How could the unbelieving world receive salvation and be saved in the great tribulation ?

[Shilohsfoal]

42 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Shilohsfoal.

Ah, YES IT IS! Yeeshuwa` in His parable said,

Matthew 13:28-30 (KJV)

28 "The servants said unto him,

"'Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?'

29 "But he said,

"'Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, "Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn."' "

Look back at verse 24!

Matthew 13:24 (KJV)

24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying,

"THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:..."

He is talking about His KINGDOM which He doesn't begin until He is back to reign in Jerusalem! This is NOT talking AT ALL about the current time period before He comes!

No, don't mix things up. Matthew 8 is a reprimand to the self-absorbed Jews who thought themselves better than anyone else. He found faith/trust in a ROMAN CENTURION better than He found in Israel, particularly in Kfar-Nachuwm ("Capernaum"), where He often came to stay.

Matthew 8:5-13 (KJV)

5 And when Jesus was entered into Capernaum, there came unto him a centurion, beseeching (begging) him, 6 And saying,

"Lord, my servant lieth at home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented."

7 And Jesus saith unto him,

"I will come and heal him."

8 The centurion answered and said,

"Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed. 9 For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, 'Go,' and he goeth; and to another, 'Come,' and he cometh; and to my servant, 'Do this,' and he doeth it."

10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed,

"Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel. 11 And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. 12 But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

13 And Jesus said unto the centurion,

"Go thy way; and as thou hast believed, so be it done unto thee."

And his servant was healed in the selfsame hour.

These who were "thrown into outer darkness" were not "kicked out of the Kingdom" nor were they "sent to Hell!" They were just thrown out of the banquet hall! They were DISMISSED and DISRESPECTED at the same time! They thought that simply because they were children of Israel, God would honor them with the best seats! Yeeshuwa` was telling them that they should have the same humility as this Roman Gentile had! He was a CENTURION, a leader of a HUNDRED men! But, he knew that none of that mattered when it came to having power over sickness and death. And, he came to the ONLY ONE he knew who had such power.

No, His Kingdom starts out small, like a grain of mustard seed, but throughout the Millennium, it GROWS until it is a tree that can provide homes for the birds! It grows until it encompasses the whole earth!

It's similar to the dream of Nevukhadnetsar ("Nebuchadnezzar"), in which he saw a stone cut out of a mountain without hands that grew until it itself was a mountain that filled the earth!

Matthew 13:31-32 (KJV)

31 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying,

"The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field: 32 Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof."

Daniel 2:31-45 (KJV)

31 "Thou, O king, sawest, and behold a great image. This great image, whose brightness was excellent, stood before thee; and the form thereof was terrible. 32 This image's head was of fine gold, his breast and his arms of silver, his belly and his thighs of brass, 33 His legs of iron, his feet part of iron and part of clay. 34 Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces. 35Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.

36 "This is the dream; and we will tell the interpretation thereof before the king. 37 Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory. 38 And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold.

39 "And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth.

40 "And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise. 41 And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay. 42 And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken. 43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.

44 "And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever. 45 Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure."

This is how the Kingdom of the Messiah will grow!

Again, this does NOT mean that they are kicked out of the Kingdom nor that they lose their lives and are sent to "Hell." It simply means that they are kicked out of the feast! They are DISMISSED with DISGRACE from the DISRESPECT they are shown!

YES, but that is how His Kingdom STARTS! However, go back to 1 Corinthians 15:

1 Corinthians 15:20-28 (KJV)

20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. 21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order:

(0) Christ the firstfruits;
(1) afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 24
(2) Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; WHEN HE SHALL HAVE PUT DOWN ALL RULE AND ALL AUTHORITY AND POWER. 25 FOR HE MUST REIGN, TILL HE HATH PUT ALL ENEMIES UNDER HIS FEET. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. 27 FOR HE (GOD) HATH PUT ALL THINGS UNDER HIS (THE MESSIAH'S) FEET. (But when he saith, "all things are put under him," it is manifest that "he" is excepted, which did put all things under him.) 28 And WHEN ALL THINGS SHALL BE SUBDUED UNTO HIM, THEN SHALL THE SON ALSO HIMSELF BE SUBJECT UNTO HIM THAT PUT ALL THINGS UNDER HIM, THAT GOD MAY BE ALL IN ALL.

