Isa 53'and Jewish Rabbis

[JimmyB]

2 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

Not every Israelite is from the tribe of Judah, none of the twelve disciples of Jesus were from the tribe of Jesus and none of the Priests were from the tribe of Judah, for that reason they cannot be call Jews...

Jews were dress at that time the same way as they are dress today in black robbing them and all their family, like the Amish of today's...something like that...I do not have full knowledge of their detail customs and terms, but that what understand...

Correct; there were twelve tribes.  I don't know which tribes the twelve original apostles were from.  How do you know that fact?

On what basis do you say that "Jews were dressed at that time the same way as they are dress [sic] today"?  a) I have never seen that written anywhere and b) Jews today dress in a variety of ways.  Not all Jews dress in the costume of the hasidim.

 

[Your closest friendnt]

6 minutes ago, JimmyB said:

Correct; there were twelve tribes.  I don't know which tribes the twelve original apostles were from.  How do you know that fact?

On what basis do you say that "Jews were dressed at that time the same way as they are dress [sic] today"?  a) I have never seen that written anywhere and b) Jews today dress in a variety of ways.  Not all Jews dress in the costume of the hasidim.

 

Perhaps on a second thought you are right...no they were not dress like that and they were not dress like John the Baptist. 

The hasidim, I do not know their origins...but we know about the Amish.  I stand corrected.

The disciples were from Capernaum most of them which was not in Judea. 

They had Galilean roots...

Jesus did not have a Jewish Father...Jesus said that also, and he never claimed to have a Jewish Father....

[Anne2]

28 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

How do you know the mind of the Lord, and the work of the Holy Spirit.

We are sent to put seed, and leave it for the Holy Spirit to prepare the ground and send the rain and fertilize it.

The seed of the Gospel of Jesus Christ remains there still alive as long as the person lives...and you never know when it will grow...

Not sure what you are talking about here? I asked a question of one of her stated beliefs. That is an attempt at discussion. I got the run around. 

It wasn't a trick question, it was asked from sincere motives. I was hopeful to have some "discussion". It didn't pan out that way. 

Edited August 20, 2022 by Anne2

[Wayne222]

39 minutes ago, Slibhin said:

A question I'm asking myself with increasing frequency. I assure you my exit is imminent.

I am glad your here. And you are warmly welcome to stay. I grew up in a area of New York that was populated by Jewish people. I was friends with many. And of course Jesus was Jewish. And he kept and fulfill the whole Torah. 

[Wayne222]

          I am at the moment debating another Jewish man on Rabbi Singer YouTube. He wrote Christianity has deceive the world for over a thousand years. We of course know those you reject Jesus are deceive. It's worthwhile to talk and engage persons who don't believe in Jesus as Messiah. Jesus is the only name we can be saved. 

[Sower]

1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said:

You did not sent her hear, and you are not the one to tell her to leave.

Agreed!
I never told her to leave! And I certainly did not send her here!
You misunderstood me. As did many others. But I believe Slibhin understands.
Though I did not send her here, I believe it was the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, her God and mine. It was He that drew me decades ago. He loved me so much He sent me to a faithful brother that planted a seed of truth in my mind. The truth, light, chased out the darkness of a faulty understanding, darkness, of the word of God. I believe He is drawing her here for His own good pleasure. I'm trying to help her understand how much God loves her and will continue to pursue her. God makes the simple wise.

God's ways are not man's ways. My purpose here is to learn from the more learned, and to share what I have learned to those who haven't heard the simple truth. Not to get into endless hot debate that's been debated for centuries, which the enemy, our enemy the deceiver enjoys to do. I believe Slibhin is here for a purpose. I think she knows but is reluctant to part with her strongly held beliefs. I understand. I know I was also reluctant to part with my previous understanding of the word when I was in the RCC thirty years. It is difficult  to part with a lifetime of belief that was a bedrock of what we believe and who I was. But it was the truth that set me free.

 

 

 

[Deadworm]

There is no evidence prior to Jesus for Jews applying Isaiah 53 to the Messiah.  So jere is the background for Jesus application of Isaiah 53 to Himself.

(1) The Essene Mauual of Discipline construes their communal life in the wilderness as "atonement" for the sins of Israel.

(2) Maccabean Jewish literature embraces the notion that the sacrifice of the Maccabean martyrs during their revolt in 175-163 BCE atones for Israel's sins.  This interpretation is foundation for the application of Isaiah 53 to individuals.

(3) This background paved the way for the recognition that the details of Isaiah's prophecy neatly parallel Jesus' life and mission and make more sense when applied to an individual than to a nation.  Often overlooked is the connection between Isaiah 53:8 ("They made His tomb with the rich.") and the wealthy sanhedrinist, Joseph of Arimathia's donation of his family tomb to Jesus.

[Episcopius]

Why are Christians supposed to CARE what Christ-rejecting rabbis think about Isaiah 53?

 

[Anne2]

14 minutes ago, Deadworm said:

There is no evidence prior to Jesus for Jews applying Isaiah 53 to the Messiah.  So jere is the background for Jesus application of Isaiah 53 to Himself.

(1) The Essene Mauual of Discipline construes their communal life in the wilderness as "atonement" for the sins of Israel.

(2) Maccabean Jewish literature embraces the notion that the sacrifice of the Maccabean martyrs during their revolt in 175-163 BCE atones for Israel's sins.  This interpretation is foundation for the application of Isaiah 53 to individuals.

 

I did not know about  having no evidence prior. I did hear the Notion began from Torah concerning the avenger of blood is stopped when the high priest dies? The high priest being a type of atonement for causing unintentional death, and can leave the city of refuge. 

As follows....

Nu 35:25  And the congregation shall deliver the slayer out of the hand of the revenger of blood, and the congregation shall restore him to the city of his refuge, whither he was fled: and he shall abide in it unto the death of the high priest, which was anointed with the holy oil.
Nu 35:28  Because he should have remained in the city of his refuge until the death of the high priest: but after the death of the high priest the slayer shall return into the land of his possession.
 

21 minutes ago, Deadworm said:

(3) This background paved the way for the recognition that the details of Isaiah's prophecy neatly parallel Jesus' life and mission and make more sense when applied to an individual than to a nation.  Often overlooked is the connection between Isaiah 53:8 ("They made His tomb with the rich.") and the wealthy sanhedrinist, Joseph of Arimathia's donation of his family tomb to Jesus.

Nicely put. Thank you 

 

[JohnR7]

3 hours ago, TrueFollowerOfChrist said:

I would avoid the kabbalah.

I thought we had to be 40 years old to understand Kabbalah. I found out we have to have studied the Bible for 40 years before we can begin a study of Kabbalah. The Hasidic try to make Kabbalah teaching available to everyone. 

ALERT: Mostly I study the Hebrew Language and the Hebrew Alphabet. The Conservative teachings of the Rabbi are interesting, but I follow the teachings of Jesus and they avoid any discussion of His teachings. Only though the Blood of Jesus can we be saved. There is no other way.