How can the Lord save those who are blinded and hardened?

[Omegaman 3.0]

On 7/24/2022 at 3:16 AM, Dan Knight said:

Interestingly,  in those days the 'eye of the needle ' was the spot in the walls surrounding the cities, as at Jericho, where a comparatively small hole was, where sewage and waste were washed out from the inside. Came in handy when under seige and had to close off the city for days even months at a time. 

I have heard that too, but never have been able to find any real documentation of that. Also, people have noted, as I recall, that the word camel, is possible a typo, of a word that means "rope". Let's not strain out the gnat and swallow the camel though, what Jesus was saying is it is very hard to get to heaven if you have idols (money in this case), that should be the takeaway. Also, what Alive was pointing out I think, is that God can overcome obstacles.

[Justin Adams]

1 hour ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

that the word camel, is possible a typo, of a word that means "rope".

In Aramaic it is the word "camel rope" which is a pun made on the 'camel' lable.

Look up: "My God, My God, why do you mistranslate Me". It is a site that gives common Aramaic expressions that were ignored by "THE CHURCH" for demonstrable reasons.

[Omegaman 3.0]

51 minutes ago, Justin Adams said:

In Aramaic it is the word "camel rope" which is a pun made on the 'camel' lable.

More on the topic:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eye_of_a_needle#Christianity

[Alive]

On 7/23/2022 at 12:37 PM, Walter Goraj jr said:

It is written that the Lord will save all who were given to Him by the Father.

My hope and prayer for everyone I know and love is that we are all chosen of God.  

Jesus gave lessons of principles in many different ways. He was very repetitive throughout His teachings and most can be rendered into specific principles that inform our understanding. This is another tha points to the principle that we can do ‘no thing’ apart from Him.

Reading through the gospels with this in mind can be very helpful.

 

[enoob57]

On 7/23/2022 at 8:38 AM, debrakay said:

This scripture in 2 Peter 3 tells us the Lord is not willing that any should perish.  He wants all to repent and come to him.

2 Peter 3:9 - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

Then in John 12 we are told that he has blinded their eyes and harden hearts so that they cannot understand and turn to him for healing.

John 12:40 - He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, Lest they should see with their eyes, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them.

Please help me resolve this dilemma when I hear others say that he wants to save every single person. All people.  The verse in John tells me that all will not and cannot be save when they turn their backs on him. I know that he wants to but I also know he will not be able to since the free will of man comes into play.  

It is as it was with Cain and Able... Able's sacrifice was acceptable, but Cains was not... God came to Cain and gave His Word to Cain
Genesis 4:6 (KJV)

[6] And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?

[7] If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

[8] And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.

Cain refused God's Words and chose a path of murderous anger...  the understanding lies in the fact we are vessels and we have choice what we store in ourselves either the things of God or things He is not keeping... as we fill our vessels with either we approach a fullness; wherever that fullness comes we are then left with it for judgment and that being great white throne or Judgment Seat of Christ... the study is Judicial Hardening of God and is seen here

Romans 1:18 (KJV)

[18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

[19] Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

[20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

[21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

[22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

[23] And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

[24] Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

 

On 7/23/2022 at 8:38 AM, debrakay said:

I hope someone can help me understand how all can come to him and be saved yet some are blinded and hardened and will not. 

explained above in the doctrine of judicial hardening... they chose what they believed till they were past the point of return ... just like Pharoh he hardened his own heart then God let him go in his hardness which is expressed as God hardened his heart...
 

On 7/23/2022 at 8:38 AM, debrakay said:

How do I respond to those who say the Lord wants to save everyone? 

He says so... so it is true! But also true that God will not allow sin in the new heaven and new earth. So a time of separating at great white throne awaits those who fill themselves with sin...  We are all sinners while in flesh but the difference is Christ... as we, the born of God, fight daily to express love back to God by obedience to His Word

John 14:21 (KJV)

[21] He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

John 12:48 (KJV)

[48] He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

yet we all fail and yet we do not cease to fight to love Him... for it is the only means we have in the newness of life God has given us

Romans 7:16 (KJV)

[16] If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

[17] Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

[18] For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

[19] For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

[20] Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

[21] I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

[22] For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

[23] But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

[24] O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

 

On 7/23/2022 at 8:38 AM, debrakay said:

How do I tell them the Lord has blinded and hardened their loved one?

