God's Divine Protection Of The Church During The Tribulation

[other one]

I look at it this way from the Bible as a whole:

If there is a pre-trib rapture we won't be here.

If not almost all of us will be killed for refusing to worship the beast.

It's as simple as that for me.     I'm personally spiritually ready for either....   although I do have my preferences.

[Sister]

On 2/1/2023 at 5:10 AM, Dennis1209 said:

Are there any plain biblical exceptions to the following?

Hebrews 9:27 (KJV) And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

Did the author of Hebrews intentionally leave out the word “all,” or is there an exception? Is the author of Hebrews implying Enoch will never taste physical death or is his physical death delayed to fulfill a purpose of God?

Dying twice, NOT once: Certainly, one or both Two Witnesses will have to taste physical death twice if they lived before. Those that Jesus and the apostles raised from the dead had to die TWICE; there is nothing to suggest otherwise. Is this another “exception” to Hebrews 9:27? Albeit we are not privy to how much longer they lived or that they died a second time.

Hi Dennis1209

Hebrews 9:27 (KJV) And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

This is the general rule, but there is an exception - those that Jesus and the apostles raised from the dead.  They were not raised to spirit, but raised in the flesh, then died again.  So they died twice.  Jesus broke that rule, but for all of us, dying once is the norm, ...the way things go.

However there are only two men who never tasted death, and that is Enoch and Elijah.  Both were taken 'alive' up to the heavens in a Chariot.  Their lives have been preserved to this day and for the very purpose of sending them back.  Both will experience death for the first time when they have finished their testimony.

 

 

[Sister]

On 1/31/2023 at 1:16 AM, truth7t7 said:

Plagues upon The Beast and his Kingdom, a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

 

I agree with this.

[Sister]

On 1/31/2023 at 1:16 AM, truth7t7 said:

All saved believers are (Sealed) by God, Eph 1:13, 4:30

Don't forget we are given the number of the sealed.  There are only 144,000.  No more, and no less.  These make up the true church.  Those who have followed the Lamb wheresoever he goes.

[Dennis1209]

14 hours ago, Sister said:

Hi Dennis1209

Hebrews 9:27 (KJV) And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

This is the general rule, but there is an exception - those that Jesus and the apostles raised from the dead.  They were not raised to spirit, but raised in the flesh, then died again.  So they died twice.  Jesus broke that rule, but for all of us, dying once is the norm, ...the way things go.

However there are only two men who never tasted death, and that is Enoch and Elijah.  Both were taken 'alive' up to the heavens in a Chariot.  Their lives have been preserved to this day and for the very purpose of sending them back.  Both will experience death for the first time when they have finished their testimony.

 

 

Good morning, Sister,

Your view is the view I have held. Since I wrote this, I have read a few other commentaries. The gist of these commentaries is a better word, revived (quickened-made alive again) instead of resurrected. I am not sure if that is comparing apples with oranges or not.

I, too, have always assumed both Enoch and Elijah did not taste physical death. Enoch, for sure, was translated, and God took Enoch (perhaps symbolic of removal from judgment). I do not recognize these exact circumstances in Elijah; Elijah was transported somewhere, much like Phillip, and the distance and direction of Phillip's movement are given. Not so for Elijah; he was transported up through the first heaven to somewhere.

Based on a letter he wrote to a king, there is some biblical circumstantial evidence Elijah was alive on earth well after his transport. Based on the chronology of the kings of Israel. My notes on this are too long, so they are omitted.

Two other possibilities exist: Elijah prewrote that letter, or the king's chronology is misunderstood.

At any rate, it is beneficial to compare scripture with scripture in trying to get a better understanding of the bigger picture, such as:

·         What does it entail to be a witness, and of what?

·         At Jesus's transfiguration, why were Moses & Elijah there? Why not Enoch & Elijah? What was the subject of the conversation? Probably His impending death, burial, and resurrection.

·         Who were the two men at Jesus's tomb and witnessing His ascent to heaven?

·         The church age Gospel of Salvation, compared to the Gospel of the Kingdom after the church's removal.

·         Comparing the miracles Moses and Elijah did in their ministries with the Tribulation judgments.

After the harpazo of the church, the attention shifts to the Revelation of Jesus Christ, and the nation of Israel. What Gospel is preached by the Two Witnesses, the 144,000, and the flying angel?

[truth7t7]

21 hours ago, Sister said:

Don't forget we are given the number of the sealed.  There are only 144,000.  No more, and no less.  These make up the true church.  Those who have followed the Lamb wheresoever he goes.

The 144,000 will be saved, sealed, and "Added" to the Church on this earth, just as all believers have

Jesus Is The Lord

[truth7t7]

7 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

After the harpazo of the church, the attention shifts to the Revelation of Jesus Christ, and the nation of Israel. What Gospel is preached by the Two Witnesses, the 144,000, and the flying angel?

No such thing as a Pre-Trib rapture found in scripture that you suggest, it's the invention of John N Darby and promoted by C.I. Scofields 1909 reference Bible, better known as dispensationalism

Edited February 5, 2023 by truth7t7

[abcdef]

23 hours ago, Sister said:

Don't forget we are given the number of the sealed.  There are only 144,000.  No more, and no less.  These make up the true church.  Those who have followed the Lamb wheresoever he goes.

JW teaching.

Only 144000 get into heaven, is that what you are saying?

[Sister]

11 hours ago, abcdef said:

JW teaching.

Only 144000 get into heaven, is that what you are saying?

No.  The 144k are only the Firstfruits, of the resurrection. 

There is another large multitude aside from them in that first resurrection.

[Sister]

13 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

The 144,000 will be saved, sealed, and "Added" to the Church on this earth, just as all believers have

Jesus Is The Lord

Christians there are many but the 144,000 are the true church who followed the Lamb wheresoever he goes.  The rest will be added to that church when true doctrine is given.