Malachi 1:11-14 (KJV)

11 "For FROM THE RISING OF THE SUN EVEN UNTO THE GOING DOWN OF THE SAME MY NAME SHALL BE GREAT AMONG THE GENTILES; AND IN EVERY PLACE INCENSE SHALL BE OFFERED UNTO MY NAME, AND A PURE OFFERING: FOR MY NAME SHALL BE GREAT AMONG THE HEATHEN," saith the LORD of hosts. 

12 "But ye have profaned it, in that ye say, 'The table of the LORD is polluted; and the fruit thereof, even his meat, is contemptible.' 13 Ye said also, 'Behold, what a weariness is it!' and ye have snuffed at it," saith the LORD of hosts; "and ye brought that which was torn, and the lame, and the sick; thus ye brought an offering: should I accept this of your hand?" saith the LORD. 

14 "But cursed be the deceiver, which hath in his flock a male, and voweth, and sacrificeth unto the Lord a corrupt thing: for I AM A GREAT KING," saith the LORD of hosts, "and my name is dreadful among the heathen!"

Have you ever listened to the words of the song "Jesus Shall Reign"? Here's a link to the song: Jesus Shall Reign. (Sorry, it's a UTube, so you may have to skip the ads.)

READ Isaiah 60-66 (all seven chapters)! Ever read Psalm 2? It's LITERAL! And, it will be LITERALLY FULFILLED in a United Nations meeting of the future, after Yeeshuwa` has begun His reign:

Psalm 2:1-12 (KJV)

1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?
2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD (YHWH God the Father), and against his anointed (His Messiah), saying,

3 "Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us!"

4 He that sitteth in the heavens (God the Father) SHALL LAUGH: the Lord (Yeeshuwa`) shall have them in derision (shall mock them, make fun of them)!

5 Then shall he (God the Father) speak unto them IN HIS WRATH, and vex them IN HIS SORE DISPLEASURE:

6 "Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion! 7 I will declare the decree:

"'the LORD hath said unto me, "Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. 8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession. 9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel." '

10 "Be wise now therefore, O ye kings: be instructed, ye judges of the earth! 11 Serve the LORD WITH FEAR, and rejoice WITH TREMBLING! 12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, WHEN HIS WRATH IS KINDLED BUT A LITTLE! Blessed are all they that put their trust in him!"

This is not just some weakling King who will only reign over the small Land of Israel! This is the KING OF KINGS who will reign over the WORLD!

NOW, to whom was Yeeshuwa` talking?

Luke 13:22-25 (KJV)

22 And he went through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem. 23 Then said one unto him,

"Lord, are there few that be saved?"

And he said unto them, 

24 "Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. 25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying,

"'Lord, Lord, open unto us!';

"and he shall answer and say unto you,

"'I know you not whence ye are' : 

26 "Then shall ye begin to say,

"'We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets!'

27 "But he shall say,

"'I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity!'

28 "There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out! 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last!"

31 The same day there came certain of the Pharisees, saying unto him,

"Get thee out, and depart hence: for Herod will kill thee!"

32 And he said unto them,

"Go ye, and tell that fox,

"'Behold, I cast out devils, and I do cures to day and to morrow, and the third day I shall be perfected. 33 Nevertheless I must walk to day, and to morrow, and the day following: for it cannot be that a prophet perish out (outside) of Jerusalem!' 

34 "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not! 35 Behold, YOUR HOUSE IS LEFT UNTO YOU DESOLATE: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say,

"'Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the LORD.'" (Psalm 118:26).

He was talking to those who were about the REJECT HIM as their King!

You should have learned by now that when you make extra long posts like this ,no one is going to read it all.Especially when you teach that the kingdom of heaven is full of evil devils who do nothing but sin.

That's not how things work.

If you were planning on entering Christs kingdom,you should have already repented of your sin .

 

 

 

This takes place during the war of Armageddon when the beast which dwells in the kingdom.is destroyed and Christ inherits the kingdom.

 

 

⁴¹ The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

⁴² And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

⁴³ Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

 

THe only people that are saved at that time are those who believed the gospel and have been baptized .The rest are destroyed.

Edited August 9, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Retrobyter]

11 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Last time from my point of view 

Shalom, DeighAnn.

Doesn't have to be your last time; your opinions are always welcome here. (Even when I don't agree with them.)

11 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

TITUS came TOO SOON, so he COULD NOT have been the AOD that is DESTROYED by the brightness of the return of Christ in the last week of Daniels prophecy. 

Huh??? We're not told ANYWHERE that "the AOD is destroyed by the brightness of the return of Christ!" That's just TOO WEIRD!

11 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

 It's like someone saying THERE ISN'T A CRISIS at the southern boarder of the US right now, when EVERYONE can clearly see there is. 

