1290/1335 days=2000 years??

[Charlie744]

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

 

The RED BOLD is just not factual my friend.

As per the "Time Boundary", well, not quite, he says there will be 70, 7s and he then gives them unto us in  three different prophetic utterances, not ONE (that's why I said not quite). So, the Wall being rebuilt is 7 x 7 that is (look closely) then continued without a break in the Prophetic Utterance, so even thought its three prophesies, two are back to back we know by the way Daniel was given them by Gabriel.  LIKE SO:

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

 

Thanks RM... but I simply do not understand why anyone wants to consider these verses in chapter 9 or the other chapters are not first and foremost messianic prophecies. Especially, chapter 9 which begins with Daniel's prayer regarding the sins and the punishmeny and God's willingness to forgive should they repent.  In 9:4 it speaks to His covenant... Daniel brings in Moses, the Law, the Truth and of course the Levitical verses regarding the blessings and curses clauses are there.... There not only isn't there a hint of a separation within the 70 years but God has purposely and specifically identified those elements of restoration that will be and must be fulfilled by each persono. 

Yes, there is a delineation of the 70 intoe 3 sections, but not for us to insert a break or pause or gap... nothing tells us to do so. But God will purposefully identify those specific elements within the first and third section of the 3 parted time prophecy so we would not only know what will be restored within those two bookends section but also by whom... the entire 70 weeeks prophecy is all about the restoration of the Jews and the city.... 

Within the first 49 years, it is / was  the Jews, responsibility to address the physical element of the restoration as well as the Sabbatical cycles, ceremonies, way of life, etc.  The ONLY piece of the restoration they could not be responsible for is the very first piece of furniture taken away by Jeremiah before the captivity - the Ark of the Covenant. Only God could restore the Presence of God in the Holy of Holies - which is why He would arrive ONLY after the 69th week when He would be baptized in the Jordan and fulfill the element (ARK) within the prophecized third section of the prophecy - it is all about our God.

Regarding His arrival - it is so clear to me that He was suppose to arrive AFTER 7 and 62 weeks were over... and He did. He arrived on the first day of the 70th week to begin His ministry.

 

 

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

 

 

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off(Killed for us sinners), but not for himself:

 

 

This does NOT split time, but it definitely prophesies that the Messiah will be cut off AFTER THE COMPLETION OF THE 62 WEEK SECTION (which of course means after both the 7 and the 62 week sections have been completed). And He was - He arrived on day 1 (after the 69th week), and He was crucified 3.5 years later WITHIN THE LAST WEEK OF THE PROPHECY.  --- He had to first arrive before He could begin His ministry and then to die....

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

 

 

THE ABOVE should be where the verse SPLITS, part of 26 goes with 25 the other part should go with 27 or could be a stand alone verse without the above portion of the verse.

 

 

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

and the people(Romans) of the prince(Anti-Christ/Beast) that shall come(2000 or so years later) shall destroy the city and the sanctuary(in 70 AD);

The "people" of the prince are indeed the Romans who would murder and destroy everything in 70 AD....But the "prince who is to come" is the little horn of Daniel 7 and 8. The little horn would not come to full power until 500 AD. By that time, Titus had already destroyed the city and the sanctuary by 70 AD.

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

 

 

and the end thereof shall be with a flood(Roman led armies destroy Jerusalem and the Temple), and unto the end of the war desolations are determined(The Diaspora).

 

The Roman army indeed would come like a flood and destroy everything in Israel in 70 AD. This was / is not a war that this verse is speaking to / about. The Jews had been revolting for some 4 -5 years and after some success in Northern Israel, they really upset the Romans back in Rome. Consequently, they sent Titus with an 80,000 army to eliminate this threat and disobeience...it was not a war any more than the next series of revolts that would take place some years later - the Bar Kohkba revolts.

