What does it mean that Christians are not of this world?

[missmuffet]

So many people today are claiming to be a Christian but in name only. They follow this world and all the darkness that goes along with it.

Luke warm Christians.

Revelation 3: 14-21

¹⁴ “And to the ^[a]angel of the church ^[b]of the Laodiceans write,

‘These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: ¹⁵ “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. ¹⁶ So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither ^[c]cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. ¹⁷ Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’—and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked— ¹⁸ I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. ¹⁹ As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten.^[d] Therefore be ^[e]zealous and repent. ²⁰ Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me. ²¹ To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

[AdHoc]

1 hour ago, missmuffet said:

So many people today are claiming to be a Christian but in name only. They follow this world and all the darkness that goes along with it.

Luke warm Christians.

Revelation 3: 14-21

¹⁴ “And to the ^[a]angel of the church ^[b]of the Laodiceans write,

‘These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: ¹⁵ “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. ¹⁶ So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither ^[c]cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. ¹⁷ Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’—and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked— ¹⁸ I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. ¹⁹ As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten.^[d] Therefore be ^[e]zealous and repent. ²⁰ Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me. ²¹ To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

"Not OF this world" means that they have neither their origin, nor interest in the arrangement of things on earth. The word "world" in the Greek is "kosmos" which means the way things are ordered, or "the orderly arrangement of things". Take democracy for instance. It is the prevailing western arrangement of government. In Daniel 2 God gives it the as the lowest and weakest form of government. God's arrangement of government is a Theocratic Autocracy. which Nebuchadnezzar practiced. Just his god was the wrong one. But he acknowledged Jehovah in the end.

As Jesus stood trial the arrangement of things was an impotent and illegal Israelite puppet government which did not keep God's Law. Ruling that was the sixth world Gentile power which sought to avoid an uprising for expediency's sake. Its leaders would condemn an innocent man just to curry favor with Caesar. Those loyal to Jesus had fled and/or denied Him. This arrangement of things will not prevail in the millennium. The age of grace will be over. The rule of the rod of iron will be in place. Every decision by one of Christ's co-kings (Lk.19:17-19) will be based on 100% righteousness with immediate and commensurate retribution.

"Kosmos" can also be used of how the universe is arranged. The context will tell. The planets and atoms with their Laws is a "kosmos". The arrangement whereby Satan draws people away from dependence on God is also a "kosmos". There it is the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh and the pride of life.

[PATrobas]

2 hours ago, AdHoc said:

"Not OF this world" means that they have neither their origin, nor interest in the arrangement of things on earth. The word "world" in the Greek is "kosmos" which means the way things are ordered, or "the orderly arrangement of things". Take democracy for instance. It is the prevailing western arrangement of government. In Daniel 2 God gives it the as the lowest and weakest form of government. God's arrangement of government is a Theocratic Autocracy. which Nebuchadnezzar practiced. Just his god was the wrong one. But he acknowledged Jehovah in the end.

As Jesus stood trial the arrangement of things was an impotent and illegal Israelite puppet government which did not keep God's Law. Ruling that was the sixth world Gentile power which sought to avoid an uprising for expediency's sake. Its leaders would condemn an innocent man just to curry favor with Caesar. Those loyal to Jesus had fled and/or denied Him. This arrangement of things will not prevail in the millennium. The age of grace will be over. The rule of the rod of iron will be in place. Every decision by one of Christ's co-kings (Lk.19:17-19) will be based on 100% righteousness with immediate and commensurate retribution.

"Kosmos" can also be used of how the universe is arranged. The context will tell. The planets and atoms with their Laws is a "kosmos". The arrangement whereby Satan draws people away from dependence on God is also a "kosmos". There it is the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh and the pride of life.

A teacher friend of mine a long time ago used to call it 'kosmos diabolicus' the world and its system ruled by Satan.

