CHRISTIAN NATIONALISM

[RdJ]

If it's really christian there's no problem.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/02/03/us/white-christian-nationalism-racist-myth-cec

Interesting. This guy doesn't say that he's evangelical anymore. I noticed this on a site called bored panda. Evangelicals to them are some caricature. They're American and pro Trump, hateful, anti immigration and I'm like ehm that's not an evangelical.

The evangelical/christian political party in Holland is very small, but when they could also reign they were very left. They let everyone in, because you have to be hospitable, everyone gets govt money, cause you have to care about the poor, but they're also anti abortion and such, so you can't call it left or right. It's just christian. And the reformed tiny party is more like: let those muslim refugees go to their own muslim countries.

[Marathoner]

Christian nationalism (CN) is neither the product of paranoia nor imagined. It's best to view this phenomenon according to its attributes:

The assertion that Christianity is a cultural identity. CN is a continuation of Christian Identity;
The belief that Christians are commanded to assume political power and assert dominance in those nations where they are citizens;
Association with the New Apostolic Reformation (the NAR is a core component of CN and the primary driving force behind the movement);
Participation in personality cults: the adoration and veneration of men who support and forward their causes --- Donald Trump is the object of the primary CN personality cult;
Fascination with and perpetuation of conspiracy theory; Q-Anon is popular;
Xenophobia, promulgating the so-called great replacement theory, and ties to white supremacy/nationalism (sympathetic to the establishment of white ethno-states);

Those are some of the key attributes of Christian Nationalism. It's not an exhaustive list by any means. We have indeed witnessed CN in antiquity; as I mentioned earlier, the colonial European powers are the example. It should be abundantly clear that CN has nothing to do with the faith of Jesus Christ. History is rich with evil men perpetrating heinous crimes in the name of Christ. U.S. history is no exception. 

[Starise]

3 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

Christian nationalism (CN) is neither the product of paranoia nor imagined. It's best to view this phenomenon according to its attributes:

The assertion that Christianity is a cultural identity. CN is a continuation of Christian Identity;
The belief that Christians are commanded to assume political power and assert dominance in those nations where they are citizens;
Association with the New Apostolic Reformation (the NAR is a core component of CN and the primary driving force behind the movement);
Participation in personality cults: the adoration and veneration of men who support and forward their causes --- Donald Trump is the object of the primary CN personality cult;
Fascination with and perpetuation of conspiracy theory; Q-Anon is popular;
Xenophobia, promulgating the so-called great replacement theory, and ties to white supremacy/nationalism (sympathetic to the establishment of white ethno-states);

Those are some of the key attributes of Christian Nationalism. It's not an exhaustive list by any means. We have indeed witnessed CN in antiquity; as I mentioned earlier, the colonial European powers are the example. It should be abundantly clear that CN has nothing to do with the faith of Jesus Christ. History is rich with evil men perpetrating heinous crimes in the name of Christ. U.S. history is no exception. 

Yep. We are to influence by being what we are and by doing what we are called to do. 

Our kingdom is not of this world, but will be a part of the world one day. Christians cannot impose their beliefs by force on an unaccepting public politically.

 

[Marathoner]

22 minutes ago, Starise said:

Yep. We are to influence by being what we are and by doing what we are called to do. 

Our kingdom is not of this world, but will be a part of the world one day. Christians cannot impose their beliefs by force on an unaccepting public politically.

 

I appreciate your understanding of what I posted, brother. I have written about this many times before: if one feels led to participate in the political process then by all means, do so. Voting and/or supporting a particular political candidate doesn't necessarily invalidate our faith nor violate the commandments of our Lord. In my view, such things are properly considered to be part of what we may "render unto Caesar."

This would be an excellent opportunity to briefly explain why I don't engage in the political process. Why? I simply cannot support political causes nor candidates. I believe that the history of man vindicates my position (Romans 3 is an excellent summation of ancient and modern history). I'm very familiar with U.S. history and knowledgeable regarding world history in general. I trust that my Lord appoints whomever He pleases into positions of civil authority; I surely don't claim to understand the how and why of the Lord's counsel. If God doesn't reveal a matter to us, who are we to assume otherwise? 

