Why did God have to sacrifice Jesus at the hands of the Roman in order to allow believers to enter heaven ? Do you have to kill your son in order to allow good people to enter your house ?

[R. Hartono]

Isn't heaven belong to God Himself ? 

Edited December 15, 2022 by R. Hartono

[JohnR7]

17 minutes ago, R. Hartono said:

Isn't heaven belong to God Himself ? 

Satan was thrown out of Heaven. There is no inperfection or injustice in Heaven. God is a God of absolute, perfect and precise Justice. This is why Jesus paid the price for Sin at Calvery.  I consider this to be a good deal because we still receive rewards even though there is no way we can pay the price to earn our own way into Heaven. Only Jesus can pay the price for us. Even one drop of His precious Blood and redeem the whole world and all of creation. 

Edited December 14, 2022 by JohnR7

[R. Hartono]

3 hours ago, JohnR7 said:

Satan was thrown out of Heaven. There is no inperfection or injustice in Heaven. God is a God of absolute, perfect and precise Justice. This is why Jesus paid the price for Sin at Calvery.  I consider this to be a good deal because we still receive rewards even though there is no way we can pay the price to earn our own way into Heaven. Only Jesus can pay the price for us. Even one drop of His precious Blood and redeem the whole world and all of creation. 

God can throw satan or anybody from heaven and He can receive whoever into heaven such as Enoch and Eliah, what good is it to let Jesus be killed by the Roman ?

[Not me]

To justify man and still remain a righteous and just God, God had to fulfill the law, the law being; ‘the soul that sins that soul shall die’…. This law Christ did fulfill by taking every man to death with Him, henceforth does He become both the just and the justifier of him that has faith in Jesus…

For God is not a blood thirsty monster that needed blood to forgive man his sin, but needed the Life that was in Christ’s blood to be poured out so that that Life can and could be spread to all those that would want the new birth…. Henceforth does scripture say; ‘Christ came to fulfill the law’…..

For the salvation that is in Christ being the natural remedy for the cause, that being, life was lost, life must be found….

This is my understanding, may you be blessed in yours…..

A fellow follower, Not me 

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, R. Hartono said:

God can throw satan or anybody from heaven and He can receive whoever into heaven such as Enoch and Eliah, what good is it to let Jesus be killed by the Roman ?

In hopes that all come to repentance.  

It was the 1st prophecy.

It wasn't 'the Romans' as their 'government' TRIED to let Him go, more than once, so it was those who called themselves 'Jews', but were in fact 'vipers'.  

And no one 'did' anything to HIM, He WILLINGLY became the Lamb Slain, FOR US.  His 'work' on the cross made it possible for us to talk to God ourselves, for the Holy Spirit to dwell with us, for us to live guilt free....

Gen 3:15And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

 

Luke 23:13And Pilate, when he had called together the chief priests and the rulers and the people,

14Said unto them, Ye have brought this man unto me, as one that perverteth the people: and, behold, I, having examined him before you, have found no fault in this man touching those things whereof ye accuse him:

15No, nor yet Herod: for I sent you to him; and, lo, nothing worthy of death is done unto him.

16I will therefore chastise him, and release him.

17(For of necessity he must release one unto them at the feast.)

18And they cried out all at once, saying, Away with this man, and release unto us Barabbas:


 

Matt 23:25Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

27Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

28Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

29Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,

30And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.

31Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.

32Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.

33Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

 

[Your closest friendnt]

13 hours ago, JohnR7 said:

Satan was thrown out of Heaven. There is no inperfection or injustice in Heaven. God is a God of absolute, perfect and precise Justice. This is why Jesus paid the price for Sin at Calvery.  I consider this to be a good deal because we still receive rewards even though there is no way we can pay the price to earn our own way into Heaven. Only Jesus can pay the price for us. Even one drop of His precious Blood and redeem the whole world and all of creation. 

It's no easy to understand from your statement above in the last sentence when you wrote "even one drop of his precious blood" perhaps referring to the value of his blood. But I am sure you know that the redemption is not done, or should I say the Atonement is not acoblished or comes to the finished or to completion before the death of the Lamb who shed the blood. The Lamb must die before the Atonement by the Priest was done. Must be dead..

Jesus said it is finished the moment before his death...knowing that he was about to die. 

These were he last words..."it is finished".

This is it, he did what he had to do...

At that very moment the whole world was cleansed...

Let's start with the people and that what I want to talk about....

I will try to give the meaning to what that means by what took place. 

Jesus told to his disciples to preach the Gospel to the Gentiles as they found them...:the command was to go and proclaim the good news to them...

Jesus knew that he had cleansed the whole world from what it needed to be cleansed from, and we can see that in the examples we have or in what Jesus did to open their understanding to help them accept what he has accomplished or what he has done.  

He did what the Law could not do..

What is that the Law could not do...

The people in the Sinai Covenant could not do what Moses could do..