The "war" is not a physical was but a spiritual war between the little horn who will come to power and God's kingdom. But, as a direct result of the Jews rejection of their Messiah and crucifying their own God, this would cause God to separate Himself from His people for the next 2000 years. The AOD or the most abominable act known to man would cause God to spiritually separate Himself from His people. Just as in chapter 4 when the iron and bronze bands were placed around the stump after the tree was cut down, it symbolized two things; the iron being placed above the bronze meant that Nebuchadnezzar woul not have access to his gods and not to God until he committed to Him. On the cross, Jesus would be hung on the cross with iron stakes symbolizing He would have no access to His Father...  but of course, His Father would raise Him up in 3 days.

But back to the AOD, the "abomination" (the cross) would cause God to be completely "desolate" from His people .... until the end of the time of the Gentiles.

 

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

27 And he(prince that SHALL COME 2000 years later, see above) shall confirm the covenant(Agreement) with many(Israel and Many other Nations see Daniel 11:40-43) for one week(7 Years): and in the midst(1290 which is 30 days before THE EXACT MIDDLE) of the week he shall cause(The A.C. Orders the False Prophet to STOP Jesus Worship by the Jews who have just repented) the sacrifice(Jesus) and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation(until the 1290 days are over at the 2nd coming), and that determined shall be poured  upon the desolate.

Okay, once again, I would kindly ask you to consider these are messiani prophecies about the coming Messiah and His plan of salvation DURING THE LAST WEEK OF THE PROPHECY WHEN HE WOULD BE ON THE EARTH FOR ONLY 3.5 YEARS OF THE LAST 7 YEARS.

1. He is "He" the Messiah,

2. He, the Messiah will confirm the New Covenant (Jeremiah 31:31-34) with many (both Jew and Gentile) over the coming 2000 years,

3. He, the Messiah, will confirm this NC DURING / WITHIN the last week of the prophecy (not a covenant FOR a week),

4. In the "midst of the week" - certainly, none of these are coincidences, but demonstrate just how accurate His prophecies are... the Messiah would indeed be crucified exactly 3.5 years of the last 7 years of the prophecy.

5. He, the Messiah, will definitely cause the cessation of the animal sacrifices as well as the offerings. He (the cross) would also throw down the need for a Temple, the Sanctuary, the ceremonies... within the Levitical system - they were mer shadows of the things to come ... the Messiah would fulfill them all. They were NEVER meant to be destroyed or thrown down but fulfilled.... by the only One who could fulfill them.

6. He, the Messiah, shall indeed make "desolate" the separation between His people who rejected and crucified Him until the "consumation." This means until the end of the time of the Gentiles when the Messiah will return and consumate His Kingdom.

TheIse interpretations do not stand alone but fit together with the many prophecies within the earlier and later chapters of Daniel.

However, there is absolutely no way on God's green earth can anyone make someone else accept these are messianic prophecies. 

If they are not messianic and speak to some boogeyman coming in the future then .... anyone can make these verses say whatever they want them to say.

But Daniel is purposefully written to the Jews and the city so they could recognize the coming of their Messiah at the end of the 490 year restoration prophecy.

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

So, Gabriel defines 70 - 7s and Three Different Prophesies, NOT ONE CONTINUAL PROPHESY, that comes from men's thinking , not God. Now, as we can see by looking very, very closely, two of the prophesies are BUNCHED TOGETHER signifying its one continual string of years, then we get the jump to the End Time Ant-Christ, which is NOT BUNCHED with the other two at all. 

 

 

[Revelation Man]

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

This does NOT split time, but it definitely prophesies that the Messiah will be cut off AFTER THE COMPLETION OF THE 62 WEEK SECTION (which of course means after both the 7 and the 62 week sections have been completed). And He was - He arrived on day 1 (after the 69th week), and He was crucified 3.5 years later WITHIN THE LAST WEEK OF THE PROPHECY.  --- He had to first arrive before He could begin His ministry and then to die....

No, he DIED on the last day of the 69th week. CUT-OFF means he died after 69 weeks, 69 weeks times 360 days is when Jesus died, NOT during the 70th week.  The Prophesy is about Israel, not Jesus, its Israel who has to repent.  God fent the temple on they day Jesus died, He forsook Israel, He inserted a peoples He had not known heretofore to take the Gospel unto the Gentile world, its called the Church Age. 