But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost :4  In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2Cor4:3-4

We belong to another kingdom ruled by Jesus. Our citizenship is in Heaven. Phil.3:20

[Marilyn C]

5 hours ago, missmuffet said:

So many people today are claiming to be a Christian but in name only. They follow this world and all the darkness that goes along with it.

Luke warm Christians.

Revelation 3: 14-21

¹⁴ “And to the ^[a]angel of the church ^[b]of the Laodiceans write,

‘These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: ¹⁵ “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. ¹⁶ So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither ^[c]cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. ¹⁷ Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’—and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked— ¹⁸ I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. ¹⁹ As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten.^[d] Therefore be ^[e]zealous and repent. ²⁰ Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me. ²¹ To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

So true MM,

The Laodicean group believes in the people`s justice. This is coming about as many of man`s religious organizations are telling the people to go out and fix the world system. Obviously not in so many words but that is the crux of their message - transform the world. But God is going to judge the world system, not fix it. Thus, we are seeing the rapid deterioration of what we used to think of as `Christian.`

This group believe that by partnering with the world system they can transform & change the world bringing peace, hope & justice, through man`s efforts. This is shown by their name, which reveals their character & motives.

            Laodicea -  `Laos` - people,   & `dike` - justice,     meaning – the people`s justice.

This is spiritual adultery, joining with the world & not relying on the Lord.

                                       `....friendship with the world is enmity with God.`      (James 4: 4)

                        Friendship – from the Gk word, `philia`  friendship & `philos` friend, associate, partner

This group also look to the world for leadership techniques & business strategies, measuring their success by worldly standards.

                                `I am rich, have become wealthy, & have need of nothing.` (Rev. 3: 17)

The Lord however chastises them quite severely saying that He sees them as -

                                          `wretched, miserable, poor, blind & naked -`(Rev. 3: 17)   

                                                                                                           

This group should have been a `Witness` to the world of the power of God to change people.

They should have been `faithful` to show that it is by His Spirit people are changed, & not by man`s efforts – promotions of organisations, entertainment, or big events etc.

They should have been `true` to God`s word declaring that He will judge the world, instead of saying that He is transforming it for the better.

The Lord  `the faithful & True Witness` then addresses their watered down witness or `lukewarmness.`  He tells them quite strongly, that unless they repent He will `vomit ` them out of His mouth.(Rev. 3: 16)  He then counsels them to know Him as their source -   

                               `buy from Me gold....white garments...& anoint your eyes...` (Rev. 3: 18)  

                                                                                                                                         

Gold  -  Faith in Christ & not in man.    (1 Peter 1: 7)

White Garments -  Christ`s righteousness not man`s efforts.  (Titus 3: 5 & 6)

Anoint your eyes -  Insight by the Holy Spirit into Christ`s purposes, & not man`s purposes. (John 16: 13)

                                                                                                                                                   

[missmuffet]

1 hour ago, Marilyn C said:

So true MM,

The Laodicean group believes in the people`s justice. This is coming about as many of man`s religious organizations are telling the people to go out and fix the world system. Obviously not in so many words but that is the crux of their message - transform the world. But God is going to judge the world system, not fix it. Thus, we are seeing the rapid deterioration of what we used to think of as `Christian.`

This group believe that by partnering with the world system they can transform & change the world bringing peace, hope & justice, through man`s efforts. This is shown by their name, which reveals their character & motives.

            Laodicea -  `Laos` - people,   & `dike` - justice,     meaning – the people`s justice.

This is spiritual adultery, joining with the world & not relying on the Lord.

                                       `....friendship with the world is enmity with God.`      (James 4: 4)

                        Friendship – from the Gk word, `philia`  friendship & `philos` friend, associate, partner

This group also look to the world for leadership techniques & business strategies, measuring their success by worldly standards.

                                `I am rich, have become wealthy, & have need of nothing.` (Rev. 3: 17)

The Lord however chastises them quite severely saying that He sees them as -

                                          `wretched, miserable, poor, blind & naked -`(Rev. 3: 17)   

                                                                                                           

This group should have been a `Witness` to the world of the power of God to change people.