Titus being the AOD of 'the last week' of the prophecy of Daniel is the EXACT SAME THING EVERYONE KNOWS isn't possible OR ELSE Christ would have returned.  And He didn't.  

Titus wasn't the AOD; he ERECTED that which was considered an AOD! It was an abomination that desecrated the Temple grounds, and led to the devastation - the desolation - that emptied out the Temple and the city!

And the Messiah said He wouldn't return until the children of Yhudah can say, "Welcome, Comer on the authority of YHWH."

11 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

There is absolutely NOTHING you could ever put forth that could even sway me a tiny bit. And yeah yeah you think I am confused or this or that but I know how long 7 YEARS are and it is during those 7 years the A O D stands where he ought not and it is at the end of those 7 years that Christ returns and it is HIS BRIGHTNESS that destroys that kingdom and is when Satan is bound and sealed in the pit for the 1000 years.   

THAT IS WHAT IS WRITTEN...

That is NOT what is written. First of all, the "A O D" is not a person. The "abomination of desolation" is the detestable thing that leads to barrenness. It is a thing erected, not a person standing!

Second, Yeeshuwa` SPLIT the last Seven in half! The first half was the 3.5 years of His First Advent's "Ministry" - His offer of the Kingdom to His own tribe, Yhudah ("Judah"), the Jews! The second half will be the 3.5 years of His offer of the Kingdom to Yhudah again, and it picks up right where He left off when He comes the second time. Thus, the TRUE tribulation period is SANDWICHED between the two halves of the 70th Seven ("Week"), for HE is the One who "shall confirm the (Davidic) covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease (by being the LAST Sacrifice God would accept), and for the overspreading of abominations (by the Pharisees)  he shall make it (the city) desolate (empty), even until the consummation (the end), and that determined (the tribulation; the Time of Jacob's Trouble, in the meantime) shall be poured upon the (ones left) desolate," (i.e., the Jews)!

11 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

all the rest is the wisdom of man trying to use profane history to tell us what the Bible says rather than the SPIRIT OF TRUTH of what is actually written.  HENCE THE NARROW PATH.  Get off it and EVERYTHING that follows after that is FALSE. Where do you think - Osas, Jesus did the work so we don't have to anything, eternal life in the lake of fire, pre trib rapture, the gentile church is not of Israel, rising up NOT in a body only to return for THE ONE GOING BACK TO DUST TO BE RE-ANIMATED from the corruption of the earth to rise with the UNSAVED DEAD, no age before this one and all the rest of the false doctrines come from?  Sorry, I digress.  

There's nothing wrong with honest history. It is simply a recording of what happened. Not everything is recorded in the Bible! Some things are recorded in extrabiblical, historical books. Even histories by those considered enemies of Christianity, like Josephus, can be valuable sources of information. First and Second Maccabees are not considered canonical, but they give valuable information about the time of the oppression of the Seleucid Empire under Antiochus IV "Epiphanes" and the opposing Hasmonean dynasty. This was at a time BETWEEN the Old and New Testaments; so, neither Testament writes about that time period!

OSAS is simply the wrong wording. It should be OJBGAJBG - "Once Justified By God, ALWAYS Justified By God!" It's not something that we could affect either way! It's ALL about God's choice!

Yeeshuwa` DID accomplish what we human beings could NEVER pull off on our own! However, we are His SLAVES and owe Him EVERYTHING! So, we DO have to work and do whatever He demands of us.

It's not "eternal life in the Lake of Fire'; it's ETERNAL DEATH in the Lake of Fire!

There's no "pretribulational rapture," because we're already IN the tribulation! Thus, a rapture BEFORE the tribulation is impossible, now!

The believing Gentiles are grafted into the children of Israel, through the blood of the Messiah. He is Jewish; so, we are also in the tribe of Yhudah. Therefore, we are part of the ORIGINAL church (ekkleesia), which went through the wilderness for forty years.

A person is only ONE body, and that body happens to be physical. It was called a "soomata psuchikon" or an "air-breathing body." When it is TRANSFORMED, it's still the same body, but its DESIGN has changed! Now, it's not just an "air-breathing body"; it is a "soomata pneumatikon" or an "air-BLASTING body!" It was translated as a "natural body" and a "spiritual body," but it might just as easily be called a "natural body" and a "SUPERNATURAL body." Nevertheless, BOTH bodies are still PHYSICAL!  What did Yeeshuwa` tell His disciples?

