Israel & Palestinian Situation - Significantly Driven by Extremists

[Marilyn C]

There were Jews and Arabs living in Palestine before Israel became a nation. So there have been Palestine Jews and Palestine Arabs since the Romans named that land.

 

[other one]

50 minutes ago, Marilyn C said:

There were Jews and Arabs living in Palestine before Israel became a nation. So there have been Palestine Jews and Palestine Arabs since the Romans named that land.

 

It is my understanding that they were all there, but the general law in place was Sharia under the Ottoman Empire.  Jews can live with the Muslims under their legal system, but when Israel declared statehood it was a whole different situation.

[Marathoner]

5 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

The Romans called the land Palestine. We can see that on maps of when Jesus was on earth. It was Arafat who started this idea that these Arabs who wanted to live there were called Palestinians. 

That's incorrect. The term has its origin close to 2,600 years ago in a passage written by the Greek historian Herodotus; he referred to a province of Syria between Phoenicia and Egypt called "Palaistine." The ancient Greeks were the first to use that word. 

When the Lord walked upon this earth, that region was called "Judea" by the Romans. 

[Marathoner]

Hebrews were a Semitic people; so are modern-day Arabs. Hence, both share a common ancestry of the flesh. Arab is nothing more than an ethnic moniker much like "European" is; however, the modern-day occupants of Israel are most assuredly an ethnic mixture. Some are either Arabic or have Arabic ancestors. Some are European... some have Asian ancestry. And so on. That's reality.

You asked how that particular post of mine relates to this topic, @Vine Abider. It should be simple enough to ascertain without my assistance. As a matter of custom, I have remained silent where topics like this one is concerned. Recently, I decided to break that silence and speak up now and then, particularly where error runs rampant. All manner of falsehood and wild conjecture forms the basis of most of the discussion in this thread. 

In your OP, you misrepresented the historical narrative of the so-called "two-state" solution. That in itself is truly no big deal but considering the hot-button nature of the subject matter, my attention was drawn to this topic. Your response to Tristen yesterday that "the Arabs are responsible for 90% of the misbehaving" is atrocious, to say the least. It smacks of racism. Are you aware that many Israelis are, in fact, Arabic? There are Arab Christians as well. 

I'm not special, my friend. If I know those things, anyone else can certainly find out. 

Why am I disgusted? Simple: I made the mistake of assuming that my brothers and sisters would actually care more about the truth than their own opinions. That leads me to three conclusions: 1.) My brothers and sisters truly don't care; or 2.) You're not my brothers and sisters. 

The third conclusion? I have better things to do than appeal to those who don't care. It's like what happened when I found myself standing in a "men's meeting" where deacons and other upstanding Christian men cheered the prospect of "nuking Iran." Insane. 

[Marilyn C]

42 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

That's incorrect. The term has its origin close to 2,600 years ago in a passage written by the Greek historian Herodotus; he referred to a province of Syria between Phoenicia and Egypt called "Palaistine." The ancient Greeks were the first to use that word. 

When the Lord walked upon this earth, that region was called "Judea" by the Romans. 

Yes, I looked that up too and saw that. Then apparently the Romans renamed Judea in the 2nd century CE and called Judea, Syria Palestina incorporating some smaller territories.

[Marathoner]

The Lord and most Galileans spoke Syriac Aramaic; Arabic is also a Syriac language and shares much in common with Aramaic. The notion that "Palestinians" never existed is more than a little ludicrous and disingenuous; the ancient Hebrews were Palestinians. So were the Phoenicians and the people called the Philistines.

Palestine refers to a geographical region. However, this is distorted in the modern vernacular to refer specifically to ethnic Arab people currently confined to the Gaza strip. They're not the only ones confined to Gaza. Much of that region's present chaos is the result of Ottoman, Imperial German, British, and U.S. meddling. It's best understood with the events surrounding the first World War serving as the frame of reference. Crude oil is the source. 

Who is the "great Satan" in Iranian rhetoric? Not Israel. That distinction belongs to the United States. I cannot say that this enmity isn't entirely deserved. U.S. hands are drenched with blood. 

Edited May 2, 2024 by Marathoner

[Marathoner]

51 minutes ago, Marilyn C said:

Yes, I looked that up too and saw that. Then apparently the Romans renamed Judea in the 2nd century CE and called Judea, Syria Palestina incorporating some smaller territories.

It's a matter of semantics, sister. Consider ancient Japanese maps that revealed portions of North America; the Japanese referred to North America by a different name (ancient Japanese explorers reached the west coastline of North America). For that matter, "American" is partially a geographical and geopolitical moniker. Continentally, there are two Americas (North and South); geopolitically and culturally, there four different Americas: North, Meso (modern day Mexico), Central, and South. Some schools of thought blend Mesoamerica and Central America together.  

Semantics. 

Edited May 2, 2024 by Marathoner

[Vine Abider]

Well, @Marathoner, it's all one big mess, isn't it!?  I speak, of course, of Adam's race, of which we all, in the flesh, are descendant from.  Please forgive me, brother, if I spoke out of ignorance.

As I said in the OP, just recently I have gained an appetite to understand more about what's going on over there.  The last two nights I've been watching a couple videos of interviews between Israelis and Palestinians.  It's pretty enlightening, to say the least.  Before I always just automatically sided with about any Israeli action, because basically that is what I was taught.  After spending some hours of reading various things and listening to people speak in these videos, my bottom-line is I still support Israel, because I believe that's where the bible comes down on the matter.*

However, I'm starting to get better insight into the actual feelings on the ground, especially as I watch these interviews.  These were made with very real people, living for years in the midst of that situation.

And perhaps I misspoke (in ignorance once again) about Arabs being 90% responsible . . . probably better to say "Based upon my limited perception, I believe most of the misbehaving has come from Israel's enemies." (and leave the percentage off of it)

It would be quite arrogant to say I know exactly what's really going on there - I don't.  But I hope, from further study, to  gain better knowledge.  I do believe this: the middle east situation is a grand conundrum/Gordian Knot to say the least, and the man that can (apparently) solve it will have to really be something indeed - seemingly worthy of the lofty pedestal he will be put on!

* Geo-politically speaking I'm also getting a better understanding of how this mess came about via the actions of the Romans, Ottomans, British, French, Arab nations & the US.  However exceptionally messy it is, I believe it is still God's will that Israel became a nation 2,000 years after their dispersal.

May we all find the Prince of Peace in this!

[farouk]

On 5/1/2024 at 9:49 PM, NConly said:

Watching a news program a few days ago they said the ones claiming to be Palestinians are Ottoman Turks

@NConly What Syria and Palestine meant about a century to a century and a half ago does not necessarily correspond with what the terms denote now.

[Vine Abider]

3 hours ago, farouk said:

@NConly What Syria and Palestine meant about a century to a century and a half ago does not necessarily correspond with what the terms denote now.

Yes, it appears they were remnants from the Ottoman Empire . . . but then everyone in that area was.  The ancestral line of indigenous people in that area is quite muddied (which includes Jewish remnants too).