They should have been `faithful` to show that it is by His Spirit people are changed, & not by man`s efforts – promotions of organisations, entertainment, or big events etc.

They should have been `true` to God`s word declaring that He will judge the world, instead of saying that He is transforming it for the better.

The Lord  `the faithful & True Witness` then addresses their watered down witness or `lukewarmness.`  He tells them quite strongly, that unless they repent He will `vomit ` them out of His mouth.(Rev. 3: 16)  He then counsels them to know Him as their source -   

                               `buy from Me gold....white garments...& anoint your eyes...` (Rev. 3: 18)  

                                                                                                                                         

Gold  -  Faith in Christ & not in man.    (1 Peter 1: 7)

White Garments -  Christ`s righteousness not man`s efforts.  (Titus 3: 5 & 6)

Anoint your eyes -  Insight by the Holy Spirit into Christ`s purposes, & not man`s purposes. (John 16: 13)

                                                                                                                                                   

Yes, counterfeit Christians. There are a bunch of them out there.

[enoob57]

They are just sinners living in their lies... 

Matthew 7:13 (KJV)

[13] Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

God told us about them
2 Corinthians 11:14 (KJV)

[14] And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

[15] Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

We must examine the fruit of their lives to see
Matthew 7:16 (KJV)

[16] Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

If their focus is on the world and it's contents to gain then you can know God says this
1 John 2:15 (KJV)

[15] Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

[AdHoc]

The title of the thread ASSUMES that Christians take their rightful place OUTSIDE the mechanisms of the world. Now the postings have taken a natural turn. It is now who or what are those who are attached to the Name of Jesus but who belong to the world. The parable of the Wheat and the Tares deals with this. Unbeknown to many students of the Word, TWO judgments take place in this parable.

First comes the setting. In Matthew Chapter 12 the rejection of Jesus by Israel reaches its zenith. He is accused of being a servant of Beelzebub. His reply is to say that His accusers will not be forgiven - not even in the next age. This effectively meant that Israel forfeit the Kingdom, for this is the great theme of the next age. Jesus then denies His blood-kin - His mother and brothers. he introduces a new class of people - His disciples. He is joined to them via a heavenly Father. Earthly ties count for  nothing. He tells four parables concerning the Kingdom, which now falls to His disciples.

Teaching from a boat is very telling. Whereas Israel is designated as "sand of the sea-shore", it is the nations that are "as the sea". A boat is IN the sea but not OFF the sea. And Jesus, no longer teaching from the "sand of the seashore" tells "all who have ears" how the Kingdom will develop in the age of rejection. The Kingdom faces enemies and so each of the parables shows the effect, in this age, of the efforts of the enemies. But as we shall presently see, Christians can be the enemy.

The field is the world. In it are sown children of the Kingdom by rebirth (Jn.3:3-5). God's enemy, Satan, also sows. During the growing period, the difference cannot be seen. The Master bids His servants NOT to pluck out the Tares because by sight they are so similar to the Wheat. The harvest comes, and only now the difference is apparent. The Tares are gathered and burnt. That is the end of the Tares. The harvest of the FIELD is done. The counterfeit Christians are removed. But Matthew 13:41 turns to a new judgment - A HARVEST WITHIN THE KINGDOM (not the field). In Christ's Kingdom are "workers of iniquity" and "offenders". They are removed in a second gathering. These are Wheat. These are true Christians. The were not planted by the enemy. The tares are long gone.

These are real Christians, born again, who have worked iniquity. They are not contrasted with the Tares. They are contrasted with the "RIGHTEOUS". The parable is told so that ONLY the disciples would understand. Do we, as disciples, realize that some of us are going to be in the world and are going to fornicate with the world. Was it not in the adjoining parable of the Sower that the "cares of this world" caused the crop failure? Notice also that there is no talk of them becoming Tares. They REMAIN WHEAT - but are burned.

A somber warning for all Christians. We are left IN the world. We should display Christ but not be OF the world. We work and play in enemy territory. It will one day be ours, but until then, any relations with the world will end in judgment - chastisement.