Take that Church Age AWAY, and you have Daniel's Stature FITTING PERFECTLY take the Church Age out and the Four Beasts of Daniel come back together with a Beast that covers the exact same landmass as Rome did in circa 117 AD.

Compared to whom Dan. 11:40-43 states the A.C. will Conquer !!

Dan. 8:9 shows he conquers Turkey (Seleucus) and Dan. 11:40-43 shows he conquers the King of the South (probably Turkey) and MANY Countries (to get at Israel) then he conquers Israel and ALL of North Africa, but alas he is not allowed to conquer Edom, Moab or Ammon, which just so happens to be Central & Southern Jordan where the Jews who repent flee unto the Mountains. 

It comes back as the exact same Landmass, led by ONE MAN, the Beast/Little Horn/Anti-Christ. You problem is you just do not factor in the Church Age, God's hiatus unto Israel was the Church Age. You look at time unlike God. He gave us the actual TIMEFRAME, in Israeli years in which there was no Church on earth. In which the Time of the Gentiles had COME FULL. 

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

The "people" of the prince are indeed the Romans who would murder and destroy everything in 70 AD....But the "prince who is to come" is the little horn of Daniel 7 and 8. The little horn would not come to full power until 500 AD. By that time, Titus had already destroyed the city and the sanctuary by 70 AD.

The Little Horn is the End Time A.C. they are one and the same.

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

The "war" is not a physical was but a spiritual war between the little horn who will come to power and God's kingdom.

The 67-70 AD wars were wars, which Israel lost.

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

But back to the AOD, the "abomination" (the cross) would cause God to be completely "desolate" from His people .... until the end of the time of the Gentiles.

Read Rev. 13 the AoD is the False Prophet (2nd Beast) getting the people to create an IMAGE of the First Beast and placing it in the Temple of God.

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

Okay, once again, I would kindly ask you to consider these are messiani prophecies about the coming Messiah and His plan of salvation DURING THE LAST WEEK OF THE PROPHECY WHEN HE WOULD BE ON THE EARTH FOR ONLY 3.5 YEARS OF THE LAST 7 YEARS.

No there is not, he does after the 69 WEEKS EXACTLY, not 69 1/2 weeks, that is putting your own words in God's mouth brother. God can add, he knows the exact number of 69 x  7 = 383 years and how many days 383 x 360 represent. When Jesus died there was one 7 year period x 360 days left. 

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

1. He is "He" the Messiah,

 

HE is the Anti-Christ. This is not debatable.

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

2. He, the Messiah will confirm the New Covenant (Jeremiah 31:31-34) with many (both Jew and Gentile) over the coming 2000 years,

So, you actually think Jesus had to DIE to confirm a covenant/? NO...His promised is all God had to give, Abraham BELIEVED God !!! The Covenant was confirmed by God's promise. 

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

4. In the "midst of the week" - certainly, none of these are coincidences, but demonstrate just how accurate His prophecies are... the Messiah would indeed be crucified exactly 3.5 years of the last 7 years of the prophecy.

 

END TIME.............You guys conflate this whole prophecy. Its utterly a non sequitur starting point. 

3 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

5. He, the Messiah, will definitely cause the cessation of the animal sacrifices as well as the offerings. He (the cross) would also throw down the need for a Temple, the Sanctuary, the ceremonies... within the Levitical system - they were mer shadows of the things to come ... the Messiah would fulfill them all. They were NEVER meant to be destroyed or thrown down but fulfilled.... by the only One who could fulfill them.

Its ALL BACKWARDS...........Jesus and Gabriel were NEVER speaking about a PROFANE Meat Sacrifice, even though most preachers today THINK THAT, they were speaking about in the EN D TIMES, after Israel repents at the 1335, then 45 days later at the 1290, those Jews who started going to the new Temple to Worship Jesus will b e FORBIDDEN by a Decree from the Jewish High Priest (the False Prophet) from Worshiping Jesus in the temple, that is what it means by TAKING AWAY "The Sacrifice" (Jesus), not some stupid profane meat sacrifice.

