the time Jesus shows up to END ALL THESE WONDERS, than the 1290 and 1335 also have to be THAT MANY DAYS until Jesus shows up to END ALL THESE WONDERS !!

So, the 1335 comes first, the 1290 next followed by the 1260 Beast. Guess what, nowhere is the Beast/Little Horn tagged in the 1260 conquering of Israel in verse 7, the Man in Linen (a Pre incarnate Jesus) just gives us a NUMBER and an EVENT !! 1260 days from the time Israel are Conquered until all these wonders END, well what wonders? That is what we have to do as Prophesy wonks, not mere guessers. We have to figure out what it means. Well, of course we know the end time Beast rules 1260 days via Rev. 13, thus we can tie in this 1260 days (time, times and half) with Revelation 13 and Rev. 12 and we can look back at Dan. 11:36-45 to see this Little Horn/Beast is the one being spoken about. Thus we understand the 1260 event has to be the Beast.

Now, if people would work as hard on the other two numbers/EVENTS they could figure those out also, but people get bogged down via the facts because in their minds they "Already Know" the 1290 has to be the Anti-Christ Beast, it is not nor can it be the Beast, he only becomes the Beast 30 days later at the 1260. So, lets try to do Prophecy grunt work, like it is supposed to be done, see of you can keep up here my brother without allowing "Men's Traditions" to keep you in the dark.

The Angels question in Dan. 12:6 that brings Jesus'(Man in Linen) response in Dan. 12:7. 

Dan. 12:6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?

Then Daniels question in Dan. 12:8 asks the same thing !! So, the numbers all have to end at the Same Time, via Jesus' 2nd Coming.

8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?

Dan. 12:9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. (NOW) 10 Many shall be purified, and made white(Church Age period), and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.(But only in the END TIMES because it was Sealed up until NOW.)

The meaning of the 1290 and 1335 can't just CHANGE COURSE in the middle of a chapter !! All three events have to correlate via the same ending, Jesus showing up to END THESE WONDERS !!

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away(STOPPED), and the abomination that maketh desolate set up(PLACED), there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. [Until all these wonders end]

That was Daniels question also in VERSE 8 !! Both are juxtaposed against Jesus 2nd Coming ending the wonders Daniel had just been shown. So, this can only be an event 1290 days away from the 2nd coming of Jesus.

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

So, whoever is living at the 1335 will be BLESSED, but how so ? How can that be ? Wouldn't it be people living during the 70th week? Yes, but the Wrath doesn't come until the 1260 event, the Jews are blessed because THIS EVENT happens just before the Da of the Lord, and it is an event that brings Israel unto repentance, as Zech. 13:8-9 shows, 1/3 of the Jews repent, then in Zech. 14:1, the DOTL arrives.

So, what are the logical nature of these events? We figured out the 1260 is the Beast, why can't we figure the other two events out? Tunnel vision  is the problem, as long as people think the 1290 is the Anti-Christ when he doesn't conquer Israel until 30 days later, they are blinded unto the facts. Thus in their minds the 1290 must come after the 1260, even though commonsense shows it doesn't. All three are EVENTS that are THAT MANY DAYS away from the 2nd Coming which ENDS ALL THESE WONDERS !!

The Blessing of course is the Two-witnesses whom I see as Elijah and Moses. They show up BEFORE the DOTL as Malachi 4:5-6 shows, in order to turn Israel back unto God. Zech. 13:8-9 shows Israel repents JUST BEFORE the DOTL (Zech. 14:1). 

The 1290 happens 45 days after Israel repents at the 1335, they thus would do what? Start serving Jesus AND of course they would go to worship him at the "Temple of God" !! So, 45 days later, 30 days before the Beast conquers Israel, but IMHO, almost 3.5 years after Israel joins the E.U. (Dan. 9:27 covenant/agreement) a High Priest is getting pressured by this "E.U. President" who is i  essence now a "President over Israel" in a way because Israel are a part of the E.U. Of course Israel still have a Prime Minister like England had a Prime Minister and Croatia a President etc. etc. But that does not stop the incoming Pressure on other nations, we see this now with the E.U. Pressuring smaller nations like Hungary and Poland of Immigration and Climate Change etc. etc. 

