Believers' Accountability and the Judgement Seat of Christ

[FreeGrace]

11 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

@AdHoc  @FreeGrace Thanks for all your contributions, however, as you mentioned it does not specifically have to do with the Bema/Judgement.  I think you already have indicated you were finishing up this line of discussion, so I encourage you to start another thread or perhaps PM, if you desire.

I'm saying this because there are some who have let me know how much they want to discuss the bema, so I'd hate to loose these folks due to too much sidebar traffic. 

And @Marilyn C - good to see you!  I was just thinking that I hadn't seen you around much, but this is a big forum . . .

So what do any of the three of you have to say concerning the thread's topic - a believer's accountability and the bema?

Thanks for the thread!  The most important topic a believer needs to be aware about.  Some believers consider just going to heaven to be a reward, but that would mean heaven is earned, which it isn't.  

@AdHoc, I'd be happy to continue in either another thread or by PM.  

[Vine Abider]

14 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi VA,

That was nice you had seen I wasn`t around much. Yes, busy elsewhere. Now you have presented some very good points regarding the Bema seat and what it entails. Good you addressed people thinking they had to do grandiose works to be accepted. 

So, what I have been taught -

Consequent upon our transition to heaven every Christian will appear before this Judgment Seat of Christ. From the Greek `Bema` this has no connotation of a judicial bench to dispense condemnation, but rather the official tribunal in the Greek Games where successful competitors assembled to receive their just reward.

This examination by the Lord Jesus Christ before the Heavenly Bema is evidently to review and make manifest to all the primary incentive which motivated every believer`s service and life, subsequent to their conversion. 

Commensurate rewards or loss of same will be determined by the criteria as to what was accomplished for God under the anointing and guidance of the Holy Spirit; or whether the underlying motive was solely for the self-aggrandizement of the individual. 

The former will inherit indestructible worth likened to gold, silver and precious stones: while the latter`s efforts will be consumed by the penetrating fire of the Lord, as would, wood, hay and stubble. 

Crowns (Greek `Stephanos` - Victor`s Crowns) will also be bestowed as additional rewards for specific ministry.

1. Righteousness - specifically anticipating His appearing. (2 Tim. 4: 8)

2. Rejoicing - Soulwinners. (1 Thess. 2: 19)

3. Life - Enduring trials. (James 1: 12)

4. Glory - Dedicated life in service to Lord. (1 Peter 5: 4)

5. Incorruptible - Overcomers. (1 Cor. 9: 25)

 

Thanks Marilyn! Good words. 

You have listed out some of the potential rewards. What do you think happens if none of a believer's works survive the judging fire?

[JimmyB]

17 hours ago, AdHoc said:

No. Nearly all your quotes deal with a Jew BEFORE CONVERSION. Let the reader judge your style of debate. You did not deal with my proofs. I quoted just three scriptures. You have dismissed them without comment. They stand. But if you disagree with them, you'll have to take that up with the Holy Spirit. He inspired them.

Oh, I see.  You have a perfect understanding of the Holy Spirit's inspiration and I don't?  Are you kidding me???

Jews are Jews before or after conversion.  It involves ethnicity, not doctrine.  Jesus was a Jew!!! as were all the disciples, all the apostles, all the members of the first churches, and all the authors of the Bible (with on exception: Luke).

The word Jew appears 200 times in the New Testament!!  

Let the reader judge my style of debate?  I do not have to deal with your (supposed) proofs.  I don't care if you quoted three scriptures; a) that is irrelevant and b) they do not stand (except perhaps in your own mind).

Again, ""For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God that brings salvation to everyone who believes: first to the Jew, then to the Gentile." (salvation! In other word, conversion.)

 "For There is no difference between Jew and Gentile,—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him," (salvation).

Romans 15:8, "For I tell you that Christ has become a servant of the Jews on behalf of God’s truth, so that the promises made to the patriarchs might be confirmed" (after salvation)

Romans 15:27, "They were pleased to do it, and indeed they owe it to them. For if the Gentiles have shared in the Jews’ spiritual blessings, they owe it to the Jews to share with them their material blessings." (after salvation)

Romans 16:7, "Greet Andronicus and Junia, my fellow Jews who have been in prison with me. They are outstanding among the apostles, and they were in Christ before I was." (my fellow JEWS, a) in Christ, b) after salvation)

Romans 16:21, "Timothy, my co-worker, sends his greetings to you, as do Lucius, Jason and Sosipater, my fellow Jews." (in Christ, after salvation)

1 Corinthians 1:24, "but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God." (after salvation)

1 Corinthians 12:13, "For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink".   a) in Christ, b) after salvation)

Colossians 3:11, "Here there is no Gentile or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all."(Gentiles and JEWS, a) in Christ, b) after salvation)

Again, Your attitude toward the Jews disagrees with what God's word clearly says!!!

It is simply false that "nearly all your quotes deal with a Jew BEFORE CONVERSION."

if you disagree with what I wrote, specifically the above quotes, you'll have to take that up with the Holy Spirit. He inspired them.