Luke 24:36-43 (KJV)

36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them,

"Peace be unto you."

37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit (a ghost). 38 And he said unto them,

"Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? 39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for A SPIRIT HATH NOT FLESH AND BONES, AS YE SEE ME HAVE." 

40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet. 41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them,

"Have ye here any meat?"

42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. 43 And HE TOOK IT, AND DID EAT BEFORE THEM.

And, we also have this Scripture:

1 John 3: 1-3 (KJV)

1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. 2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, WHEN HE SHALL APPEAR, WE SHALL BE LIKE HIM; FOR WE SHALL SEE HIM AS HE IS. 3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

One should understand, however, that His body was still physical! He could be handled, and He could consume food. There's NOTHING WRONG with the physical when it has been REDESIGNED as a SUPERNATURAL body that is no longer corruptible! It will NEVER DECAY AGAIN!

Oh, and one more thing: There was only ONE Creation, and God did it in SIX DAYS, RESTING ON A SEVENTH DAY. HaSatan was the "original serpent" and he was a CREATED being, created on Day Six with other land animals and the Man.

Edited August 10, 2023 by Retrobyter
to add the last thought

[Retrobyter]

16 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

You should have learned by now that when you make extra long posts like this ,no one is going to read it all.Especially when you teach that the kingdom of heaven is full of evil devils who do nothing but sin.

That's not how things work.

If you were planning on entering Christs kingdom,you should have already repented of your sin .

 

 

 

This takes place during the war of Armageddon when the beast which dwells in the kingdom.is destroyed and Christ inherits the kingdom.

 

 

⁴¹ The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

⁴² And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

⁴³ Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

 

THe only people that are saved at that time are those who believed the gospel and have been baptized .The rest are destroyed.

Nope. Wrong Kingdom. Better?

[DeighAnn]

8 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Huh??? We're not told ANYWHERE that "the AOD is destroyed by the brightness of the return of Christ!" That's just TOO WEIRD!

ASKING questions WITH SUCH AMAZEMENT????? doesn't make you look like you know what you are talking about any more than me, so lets just stick to the points, shall we?  


And he shall confirm a covenant with many for week one but in the middle of the week he shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering and on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate and even until the consummation and which is determined is poured out on the desolate

Who has WINGS?  Who is behind all the abominations of the world?  If that isn't the biggest hint we have ever been given I don't know what is.  

14Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

15Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

16By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.

 

2nd witness as to who the PROBLEM is
15And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel


The abomination

8251. shiqquts ►
Strong's Concordance
shiqquts: detested thing
Original Word: שִׁקּוּץ
Part of Speech: Noun Masculine
Transliteration: shiqquts
Phonetic Spelling: (shik-koots')
Definition: detested thing


of desolation

8074. shamem ►
Strong's Concordance
shamem: to be desolated or appalled
Original Word: שָׁמֵם
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: shamem
Phonetic Spelling: (shaw-mame')
Definition: to be desolated or appalled
make amazed, be astonished, be an astonishment, be, bring into, unto, lay, lie,
A primitive root; to stun (or intransitively, grow numb), i.e. Devastate or (figuratively) stupefy (both usually in a passive sense) -- make amazed, be astonied, (be an) astonish(-ment), (be, bring into, unto, lay, lie, make) desolate(-ion, places), be destitute, destroy (self), (lay, lie, make) waste, wonder.



Which ENEMY will be worshipped that causes LOSS of souls?   Who is the Beast?  Who is the Antichrist?  Who is the devil?  Who is Satan?  Who is the DECEIVER?  Who is the AOD?

3. Abaddón 
Strong's Concordance
Abaddón: Abaddon, the angel of the abyss
Original Word: Ἀβαδδών, ὁ
Part of Speech: Proper Noun, Indeclinable
Transliteration: Abaddón
Phonetic Spelling: (ab-ad-dohn')
Definition: Abaddon, the angel of the abyss
Usage: Abaddon, Destroyer (i.e. Destroying Angel) or place of destruction (personified).


623. Apolluón ►
Strong's Concordance
Apolluón: "a destroyer," Apollyon, the angel of the abyss
Original Word: Ἀπολλύων, ονος, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Apolluón
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-ol-loo'-ohn)
Definition: "a destroyer", Apollyon, the angel of the abyss
Usage: Apollyon, The Destroying One, a Greek translation of the Hebrew: Abaddon.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 623 Apollýōn (from 622 /apóllymi, "cause to perish, be ruined") – properly, "the destroyer" (from the Abyss), i.e. Satan (used only in Rev 9:11).