The E.U. President (Anti-Christ) will place pressure on the Israeli Prime Minister, and the High Priest, remember, this is after the Rapture, the bible will more than  likely be outlawed by this time in THAT WOKE WORLD with no Christians (no Light or Salt) in it. So, the Jewish High priest will come out with an Edict, outlawing Christianity or "TAKING AWAY THE SACRIFICE", and he will then mock them by placing an "IMAGE of the Beast" up in the Temple of God !! That is the AoD and the Jews who repented will have been warned about this by the Two-witnesses, thus at the 1290 Event they understand they have 30 days to get out of Israel/Judea and to make it to the Petra/Bozrah Sheepfold area where God Himself will protect them for 1260 days until Jesus shows up to set up his kingdom in Israel with the Jews. 

Me understanding these things is not me guessing, it is me knowing because it is my calling. I use this to demonstrate, you are not a Prophecy guy, you have no idea what this is about, and you will not listen to anyone. But when you get to heaven my brother you are going to have to understand (all truth will be known) that I was leading you in the right direction all the time, and like the Pharisees of Jesus' time, you already knew it all, even though you don't and you knw very little about Eschatology to boot tbh. But, you will see that soon. I digressed, I will get back on point know.

8 hours ago, The Light said:

I accept EXACTLY what the Word says. The Word says 144,000 are sealed. It does not say ALL OF ISRAEL is sealed. This is your private interpretation.

Will you know dodge for the 1000th time?  So, there are only 10 Virgin Women that make up the whole Church? The problem is if you understood the book of Revelation, you would under this is the EXACT POINT IN TIME tat the Jesus would flee Judea. So you want to kw why God didn't just says this is Israel who repents and flees Judea? Well, for the exact same reason He called Israel The Woman in Rev. 12, Rome did not want to hear about Israel overcoming anything, Rome had just sacked them. So, Gid use a PERFECT NUMBER, which common sense tells us can't be correct, unless God chooses all men who get saved and Salvation is not by FAITH ALONE (Calvinism) but instead is predetermined by God. Also, as I have stated to you which again you ignore, Gid state He had saved Himself 7000 men, here he says its 144,000 men, and in Zech. 13:8-9 He says it is 1/3 of all Israel who repents. The only way the 7000, and 144,000 an both be true is if they are CODES, which you forbid God from using it seems. Well ain't it funny that BOTH numbers just so happen to add up to Numbers multiplied by Numbers that God uses for Completeness (10), Fulness(12) and Divine Completion (7) Odd Right?

12 x 12 x 10 x 10 x 10 = 144,000 but YOU can't see it !!

7 x 10x 10 x 10 = 7000 but again YOU can't see it !!

Now the 1/3, the 7000 and the 144,000 can = the SAME THING, the 3.5-5 million Jews who repent. But you can't see it, but ohhhhh you understand there is going to be more than 10 virgin women in the Church. Is the Woman in Rev. 12 a WOMAN !! Answer that truthfully, stop dodging these facts !! You will not answer, YOU DODGE, because then it shows you really don't read the Scriptures for JUST WHAT IT SAYS always, you only read it for just what it says when it helps (you think this way) you in a debate/argument point. This is why I called you Wishy Washy, the Woman can be All Israel, the 10 Virgin Brides can mean the COMPLERE CHURCH, but the 144,000 can ONLY BE what the TEXT SAYS !!! I just destroyed your thesis brother, that is why you never answer all my points, which is why, in general, I quit chatting with you, I overcome all of your points and like those above you refuse to answer because they show you up, they show you to be in error brother. So what is it do you "ACCEPT WHAT THE WORD SAYS" or do you accept that The Women equals ALL Israel who repents and the 10 Virgin Brides equals the COMPLETE Church ?

I will wait on you to answer EVERYTHING IN FULL before I go on, don't dodge brother. You can't have it both ways. 

God Bless.

I do not engage with those who refuse to answer ALL POINTS even when it defeats their cause. To me when you DODGE you ADMIT you lost the debate. This is why I say I defeat you on every point and tat I always destroy your thesis on every argument. You cant just dodge points that overcome your points brother.