You need to read you Bible more carefully and pay attention to what is clearly written.  But if you read only one verse, it should be this one...

There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:28

If you disagree with what I wrote, you will have to take that up with the Holy Spirit. He inspired them.

-------------------------------------------------

I will not discuss this issue any longer, as a) the Bible clearly speaks for itself and b) it is off-topic.  The OP concerns believers accountability and the judgement seat of Christ.

I apologize for my part in the derailment.

Edited September 3, 2023 by JimmyB

[Your closest friendnt]

1 hour ago, Vine Abider said:

Thanks Marilyn! Good words. 

You have listed out some of the potential rewards. What do you think happens if none of a believer's works survive the judging fire?

This is not a strait forwards question because for a number of reasons. 

The Scriptures say that they is no man without any good works...all men have good works. 

Paul did not say that the man in question did not have good works. Paul meant to emphasize that inspite of what this specific man did was still under the Grace of God in Jesus Christ.  

He wanted to emphasize that if this man died in the state he was at the time and upon his appearance before the judgement seat of Jesus Christ he could not seek recognition of the good works that he had done or for those who had believed because of his witness to them about Jesus Christ. 

Did Paul said that he did not get recognition for the people who were saved because of his witnessing to them...or did Paul say that he was forbidden to witness to others about Jesus Christ...or he was forbidden to to charity to others? 

Paul wanted to emphasize something that when this man appears before the judgement seat of Jesus Christ he will stand before him the way everyone else will stand with their denial or their faith in Jesus Christ.  

Being recommended first by their faith in him or their denial in him.

The works do not come into play till first is decided if they have died with the faith in Jesus Christ or their denial....their works they would be considered after that. 

Did Paul say that all his works are burned thinking that his sin (if he died in his sin ( which Paul cannot comment about that) but for the example he said that even if he died in his sin, his sin will not be counted against it, that even is not there to condemn him..as if it was burn at the time of his death.  

About his witnessing about Jesus Paul did not specifically said anything about that (if indeed he did witness to someone and that one believed. 

Or if he had given some water to the little ones Jesus sent his way...

In any case this man Paul was saved inspite of his sin.

He was saved in the blood of the Slain Lamb of God because he believed inspite of his sin...his sin did not  superceded his faith in the blood of the Slain Lamb of God...he was saved because he was in the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ he own righteousness condemns him but he was saved by the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ even though he was not living in it unless at some time later he repent from his sin. 

[phoneman-777]

19 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

I'm no expert on that subject, but purgatory seems like a misguided attempt to get all the verses up the one theological tree - that is one way to try and square verses that speak regarding eternal salvation with verses talking about a Christian's accountability.  (also suspect it was a way to keep RCC people in fear and inline with the church) 

 

•  

The RCC rejects the idea that Jesus' blood is indispensable for salvation.

They teach that God was so pleased by Jesus' perfect obedience that He decided to extend the gift of salvation to man, deposit it into the RCC for administration, and abide by their decision to either pardon or not pardon sinners - you heard that correctly. "The sentence of the priest precedes, and God subscribes to it". - Dignities and Duties of the Priest, Liguori

They claim to occupy the Bema Seat.

The unpardoned go to hell. 

The pardoned must still pay for their sins - hence Purgatory.

Indulgences are the means by which the pardoned can purchase "time off" from Purgatory - the very point upon which the entire Protestant Reformation was launched. It's part of the reason why the Reformers correctly identified the papacy as the Antichrist of Bible prophecy from Scripture.

Edited September 3, 2023 by phoneman-777

[Your closest friendnt]

2 minutes ago, phoneman-777 said:

The RCC rejects the idea that Jesus' blood is indispensable for salvation.

They teach that God was so pleased by Jesus' perfect obedience that He decided to extend the gift of salvation to man, deposit it into the RCC for administration, and abide by their decision to either pardon or not pardon sinners - you heard that correctly. "The sentence of the priest precedes, and God subscribes to it". - Dignities and Duties of the Priest, Liguori

The unpardoned go to hell. 

The pardoned must still pay for their sins - hence Purgatory.

Indulgences are the means by which the pardoned can purchase "time off" from Purgatory - the very point upon which the entire Protestant Reformation was launched. It's part of the reason why they correctly identified the papacy as the Antichrist of Bible prophecy from Scripture.

This is not correct what the Catholics believe. 

[phoneman-777]

8 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

This is not correct what the Catholics believe. 

I don't claim to be infallible. Please find me an excerpt from anything stamped with the RCC Imprimatur which says salvation is by grace through faith alone in the blood of Jesus.

Not a link...the quotation. Copy and paste the quotation so that everyone can see and I will retract my statement.