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear. (Mt 13:41–43).

[Vine Abider]

On 9/14/2024 at 7:20 AM, AdHoc said:

The title of the thread ASSUMES that Christians take their rightful place OUTSIDE the mechanisms of the world. Now the postings have taken a natural turn. It is now who or what are those who are attached to the Name of Jesus but who belong to the world. The parable of the Wheat and the Tares deals with this. Unbeknown to many students of the Word, TWO judgments take place in this parable.

First comes the setting. In Matthew Chapter 12 the rejection of Jesus by Israel reaches its zenith. He is accused of being a servant of Beelzebub. His reply is to say that His accusers will not be forgiven - not even in the next age. This effectively meant that Israel forfeit the Kingdom, for this is the great theme of the next age. Jesus then denies His blood-kin - His mother and brothers. he introduces a new class of people - His disciples. He is joined to them via a heavenly Father. Earthly ties count for  nothing. He tells four parables concerning the Kingdom, which now falls to His disciples.

Teaching from a boat is very telling. Whereas Israel is designated as "sand of the sea-shore", it is the nations that are "as the sea". A boat is IN the sea but not OFF the sea. And Jesus, no longer teaching from the "sand of the seashore" tells "all who have ears" how the Kingdom will develop in the age of rejection. The Kingdom faces enemies and so each of the parables shows the effect, in this age, of the efforts of the enemies. But as we shall presently see, Christians can be the enemy.

The field is the world. In it are sown children of the Kingdom by rebirth (Jn.3:3-5). God's enemy, Satan, also sows. During the growing period, the difference cannot be seen. The Master bids His servants NOT to pluck out the Tares because by sight they are so similar to the Wheat. The harvest comes, and only now the difference is apparent. The Tares are gathered and burnt. That is the end of the Tares. The harvest of the FIELD is done. The counterfeit Christians are removed. But Matthew 13:41 turns to a new judgment - A HARVEST WITHIN THE KINGDOM (not the field). In Christ's Kingdom are "workers of iniquity" and "offenders". They are removed in a second gathering. These are Wheat. These are true Christians. The were not planted by the enemy. The tares are long gone.

These are real Christians, born again, who have worked iniquity. They are not contrasted with the Tares. They are contrasted with the "RIGHTEOUS". The parable is told so that ONLY the disciples would understand. Do we, as disciples, realize that some of us are going to be in the world and are going to fornicate with the world. Was it not in the adjoining parable of the Sower that the "cares of this world" caused the crop failure? Notice also that there is no talk of them becoming Tares. They REMAIN WHEAT - but are burned.

A somber warning for all Christians. We are left IN the world. We should display Christ but not be OF the world. We work and play in enemy territory. It will one day be ours, but until then, any relations with the world will end in judgment - chastisement.

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear. (Mt 13:41–43).

Interesting read in how you laid that out!  Yes, so many warnings to the children of God (that is, those experiencing the new birth with Christ's life now in them). Since genuine Christians have the life of God in them AND still have the flesh (where sin resides), we have two disparate sources we can draw on. 

The flesh of a born-again believer is capable of exceeding evil, while our spirit is the source of love and grace, and we therefore have a choice.  If we turn to Christ we tap into this awesome supply within us and let Him transform us into His image;  And if we set our mind on the flesh, we will be supplied by its dark funk.  But God is amazing in how He set this up, because now even when we indulge in the flesh, there is no condemnation because of Christ's all-efficacious blood --> He simply loves us and woos us back to Himself and His cleansing/transforming Spirit.

"All things are lawful to me, yet not all things are profitable; all things are lawful,

but not all things build-up (the body of Christ)!"

1 Cor 10:23

 

[AdHoc]

4 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

Interesting read in how you laid that out!  Yes, so many warnings to the children of God (that is, those experiencing the new birth with Christ's life now in them). Since genuine Christians have the life of God in them AND still have the flesh (where sin resides), we have two disparate sources we can draw on. 