"The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is." Revelation 17:8 KJV


 

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

5Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


See, IT'S not weird at all, it's all written and when we rightly divide it becomes clear as clear can be
 

 

[Shilohsfoal]

42 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

Nope. Wrong Kingdom. Better?

You believe his kingdom is the wrong kingdom?lol

 

⁴¹ The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

⁴² And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

⁴³ Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

 

Whatever

[DeighAnn]

9 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Titus wasn't the AOD; he ERECTED that which was considered an AOD!

It DOESN'T matter what he did, it ALL has to take place.   It's no different than those who say the ENTIRE prophecy of Joel took place on Pentecost because the spoke in tongues.  Doesn't matter that all the rest didn't happen, like we are able to say a part equals the whole when it comes to prophecy.  If it did then anyone could make up anything about anytime.  

 

9 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

That is NOT what is written. First of all, the "A O D" is not a person. The "abomination of desolation" is the detestable thing that leads to barrenness. It is a thing erected, not a person standing!

WHO stand claiming to be GOD? a thing?  


The 'falling' away is by those who are DECEIVED and they aren't deceived by A THING.  

[DeighAnn]

9 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Titus wasn't the AOD; he ERECTED that which was considered an AOD! It was an abomination that desecrated the Temple grounds, and led to the devastation - the desolation - that emptied out the Temple and the city!

And the temple was destroyed BECAUSE the ONE it was built for was rejected and those who were running it were VIPERS and weren't even true Jews.  Remember they said they had never been in bondage...so they weren't of ISRAEL were they, as Israel had been in bondage for 400 years...

[DeighAnn]

9 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Second, Yeeshuwa` SPLIT the last Seven in half! The first half was the 3.5 years of His First Advent's "Ministry" - His offer of the Kingdom to His own tribe, Yhudah ("Judah"), the Jews!

Only if you can't read and follow what is written...because JESUS is crucified BEFORE the temple is destroyed and the ONE WEEK comes AFTER that and HIS COVENANT isn't for a week, it's forever.

God doesn't do 'one week' covenants...

 

24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

25Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

CERTAINLY Jesus isn't going to cause the sacrifice and oblation to cease with the overspreading of abominations with which he makes desolate   JUST LIKE THE AOD in Matt, isn't it? 
 

Edited August 10, 2023 by DeighAnn

[Shilohsfoal]

2 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

It DOESN'T matter what he did, it ALL has to take place.   It's no different than those who say the ENTIRE prophecy of Joel took place on Pentecost because the spoke in tongues.  Doesn't matter that all the rest didn't happen, like we are able to say a part equals the whole when it comes to prophecy.  If it did then anyone could make up anything about anytime.  

 

WHO stand claiming to be GOD? a thing?  


The 'falling' away is by those who are DECEIVED and they aren't deceived by A THING.  

Donald Trump standing claiming to be the chosen one does not cause desolation.In fact ,few people even paid attention to him.

Daniel wrote that it is the armed forces who set up the AOD.That statement alone should give you an idea what causes the desolation of Jerusalem.

[Retrobyter]

1 hour ago, Shilohsfoal said:

You believe his kingdom is the wrong kingdom?lol

 

⁴¹ The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

⁴² And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

⁴³ Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

 

Whatever

Shalom, Shilohsfoal.

You're not paying attention to the parable. He gathers OUT of the Messiah's Kingdom all things that offend AT THE TIME OF HARVEST! Then, the children of the Kingdom are gathered into the FATHER'S Kingdom!

Remember:  "The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that ANY should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance." (2 Peter 3:9)

There are TWO DIFFERENT KINGDOMS in view here! The Messiah's Kingdom will be a thousand years older than the Father's Kingdom. Armageddon happens AT THE BEGINNING of the Messiah's Kingdom, and it is then that its borders go from the Euphrates to the "River of Egypt." AT THE END of the first 1000 years of the Messiah's Kingdom, there will be the Fire, the 2nd Resurrection = the Resurrection of the Unjust, and the Great White Throne Judgment with the judged being sentenced to the Lake of Fire.

It is at this point in time that the Father's Kingdom begins as the Father forms the New Earth, its New Sky, and the New Jerusalem descends to the New Earth. Then, the Messiah is subject to His Father, and turns over the Empire to Him, as the Messiah goes on to reign just over the Land of Israel, which is now the New Jerusalem, stretching from the southern border of Egypt to the middle of the Black Sea, and from almost half of the Mediterranean Sea to the northwest quadrant of Iran!