Edited September 3, 2023 by phoneman-777

[Neighbor]

On 8/30/2023 at 6:34 PM, Vine Abider said:

Yes, as in first Corinthians 3:12-15 the judging fire is concerning the believer's works. I think this is the same with the parable of the faithful and unfaithful servants - they are already servants of their master, so the question is, "What did you do with what I gave you?"  If they were deemed to have been faithful in just a "few things" they are praised and rewarded. However, the slothful servant received a reprimand and resulting consequence (I don't believe that consequence was loss of salvation).

And yes, Jesus paid the ultimate price for removing our condemnation and sin.  However, if sin is allowed to remain and be practiced in our lives, it could hinder us.  As Paul says in Hebrews 12:1-2, "let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which so easily ensnares us, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, fixing our eyes only on Jesus . . ."  So therefore, sin can ensnare us and keep us from running well if we let it.

..."To those who use well what they are given, even more will be given, and they will have an abundance. But from those who do nothing, even what little they have will be taken away.  Now throw this useless servant into outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

[Big Boy Stan Murf]

1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said:

This is not correct what the Catholics believe. 

Well they sure have it plastered all over the internet for some strange and odd reason not to mention in their publications, TV shows about their religion, etc, etc.

The catholics are not even close to being Christians... no more than the mormons and jewhovah's witnesses who also claim to be Christians but are not!

Edited September 3, 2023 by Stan Murff

[TrueFollowerOfChrist]

On 8/28/2023 at 12:05 PM, Vine Abider said:

There is a lot of ongoing & passionate debate on here about the teaching of “once saved always saved,” and that discussion goes back many years, in multiple threads. While my beliefs are that God saves people by renewing their spirit with His life, thereby making believers His children forever, my intention here is to look into the accountability side of what it means to be His children.  There is accountability and discipline for what the children of God do, after they have received His life into them. That means that because He loves His children, He wants them to grow and mature effectively in His life and thereby overcome personal sin. This requires His loving care and discipline.

Ultimately, this accountability culminates in the Judgement seat of Christ, where we will either receive rewards or loss.  This is something the children of God have to look forward to, where they can (hopefully) hear those wonderful words, “Well done good and faithful servant!  You have been faithful in a few things – enter into the joy of your Lord!” (Matt 25:23)

Paul says in 1 Corinthians 10:23 that as God’s children, “all things are lawful.” That is, Christians have complete freedom to choose what they want in their life. However, in this same sentence he finishes by saying, “but not all things are profitable.” The child of God has the freedom to choose whatever he or she wants (as do all human beings due to their God-given free will), but Paul points out that the Christian’s choices may or may not be profitable or pleasing to the Lord. (The reality is we have been purchased with the precious blood of Christ and we are actually NOT our own, but He still allows us the choice.)

 Again, this has nothing to do with condemnation for sin, as that has been removed in Christ’s substitutionary sacrifice - His free gift of grace to us (also resulting in being reborn as His children). However, sin can very much still have a negative impact on the believer, even though God’s penalty for it has been removed. We cannot “play” with sin in our lives and think that there are no consequences whatsoever. God states that He actually forget our sins (Jer 31:34 & Heb. 8:12; also see Psalm 103:12), but sin in our lives can still damage us and our walk with the Lord! Sin can deceive us, dull our conscience and senses, break fellowship with God (from our side), damage human relations, cause physical issues, and many other negative things! So in this respect, these kinds of choices are certainly not profitable to born-again believer.

 The New Testament reveals there will be major, future judgments by God. Two of these are the Great White Throne, found in Revelation 20:11-15, and the Bema of Christ (often rendered “judgment seat”) found in 2 Corinthians 5:10 and Romans 14:10. The Bema is the first to occur of these two judgments, and Christians are the focus of examination there. Then, some time afterwards, there is the Great White Throne, which is the last judgment by God. The result of this final judgment is, “Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire” (Rev. 20:15). Our focus now, as believers in Christ, should only be the Bema judgment. Romans 14:12-13 says, “So then, each of us will give an account of ourselves to God. Therefore, let us stop passing judgment on one another.” (“Bema” is a word the ancient Greeks used for a physically elevated position where awards were given to competing athletes at the Olympic Games. Paul is clearly likening the Christian life to the athletic discipline of these games and the resultant awards for competing well. See 1 Corinthians 9:24-27.)

Next up - more about the Bema Seat and its serious implications for all believers . . .

I haven't read this thread, so I don't know if I'm repeating whats already been said. 

 

We know that for believers, The judgement on sin occurred at the cross, so we need never have to worry about being judged for it again. So what is the judgement seat of Christ?? Simple, it is a judgement on our actions in this life after having received salvation. This is a judgement that will determine our status and rewards in Heaven. Even though saved, our actions still have consequences. The Bema seat will determine if our life is one of wood, hay, and straw, or one of Gold, Silver, and precious stones as 1 Corinthians 3 says. If we have lived sinfully, we will experience great loss at the Bema seat. This doesn't mean we will have taken away the things we earned. It means we will fail to earn the things we could have in obedience. So those who think we have a free pass to sin after being saved are sadly mistaken. We can still lose eternal rewards with our sinful lifestyles.