God stated He would rather have obedience than sacrifice. Jesus dying did not take away the sacrifice, he was ALWAYS the Sacrifice, the Meat Sacrifices only pointed unto THE PROMISE !! Some guy like Herbert W. Armstrong comes up with these bad understandings and they spread like wildfire because Satan never stops deceiving us, he never stops working. 

7 years will be here soon, I think we are within a year and a few months pf the 70th week starting. 

[Charlie744]

50 minutes ago, Revelation Man said:

No, he DIED on the last day of the 69th week. CUT-OFF means he died after 69 weeks, 69 weeks times 360 days is when Jesus died, NOT during the 70th week.  The Prophesy is about Israel, not Jesus, its Israel who has to repent.  God fent the temple on they day Jesus died, He forsook Israel, He inserted a peoples He had not known heretofore to take the Gospel unto the Gentile world, its called the Church Age. 

Take that Church Age AWAY, and you have Daniel's Stature FITTING PERFECTLY take the Church Age out and the Four Beasts of Daniel come back together with a Beast that covers the exact same landmass as Rome did in circa 117 AD.

Compared to whom Dan. 11:40-43 states the A.C. will Conquer !!

Dan. 8:9 shows he conquers Turkey (Seleucus) and Dan. 11:40-43 shows he conquers the King of the South (probably Turkey) and MANY Countries (to get at Israel) then he conquers Israel and ALL of North Africa, but alas he is not allowed to conquer Edom, Moab or Ammon, which just so happens to be Central & Southern Jordan where the Jews who repent flee unto the Mountains. 

It comes back as the exact same Landmass, led by ONE MAN, the Beast/Little Horn/Anti-Christ. You problem is you just do not factor in the Church Age, God's hiatus unto Israel was the Church Age. You look at time unlike God. He gave us the actual TIMEFRAME, in Israeli years in which there was no Church on earth. In which the Time of the Gentiles had COME FULL. 

The Little Horn is the End Time A.C. they are one and the same.

The 67-70 AD wars were wars, which Israel lost.

Read Rev. 13 the AoD is the False Prophet (2nd Beast) getting the people to create an IMAGE of the First Beast and placing it in the Temple of God.

No there is not, he does after the 69 WEEKS EXACTLY, not 69 1/2 weeks, that is putting your own words in God's mouth brother. God can add, he knows the exact number of 69 x  7 = 383 years and how many days 383 x 360 represent. When Jesus died there was one 7 year period x 360 days left. 

HE is the Anti-Christ. This is not debatable.

So, you actually think Jesus had to DIE to confirm a covenant/? NO...His promised is all God had to give, Abraham BELIEVED God !!! The Covenant was confirmed by God's promise. 

END TIME.............You guys conflate this whole prophecy. Its utterly a non sequitur starting point. 

Its ALL BACKWARDS...........Jesus and Gabriel were NEVER speaking about a PROFANE Meat Sacrifice, even though most preachers today THINK THAT, they were speaking about in the EN D TIMES, after Israel repents at the 1335, then 45 days later at the 1290, those Jews who started going to the new Temple to Worship Jesus will b e FORBIDDEN by a Decree from the Jewish High Priest (the False Prophet) from Worshiping Jesus in the temple, that is what it means by TAKING AWAY "The Sacrifice" (Jesus), not some stupid profane meat sacrifice.

God stated He would rather have obedience than sacrifice. Jesus dying did not take away the sacrifice, he was ALWAYS the Sacrifice, the Meat Sacrifices only pointed unto THE PROMISE !! Some guy like Herbert W. Armstrong comes up with these bad understandings and they spread like wildfire because Satan never stops deceiving us, he never stops working. 

7 years will be here soon, I think we are within a year and a few months pf the 70th week starting. 