The flesh of a born-again believer is capable of exceeding evil, while our spirit is the source of love and grace, and we therefore have a choice.  If we turn to Christ we tap into this awesome supply within us and let Him transform us into His image;  And if we set our mind on the flesh, we will be supplied by its dark funk.  But God is amazing in how He set this up, because now even when we indulge in the flesh, there is no condemnation because of Christ's all-efficacious blood --> He simply loves us and woos us back to Himself and His cleansing/transforming Spirit.

"All things are lawful to me, yet not all things are profitable; all things are lawful,

but not all things build-up (the body of Christ)!"

1 Cor 10:23

 

I propose two of many such contrasts.

5 How goodly are thy tents, O Jacob, and thy tabernacles, O Israel!

This was God's view of the camp of Israel in Numbers 24:5 when Balaam tried to curse Israel. But one must ask the question, did Jehovah get it right, for in Acts 7:51, Stephen, inspired, says of the same bunch

51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye

The deciding verses are Acts 7:42-43;

42 Then God turned, and gave them up to worship the host of heaven; as it is written in the book of the prophets, O ye house of Israel, have ye offered to me slain beasts and sacrifices by the space of forty years in the wilderness? 43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them: and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.

Joshua 24:14 tells us that Israel worshiped idols in Egypt. Acts 7 says that they continued unabated during the 40 years of the wilderness. So how come Jehovah passes a ruling on the tents of Israel as "goodly". Were they not polluted by idols? Which was correct and why the radical difference? Why utter condemnation in one, but of the same case, utter approval?

The answer for Israel lies in the words "O Jacob" and subsequently "O Israel". When Jehovah uses the term "thy tents O Jacob", he refers to Jacob the man IN WHOM all Israel were once. He completes te sense of Jacob by calling Jacob's SEED - Israel. These SEED are regarded by God as still being IN Jacob. Now Jacob did not worship idols. His wife did, but not him. Similarly, the Church has a POSITION "IN" Christ where God views Christ only, but in actual fact the SEED of the Holy Spirit are guilty in fact.

The  word "condemnation" is a decision before a judge. If Christ is se before God the r is NO condemnation of both Him and whatever was IN Him. But if you take those seeds one by one and see what they have done in their "tabernacle" (the flesh - 2nd Cor.5:1-2), all are found sinners and condemned. The term "IN Christ" is our POSITION. The term "done in his body" stems from our DISPOSITION. The term "IN Christ" appears 77 times in the New Testament it speaks of how God sees us as Christ's body. But if you stand accountable for YOUR actions, why, "No good thing dwell IN YOU ... "

[christsavedme]

On 9/13/2024 at 9:15 PM, missmuffet said:

So many people today are claiming to be a Christian but in name only. They follow this world and all the darkness that goes along with it.

Luke warm Christians.

Revelation 3: 14-21

¹⁴ “And to the ^[a]angel of the church ^[b]of the Laodiceans write,

‘These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: ¹⁵ “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. ¹⁶ So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither ^[c]cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. ¹⁷ Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’—and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked— ¹⁸ I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. ¹⁹ As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten.^[d] Therefore be ^[e]zealous and repent. ²⁰ Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me. ²¹  To him who overcomes, I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

I love how you broke this down. Throughout history, we've seen how easy it is for faith to become lukewarm, for believers to grow complacent in their spiritual lives.

The human psyche often seeks comfort and avoids discomfort. This can lead us to a false sense of security in our faith, much like the Laodiceans who believed they were "rich and in need of nothing." But true spiritual wealth comes from a deep, active relationship with God.

Our modern world, with its distractions and material focus, can easily lead us astray from our spiritual path. We must be vigilant, constantly examining our hearts and actions to ensure we're not merely going through the motions of faith.

God's love is not passive. He "rebukes and disciplines those he loves." This divine correction is an opportunity for growth, a chance to deepen our faith and recommit ourselves to living authentically as Christians.