You do not know where their fullness point is so we continue to love them, pray to God for them, and hope! As long as they're here and breathing we must assume hope for all we witness to!

On 7/23/2022 at 8:38 AM, debrakay said:

Isaiah 6:9-12
And He said, “Go, and tell this people: ‘Keep on hearing, but do not understand; Keep on seeing, but do not perceive.’ “Make the heart of this people dull, And their ears heavy, And shut their eyes; Lest they see with their eyes, And hear with their ears, And understand with their heart, And return and be healed.” Then I said, “Lord, how long?” And He answered: “Until the cities are laid waste and without inhabitant, The houses are without a man, The land is utterly desolate, The Lord has removed men far away, And the forsaken places are many in the midst of the land.'

There are many many many that choose this world as their all and they fill themselves with it... even though God has told them clearly, He is burning it up

2 Peter 3:10 (KJV)

[10] But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

[11] Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

and very pinpointedly I might add
1 John 2:15 (KJV)

[15] Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

We must ask ourselves can we ignore the Word from God, as Cain?

John 3:3 (KJV)

[3] Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

That new birth will cause all things, 'ALL THINGS', to become new! Except the flesh we are in... we can only reckon it dead according to God's Word and a redeemed body awaits us on the other side of this death...

2 Corinthians 5:17 (KJV)

[17] Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

[Billiards Ball]

On 7/23/2022 at 9:38 AM, debrakay said:

This scripture in 2 Peter 3 tells us the Lord is not willing that any should perish.  He wants all to repent and come to him.

2 Peter 3:9 - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

Then in John 12 we are told that he has blinded their eyes and harden hearts so that they cannot understand and turn to him for healing.

John 12:40 - He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, Lest they should see with their eyes, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them.

Please help me resolve this dilemma when I hear others say that he wants to save every single person. All people.  The verse in John tells me that all will not and cannot be save when they turn their backs on him. I know that he wants to but I also know he will not be able to since the free will of man comes into play.  

I hope someone can help me understand how all can come to him and be saved yet some are blinded and hardened and will not. 

How do I respond to those who say the Lord wants to save everyone? 

How do I tell them the Lord has blinded and hardened their loved one?

Isaiah 6:9-12
And He said, “Go, and tell this people: ‘Keep on hearing, but do not understand; Keep on seeing, but do not perceive.’ “Make the heart of this people dull, And their ears heavy, And shut their eyes; Lest they see with their eyes, And hear with their ears, And understand with their heart, And return and be healed.” Then I said, “Lord, how long?” And He answered: “Until the cities are laid waste and without inhabitant, The houses are without a man, The land is utterly desolate, The Lord has removed men far away, And the forsaken places are many in the midst of the land.'
 

People have free will, God sometimes intervenes via his free will, to say "They're not going to ever receive me trust, we're done now." 

 

It's that simple. Beware any answer here that lacks concision.

[missmuffet]

On 7/23/2022 at 6:38 AM, debrakay said:

This scripture in 2 Peter 3 tells us the Lord is not willing that any should perish.  He wants all to repent and come to him.

2 Peter 3:9 - The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

Then in John 12 we are told that he has blinded their eyes and harden hearts so that they cannot understand and turn to him for healing.

John 12:40 - He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, Lest they should see with their eyes, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them.

Please help me resolve this dilemma when I hear others say that he wants to save every single person. All people.  The verse in John tells me that all will not and cannot be save when they turn their backs on him. I know that he wants to but I also know he will not be able to since the free will of man comes into play.  

I hope someone can help me understand how all can come to him and be saved yet some are blinded and hardened and will not. 

How do I respond to those who say the Lord wants to save everyone? 

How do I tell them the Lord has blinded and hardened their loved one?