Well, we just have to agree to disagree. No problem… 

[Revelation Man]

10 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

Well, we just have to agree to disagree. No problem… 

There is no disagreement, I am correct, and you are not. Truth has to be told to people, we can not push untruths my brother, its very dangerous to do that. People think thats overkill, just like my Rapture points, its not.  If we have people telling young men/women/teens that you are going to have to go through the 70th week tribulation, no matter what, and they are like, "Well, since I have to go through it anyway, I might as well wait and repent then" and thus many, MANY, will wind up in hell because they are too weak to repent and hold on until death, when they could have heeded TRUTH and of been Raptured to marry the Lamb. So, that bad teaching will take many people to hell, and our job is to gain souls for God/Christ. 

 

As a prophecy guy of 40 years that whole Daniel 9 understanding just never made one iota of sense to me.  It should be OBVIOUS, Israel has to repent BEFORE the 70th week ends. 

Edited June 12, 2024 by Revelation Man

[Charlie744]

14 minutes ago, Revelation Man said:

There is no disagreement, I am correct, and you are not. Truth has to be told to people, we can not push untruths my brother, its very dangerous to do that. People think thats 0verkill, just like my Rapture point, its not.  If we gave people telling young men/women/teens that you are going to have to go through the 70th week tribulation, no matter what, and they are like, "Well, since I have to go through it anyway, I might as well wait and repent then" and thus many, MANY, will wind up in hell because they are too weak to repent and hold on until death, when they could have heeded TRUTH and of been Raptured to marry the Lamb. So, that bad teaching will take many people to hell, and our job is to gain souls for God/Christ. 

 

As a prophecy guy of 40 years that whole Daniel 9 understanding just never made one iota of sense to  me.  It should be OBVIOUS, Israel has to repent BEFORE the 70th week ends. 

I do understand your point. You do not believe these verses speak about the Messiah. I understand you believe they speak to Israel not His first coming. 
 

Finally, Israel does not have to repent. But they will when the time of the Gentiles is over. Then, Jesus will remove the blindness from their eyes and preach the Word of God and the Testimony of Jesus for 3.5 years and then the Messiah will come. 

 

[Montana Marv]

On 6/12/2024 at 10:03 AM, Charlie744 said:

Finally, Israel does not have to repent. But they will when the time of the Gentiles is over. Then, Jesus will remove the blindness from their eyes and preach the Word of God and the Testimony of Jesus for 3.5 years and then the Messiah will come. 

The time of the Gentiles ending is at the end of the 70th Week.  When they/Israel sees the one who they have pierced (Messiah), they will mourn, just following the 2nd Coming, when they see Him.  On that day their sin is removed, on that day no bad words will come out of their mouths, on that day they will dwell in their Land.

(42 Months + 42 Months) is a One Seven;  but it is not and does not equal to 42 Months + 42 Months which the sum is seven, But not a One Seven.  Both 42 Month periods must be back to back and not split to be a True One Seven.  Christ was crucified at the end of the 69th Week.

One full Week remains.  The first 42 Months under the authority of the A/C and False Prophet; then the A/D (midweek); followed by 42 Months of authority under the Dragon/Satan.  Woe to those who live on the earth and sea, for he knows his time is short.

The 70 Weeks are but a Prophetic timeline for the Salvation of Israel.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Charlie744]

16 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

The time of the Gentiles ending is at the end of the 70th Week.  When they/Israel sees the one who they have pierced (Messiah), they will mourn, just following the 2nd Coming, when they see Him.  On that day their sin is removed, on that day no bad words will come out of their mouths, on that day they will dwell in their Land.

(42 Months + 42 Months) is a One Seven;  but it is not and does not equal to 42 Months + 42 Months which the sum is seven, But not a One Seven.  Both 42 Month periods must be back to back and not split to be a True One Seven.  Christ was crucified at the end of the 69th Week.

One full Week remains.  The first 42 Months under the authority of the A/C and False Prophet; then the A/D (midweek); followed by 42 Months of authority under the Dragon/Satan.  Woe to those who live on the earth and sea, for he knows his time is short.