Moses could approach the mountain of God in the dessert and could go up to the Mountain of God and the people got to know something about Moses.. 

Moses could be in the mountain of God and in the presence of God and talk with him Face to Face and Live...

That happened only to Moses and to no one else from the Israelites. 

God had given Moses something the other Israelites did not have, and Aaron did not have...

But someone else had...or had something that was not quite clear at that time. 

That was Joshua who was standing with Moses together with Moses at the door of the Tent of the Testimony when everyone else was far away and the Lord came and talked to them...

Joshua who took over from Moses.  

And had a different mission to take the people over the Jordan into the Promised land the Land of the Lord God Almighty..

Moses who deliver the people out of the Captivity of Egypt and Jushua the SON of NUN standing next to Moses coming after Moses chosen by God to bring the people into the Holy Land.

One lead he people to Cross the red sea and into the dessert and the other leaď the people to Cross the Jordan river and into the Promised Land. 

The waters of the red sea were parted and the waters of the Jordan river were pulled up.

The waters of the Jordan river were pulled up when the Priests who were carrying the Ark of the Lord stepped into the waters of the Jordan river.

The way the Priests were carrying the Ark on foot and some of them to the left and some to the right on the supporting poles attached to the Ark it is symbolic to a funeral procession. 

It was a Sign from God the Priests must put to death JESUS their Lord God Almighty in the flesh for the waters of death to pull up..

Jesus had to be put to death by the Priests. For the waters of the river of death to pull up so they cannot take the people of Jesus Christ at the time of their physical death to the Sea of Death..

Death cannot come to the people of God who believe in the one who opened the way to the Heavenly Inheritance.  Who believe in the one whom the Priest of the Lord put to death and this Jesus Christ who when he was put to death by the Priest Death was defeated and waters of death stay away from them.  

The Jordan river Symbolizes  the death river because its waters lead to the Dead Sea.

(In the book of revelation we read that words that there was (NO MORE SEA)). 

Those things that happen we symbolic signs of the things to come with Jesus the Son of God...

Joshua is Jesus in the Geek. 

Joshua the Son of Nun and Jesus the Son of God both were chosen by God, one to take the Israelites into their Earthly promised land and the other Jesus the Son of God to take the people of the whole world or to open the way for all the people of the world in his name in his death on the Cross into their Heavenly Inheritance into the eternal Life, no more death in his name...

[DeighAnn]

5 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

(In the book of revelation we read that words that there was (NO MORE SEA)). 

Any idea if the 'sea' is symbolic of the 'peoples of the world', different and/or separated from those made alive by the 'living water'?  For some reason 'the sea' has been on my mind lately and I don't know why except 'the beast rising up from the sea' and 'no more sea'...and when I see 'sea' it seems, IDK.  

[DeighAnn]

5 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

He did what the Law could not do..

What is that the Law could not do...

The people in the Sinai Covenant could not do what Moses could do..

What does Moses approaching God have to do with 'what the Law could not do'? 

 The only thing the written law could not do, from what I understand, was render forgiveness and wash one clean.  It could POINT to sin, it could point to the ways sin could be covered, but IT could not render that forgiveness itself.  

Just a little lost here as to what you are saying. 

[Your closest friendnt]

9 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Any idea if the 'sea' is symbolic of the 'peoples of the world', different and/or separated from those made alive by the 'living water'?  For some reason 'the sea' has been on my mind lately and I don't know why except 'the beast rising up from the sea' and 'no more sea'...and when I see 'sea' it seems, IDK.  

At Genesis 3: the Devil had to take only the first couple and by right all their descendants.

There is not need to explain that if you own both domestic animals the male and female it understood that their offspring are also your...no matter what...

 

[Marilyn C]

19 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

God can throw satan or anybody from heaven and He can receive whoever into heaven such as Enoch and Eliah, what good is it to let Jesus be killed by the Roman ?

Hi R. Hartono,

Lucifer, was a kingpriest, the highest angel. He desired to be as God. God cast him out into the lower heavens and over time angels and humans are seeing how he (now called Satan the accuser), rules - unrighteously. In God` timing when evil has come to a head, then Satan & those following him, will be dealt with.

God`s purposes however roll on amid Satan`s damage to the world, and Israel is a part of that great plan. Even though they rebelled against God He sent His Son at the right time, (after nearly 70 x 7 years of chastisement) to remind Israel of God`s promises and for them to receive Him as their Messiah. Israel rejected Jesus and thus they have gone into exile till now when it is nearly time for them to have their eyes opened to their Messiah.

The Romans were those in power when Israel chastisement was nearly ended. Thus, they carried out what the Jews requested.

Enoch and Elijah were taken to the holding place, (paradise) in the earth, as no one could enter heaven before Jesus made the way through His precious blood sacrifice. They lived by believing is God`s promises to them. (Heb. 11: 13 - 16)

Marilyn.