Isaiah 6:9-12
And He said, “Go, and tell this people: ‘Keep on hearing, but do not understand; Keep on seeing, but do not perceive.’ “Make the heart of this people dull, And their ears heavy, And shut their eyes; Lest they see with their eyes, And hear with their ears, And understand with their heart, And return and be healed.” Then I said, “Lord, how long?” And He answered: “Until the cities are laid waste and without inhabitant, The houses are without a man, The land is utterly desolate, The Lord has removed men far away, And the forsaken places are many in the midst of the land.'
 

What are the causes and solutions for a hardened heart?

https://www.gotquestions.org

ANSWER

To better understand the causes and solutions for a hardened heart, it’s important to understand the broad biblical meaning of the word “heart.” The Bible considers the heart to be the hub of human personality, producing the things we would ordinarily ascribe to the “mind.” For example, Scripture informs us that grief (John 14:1); desires (Matthew 5:28); joy (Ephesians 5:19); understanding (Isaiah 6:10; Matthew 13:15); thoughts and reasoning (Genesis 6:5; Hebrews 4:12; Mark 2:8); and, most importantly, faith and belief (Hebrews 3:12; Romans 10:10; Mark 11:23) are all products of the heart. Also, Jesus tells us that the heart is a repository for good and evil and that what comes out of our mouth – good or bad – begins in the heart (Luke 6:43–45).
 

 

Considering this, it’s easy to see how a hardened heart can dull a person’s ability to perceive and understand. Anyone’s heart can harden, even faithful Christians’. In fact, in Mark 8:17–19 we see Jesus’ own disciples suffering from this malady. The disciples were concerned with their meager bread supply, and it was clear that each of them had forgotten how Jesus had just fed thousands with only a few loaves. Questioning them as to the hardness of their hearts, Christ spells out for us the characteristics of this spiritual heart condition as an inability to see, understand, hear, and remember. Regarding this last criterion, too often we forget how God has blessed us and what He has done for us. Similar to the disciples in this instance or the Israelites wandering in the wilderness, when a new calamity arises in our lives, our hearts often fill with fear and concern. Sadly, this simply reveals to God the little faith we have in His promise to take care of us (Matthew 6:32–33; Philippians 4:19). We need to remember not only the many times God has graciously provided for us in our time of need, but also what He has told us: “Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you” (Deuteronomy 31:6; Hebrews 13:5).

 

Sin causes hearts to grow hard, especially continual and unrepentant sin. Now we know that “if we confess our sins, [Jesus] is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins” (1 John 1:9). However, if we don’t confess our sins, they have a cumulative and desensitizing effect on the conscience, making it difficult to even distinguish right from wrong. And this sinful and hardened heart is tantamount to the “seared conscience” Paul speaks of in 1 Timothy 4:1–2. Scripture makes it clear that if we relentlessly continue to engage in sin, there will come a time when God will give us over to our “debased mind” and let us have it our way. The apostle Paul writes about God’s wrath of abandonment in his letter to the Romans where we see that godless and wicked “men who suppress the truth” are eventually given over to the sinful desires of their hardened hearts (Romans 1:18–24).

 

Pride will also cause our hearts to harden. The “pride of your heart has deceived you . . . you who say to yourself, ‘who can bring me down to the ground’ . . . I will bring you down declares the LORD” (Obadiah verses 3-4). Also, the root of Pharaoh’s hard-heartedness was his pride and arrogance. Even in the face of tremendous proofs and witnessing God’s powerful hand at work, Pharaoh’s hardened heart caused him to deny the sovereignty of the one, true God. And when King Nebuchadnezzar’s “heart became arrogant and hardened with pride, he was deposed from his royal throne and stripped of his glory . . . until he acknowledged that the Most High God is sovereign over the kingdoms of men and sets over them anyone He wishes” (Daniel 5:20–21). Accordingly, when we’re inclined to do it our way, thinking we can “go it on our own,” it would be wise to recall what King Solomon taught us in Proverbs 14:12 and 16:25: “There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death.”

 

So, what then is the antidote for a heart condition such as this? First and foremost, we have to recognize the effect that this spiritual disease has on us. And God will help us to see our heart’s condition when we ask Him: “Search me O God, and know my heart…see if there is any offensive way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting” (Psalm 139:23–24). God can heal any heart once we recognize our disobedience and repent of our sins. But true repentance is more than simply a resolute feeling of steadfast determination. Repentance manifests itself in a changed life.