The 70 Weeks are but a Prophetic timeline for the Salvation of Israel.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Marc, I don’t agree… but that doesn’t mean I am correct.

The 70 weeks were entirely completed or fulfilled. There is nothing even hinting at a gap between any of the 3 timed sections. 
 

The last week or 7 years were set aside by God for the arrival of the Messiah who would be baptized in the Jordan on the first day of the 70th week. The 69 weeks were over and now the Messiah would arrive to fulfill the 6 requirements God had given Him (9:24-27). 
 

And He did fulfill all of them despite being cut off exactly 3.5 years WITHIN the final week. He confirmed the New Covenant WITHIN OR DURING the final week… there is no such thing as a 7 year covenant.

The ONLY thing that is yet to be completed is the 4th and final Great Jubilee. It began on the exact date of the 490 year prophecy in 457 BC. Therefore, it was to end on the exact same date of 33/34 AD. This timeframe was the end of the last week of the prophecy.

However, the Messiah was crucified within 3.5 years of the last week thus the counting of the 4th Great Jubilee had stopped (the Jews having rejected and crucified their God) were no longer in “good standing” (not the best term but I am sure you understand). This meant there are still 3.5 years remaining BEFORE the 490 years ending the Great Jubilee is completed.

And this is the 3.5 years in no Revelation when God will divinely remove the blindness from the eyes of the Jews. He will give them their “Damascus” experience no different than what He did with Paul. 
 

At His first coming, God blinded the eyes of His people so they would not recognize their Messiah. After the time of the Gentiles, He will open their eyes to recognize that He was their Messiah. 
 

The 7 year tribulation period, the anti-Christ figure, the 7 year covenant, the belief  a 3rd Temple will be reconstructed only to be destroyed by this mythical figure and be termed the “AOD” is ENTIRELY false constructed by the Jesuits in the late 16th century. 
 

Verses 9:24-25, in Daniel represent the “restorative” verses regarding the coming Messiah. Verses 9:26-27 represent the “destructive” verses regarding the Messiah. 
 

Both sets of verses are all about our Lord and Savior. There is nothing about a future boogeyman coming 2000 years in the future. 
 The book of Daniel was written for the Jews and the city Jerusalem. It was written to be included in the Tanakh BEFORE HIS ARRIVAL at the end of the 70 weeks of years prophecy. It is all about Him!

 

 

[Montana Marv]

12 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Verses 9:24-25, in Daniel represent the “restorative” verses regarding the coming Messiah. Verses 9:26-27 represent the “destructive” verses regarding the Messiah. 

No, these verses give the time line for Israels Salvation.  Daniels people, and Daniels holy city must receive the benefits of the six tasks.  "On that Day" Zech 13:1, their sin will be removed, they will be cleansed.... the Second Coming.  Zech 12 and 13; there are many "On that Day" -- a fountain will open up, they will be cleansed, Jerusalem will become an immovable rock, every horse will panic, I will banish idols...

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Charlie744]

18 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

No, these verses give the time line for Israels Salvation.  Daniels people, and Daniels holy city must receive the benefits of the six tasks.  "On that Day" Zech 13:1, their sin will be removed, they will be cleansed.... the Second Coming.  Zech 12 and 13; there are many "On that Day" -- a fountain will open up, they will be cleansed, Jerusalem will become an immovable rock, every horse will panic, I will banish idols...

In Christ

Montana Marv

I disagree. They reveal what the Messiah will fulfill in His plan of salvation. The Jews were to receive their Messiah on the last week of the prophecy.

I do believe the verses you quoted from Zechariah reflects the time when God obeys their eyes and they realize that Jesus was / is their Messiah who they pierced.

They have such an incredible mission yet to fulfill in His plan of salvation. The Messiah can NOT return until His people say, “Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord.” His return will be exactly 3.5 years after they are sent out into the world as Paul was preaching the Word of God AND the Testimony of Jesus. 
 

They will indeed be cleansed and they will be an immovable rock - nothing could stop them from preaching the Good News to the world.