I focus my attention and efforts upon whatever the Lord sets in front of me to do. Simple, yes? I'm not moved by some who have accused me of apathy (or the like) on account of my refusal to do as they themselves do. Here's what the Lord has set in front of me to do:

Love you all as He loves me and love my neighbor as myself. In other words, I'm to love brethren and strangers alike in the same way. That is antithetical to the stain and cares of this world. It doesn't add up in the political arena. No surprise. 

Edited March 20, 2024 by Marathoner

[RdJ]

29 minutes ago, Starise said:

Yep. We are to influence by being what we are and by doing what we are called to do. 

Our kingdom is not of this world, but will be a part of the world one day. Christians cannot impose their beliefs by force on an unaccepting public politically.

They can and do and if it's christian it's not bad. The christian parties in Holland are too small to make much impact. Euthanasia and late term abortion are fine here. They come from Germany to get one. America, there are so many christians that they were able to forbid it. But all that NAR 7 mountains we replaced Israel and subdue the earth so it will be fantastic when Jesus comes back stuff is dangerous.

Edited March 20, 2024 by RdJ

[Starise]

6 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

I appreciate your understanding of what I posted, brother. I have written about this many times before: if one feels led to participate in the political process then by all means, do so. Voting and/or supporting a particular political candidate doesn't necessarily invalidate our faith nor violate the commandments of our Lord. In my view, such things are properly considered to be part of what we may "render unto Caesar."

This would be an excellent opportunity to briefly explain why I don't engage in the political process. Why? I simply cannot support political causes nor candidates. I believe that the history of man vindicates my position. I'm very familiar with U.S. history and knowledgeable regarding world history in general. I trust that my Lord appoints whomever He pleases into positions of civil authority; I surely don't claim to understand the how and why of the Lord's counsel. If God doesn't reveal a matter to us, who are we to assume otherwise? 

I focus my attention and efforts upon whatever the Lord sets in front of me to do. Simple, yes? I'm not moved by some who have accused me of apathy (or the like) on account of my refusal to do as they themselves do. Here's what the Lord has set in front of me to do:

Love you all as He loves me and love my neighbor as myself. In other words, I'm to love brethren and strangers alike in the same way. That is antithetical to the stain and cares of this world. It doesn't add up in the political arena. No surprise. 

You know when I seen this thread I wasn't going to comment on it due to the potential for misunderstandings. 

I believe we are all supposed to be involved where we are appointed to be involved. If that's politics for someone, who am I to argue it? The motive from a Christian perspective would be to make things better which ties into the whole love our neighbor idea. I think that's the reason many believers look to leadership positions. For me, it's all about motive.

Like salt influences food we influence the world around us. Not by domination or force of any kind. Being mere branches we are only bearing fruit of any kind from the source. That's how I see myself, and I will say that I often don't feel as effective as I should be. If I bear fruit I want to bear more fruit.

Use me up Lord. The parable of the vine and the branches I think is most closely related to grapes for me and even if the grapes get pressed something even better comes from it.

[Starise]

13 minutes ago, RdJ said:

They can and do and if it's christian it's not bad. The christian parties in Holland are too small to make much impact. Euthanasia and late term abortion are fine here. They come from Germany to get one. America, there are so many christians that they were able to forbid it. But all that NAR 7 mountains we replaced Israel and subdue the earth so it will be fantastic when Jesus comes back stuff is dangerous.

Which is very sad, and yet groups of you all praying for Holland will have an impact. In my area there are groups meeting from different churches with a mind to worship and pray for our area. Just because a rule such as abortion is made does not mean we have lost! Maybe the majority will be led not to take advantage of such rules. Prayer has an impact on an area. Especially if it is directed in unity with multiple churches meeting in agreement. Not the apostate churches, the real churches with the real believers in them.

My country is headed the same direction. Sometimes I think this will only serve to contrast the true evil to those who can see it for what it is. I have a friend in Switzerland who tells me the churches are all going away, so I made a search for myself. Yes the state run churches are nothing but useless fluff, but there are a network of churches there if one cares to look who are only growing stronger.