 

After repenting of our sins, hard hearts begin to be cured when we study God’s Word. “How can a young man keep his way pure? By living according to your word. I seek you with all my heart. . . . I have hidden your word in my heart that I might not sin against you” (Psalm 119:9–11). The Bible is our manual for living as it is “God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting, and training in righteousness” (2 Timothy 3:16). If we are to live life to the fullest as God intended, we need to study and obey God’s written Word, which not only keeps a heart soft and pure but allows us to be “blessed” in whatever we do (Joshua 1:8; James 1:25).

 

Hearts can also become hardened when we suffer setbacks and disappointments in life. No one is immune to trials here on earth. Yet, just as steel is forged by a blacksmith’s hammer, so, too, can our faith be strengthened by the trials we encounter in the valleys of life. As Paul encouraged the Romans: “But we also rejoice in our sufferings because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint us, because God has poured out His love into our hearts by the Holy Spirit, whom He has given us” (Romans 5:3–5).

Edited July 26, 2022 by missmuffet

[Leonardo Von]

• 2Ti 2:24-26 -> "And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will.".

[Dan Knight]

17 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi debrakay,

Interesting and good topic. 

I`ll mention Pharaoh as someone has already spoken of God hardening his heart. Now we tend to look from our understanding but we need to understand from God`s perspective. The more God did great miracles then more Pharaoh got enraged and just didn`t want to let the children of Israel go from Egypt. They were his slaves and he was the Pharaoh, (thought of as a god). Thus the AFFECT of more miracles actually hardened Pharaoh`s heart. But the choice was Pharaoh`s.

The same in the context of John 12: 40. In v. 10 & 11 we see the chief priests took counsel together to get rid of Jesus (& Lazarus, the great proof of Jesus raising him from the dead.) Further (v. 43) we read how the Pharisees loved the praise of men rather than God. These priests had God`s word, they read it in the Temple, they taught the people God`s word, yet in their hearts they were proud and not humble to receive the truth that they were actually reading, (Old testament).  

Jesus departed and was hidden from them for He knew that although He had done many wonderful signs among them they did not believe. (v. 37) This fulfilled what Isaiah prophesied that the more Jesus did miracles (revealed His arm, v. 18) the more incensed these priests and Pharisees became, and THEY chose to harden there own hearts, and thus not repent.

regards, Marilyn.

 

Freeing the Hebrew slaves isn't the point , the purpose, God was making. He sent them into captivity for a purpose.  That Devine Purpose was/is a foreshadowing of  the coming of The Son of God to set free ALL mankind from the consequence of sin. How He was going to do that was illustrated on the last night the Hebrews were to be slaves of Egypt.  By the sacrifice of a lamb, not just any lamb, but The Lamb of God. The Son of God whom we came to know as Jesus. Jesus the Christ.  

  Another example of God's Devine Purpose is found within the event we know as the 3 men who were thrown into the furnace because they would not bow down to the gods of King Nebuchadezar.  Nothing was singed on them except the bounds which tied them up. They were burned up. Devine Purpose is to set us free from the consequence of sin and enviable trip to hell fire. 

Another Devine Purpose was to have the King of the world witness to the world that the God of the Hebrews was truly who they said He was.

  As a reward for their willingness to be a tool of God is in the last verse of Dan 3. "They were promoted ". Rewards in this life and the life to come.

Cover to cover, ITS ALL ABOUT HIM. Amen. 

[debrakay]

15 hours ago, enoob57 said:

John 3:3 (KJV)

[3] Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

This is exactly where the Holy Spirit has lead me on this! Without one being born again by the Spirit of God they will not make it into the kingdom. The baptism of the body by water and the baptism of the filling of the Spirit are required of those who follow Christ. If we are to witness or disciple, The Spirit will reveal to us those who are saved but still on milk, those who are seeking, those who have not closed their eyes, ears and hearts completely or those who have. And we can still have hope that one days, at just the right moment, they will hear the Lord say “Ephphatha.” Be thou opened! The Light will come on.

One may look impossible to us but He is still the God of miracles and the impossible.