Unfortunately it may take clamity for some to look past their pocket books. Yet some will curse God either way. 

It's been a while since a lot of this abortion legislation was passed. Are people happier with all of this social modification? I see countries across the world realizing how much worse it is becoming. The creep may be slow. 

The bible tells us there will be marrying and people going about normal business when the Lord comes. Many think creature comforts will make a person happy, yet in places of wealth we just have wealthy miserable people. They can only be "happy" if they have learned how to ignore the obvious which is really living in a dream.

[Marathoner]

8 hours ago, other one said:

So let us educate people on the fact that they were not really Christians.

Agreed, but we must be mindful of how we go about doing that. I believe the primary way we do that is to show forth Jesus Christ. As a rule, I'm cautious about weighing in on matters which prove to be controversial on Worthy. Here on the forum, the written word is our only witness. I can't sit with those who feel alienated and/or isolated, nor can I lend an ear and/or a shoulder to those who mourn. We are limited in what we can do in this medium. 

Over time I learned that silence speaks for wisdom for by it, even the fool is considered wise. I was sorely tested by the woman who was the mother I never had. She goaded and tempted me to wrath after learning that I follow Jesus Christ --- my biological mother who hated me had done the same --- and I ached to respond... but the Spirit forbid this. The Lord commanded me to remain silent, going about my duties and fulfilling my responsibilities toward her ranch (and her) as it pleases Him. If I prepared her favorite dinner and she threw the plate at me, I would clean up the mess and defer to her wishes. I would wait until she called me. 

If she screamed at me, I would remember the conditioning of my youth and how I remained silent in front of those who abused me. I said nothing to them, and so I ought to say nothing to those who taunt or strive to tempt me to wrath. I'm to be mastered by nothing! When she blasphemed, I forgave her and said nothing. My silence and refusal to cave in was the means by which the Lord demonstrated His love for this woman. I couldn't see this myself, but the Lord encouraged me to be patient...

The day came when she came to me in tears. She grabbed hold of me and exclaimed that she knew beyond the shadow of a doubt that I loved her. I didn't abandon her nor condemn her like her Christian family had done. This softened her heart and she became receptive to the Lord. 

I'll never forget the work of the Lord and how simple it was to do what He purposed for me to do. So, being careful with words is the means by which I do the same here on Worthy. I felt moved to weigh in about Christian Nationalism but doing so is NOT a condemnation of those who disagree with my view. Not at all. 

[Questioning]

10 hours ago, other one said:

So let us educate people on the fact that they were not really Christians.

It seems like all christians believe they are the "really" Christians.   I know some (like Trump) are pretending for political reasons, but what I have observed in life is that most people in the hundreds of "denominations" really believe they are Christians.  So, who gets to decide who is, and who isn't?

And other religions believe just as strongly (or more so) that their religion is the true one from God, because they come from a society and family that taught them so.  Just like most of us were born into Christianity in the USA and believe Christianity is the true religion.

If we don't want any of these religions (or different interpretations of them) from controling our laws, keep ALL RELIGIONS separate from our government.

[other one]

1 hour ago, Questioning said:

I know some (like Trump) are pretending for political reasons,

Donald was introduced to Jesus about half way through the 2016 election. He's not perfect, but he is a believer.  He's also under strain that very few if anyone can imagine.  I am familiar with the people who introduced him to the Lord, and I trust at least one of them go know.  I also give him time to grow in his beliefs.  So I'm not going to judge him.  Especially since most of the media are pretty much terrified that he might get reelected.

I see people here take things he says out of context and dump on him and bring up things from 30 years ago to put him down.  Well it's been a bit longer than 30 years, but between 17 and 22 I was not a very nice person.  Actually, there were whole weeks I could not account for.  So I kind of cut him some slack.

As for other religions, I could not disagree with you too much, but I will say that in my church search over a 20-year period I did finally discover that there are born-agains in most churches.  Core groups that do the Lords work in spite of different doctrines.  It's Jesus job to sort that all out, and mine to have him as my Lord and do the things I'm asked to do.