What does it mean that Christians are not of this world?

[Neighbor]

On 9/13/2024 at 9:56 PM, missmuffet said:

Yes, counterfeit Christians. There are a bunch of them out there.

Counterfeit? Seems a rather harsh blanket indictment. There are, as have always been, wolves that come to teach  within the body of Christ Jesus an errant or even a false gospel; but to call a brother or sister counterfeits? Don't think so.

From the beginning there were differences, serious differences, between the Apostles even. Yet all were of God's doing  and used by Him as He dispersed them to where he willed them to be in order to reach whom God willed be reached at His good time and pleasure.

If I stay to the word of God  the Bible  seeking understanding, and then use or application for  today for myself, trying to do so in an expository manner,  I find I have little time to be csting judgement as to the righteousness of the faithing of others.

When by contrast I wander away and start judging whether another is righteous  in the sight of God rather than discerning what God wills of me, I  can get puffed up in myself to my own later sorrows, for having missed opportunity for fellowship in and under Christ Jesus. 

[Neighbor]

As to the thread title.  An individual called to repentance from the way of the world, that of denying God altogether, to being called  into submission under God's decree by way  of the Holy Spirit's reveal of Jesus, that person is still in this world, but not of it any longer,  in that the Holy Spirit then indwells such a person, giving new awareness of the word of God;  presuming it is read and applied in all that one does; doing so to the glory of Jesus.

[DavidReese]

Jesus wraps all things up after explaining things to Nicodemus in one verse. There are many scriptures about this. Isaiah 42 speaks of Jesus coming.

John 3

¹³ And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Jesus speaking of coming to the prison we are in.

Luke 4

¹⁸ The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,¹⁹ To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

[enoob57]

3 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Counterfeit? Seems a rather harsh blanket indictment. There are, as have always been, wolves that come to teach  within the body of Christ Jesus an errant or even a false gospel; but to call a brother or sister counterfeits? Don't think so.

Kind of chasing your own tail in this... wolves appearing as sheep = counterfeit Christians ... I don't see where she defined this as real Christians? It appears from the writ she is addressing wolves and luke warm Christian ... perhaps you can explain your indictment 

[missmuffet]

8 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Counterfeit? Seems a rather harsh blanket indictment. There are, as have always been, wolves that come to teach  within the body of Christ Jesus an errant or even a false gospel; but to call a brother or sister counterfeits? Don't think so.

From the beginning there were differences, serious differences, between the Apostles even. Yet all were of God's doing  and used by Him as He dispersed them to where he willed them to be in order to reach whom God willed be reached at His good time and pleasure.

If I stay to the word of God  the Bible  seeking understanding, and then use or application for  today for myself, trying to do so in an expository manner,  I find I have little time to be csting judgement as to the righteousness of the faithing of others.

When by contrast I wander away and start judging whether another is righteous  in the sight of God rather than discerning what God wills of me, I  can get puffed up in myself to my own later sorrows, for having missed opportunity for fellowship in and under Christ Jesus. 

8 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Counterfeit? Seems a rather harsh blanket indictment. There are, as have always been, wolves that come to teach  within the body of Christ Jesus an errant or even a false gospel; but to call a brother or sister counterfeits? Don't think so.

From the beginning there were differences, serious differences, between the Apostles even. Yet all were of God's doing  and used by Him as He dispersed them to where he willed them to be in order to reach whom God willed be reached at His good time and pleasure.

If I stay to the word of God  the Bible  seeking understanding, and then use or application for  today for myself, trying to do so in an expository manner,  I find I have little time to be csting judgement as to the righteousness of the faithing of others.

When by contrast I wander away and start judging whether another is righteous  in the sight of God rather than discerning what God wills of me, I  can get puffed up in myself to my own later sorrows, for having missed opportunity for fellowship in and under Christ Jesus. 

I do not think it is harsh. It is only honest. Fake Christians, Christians in name only. Scripture tells us God hates that and that he would vomit them out of His mouth. Only God knows their heart but there are many, many out there. 

[missmuffet]

5 hours ago, enoob57 said:

Kind of chasing your own tail in this... wolves appearing as sheep = counterfeit Christians ... I don't see where she defined this as real Christians? It appears from the writ she is addressing wolves and luke warm Christian ... perhaps you can explain your indictment 

Yes, enoob. Thank you for your insightfulness.

[missmuffet]

9 hours ago, christsavedme said:

I love how you broke this down. Throughout history, we've seen how easy it is for faith to become lukewarm, for believers to grow complacent in their spiritual lives.

The human psyche often seeks comfort and avoids discomfort. This can lead us to a false sense of security in our faith, much like the Laodiceans who believed they were "rich and in need of nothing." But true spiritual wealth comes from a deep, active relationship with God.

Our modern world, with its distractions and material focus, can easily lead us astray from our spiritual path. We must be vigilant, constantly examining our hearts and actions to ensure we're not merely going through the motions of faith.

God's love is not passive. He "rebukes and disciplines those he loves." This divine correction is an opportunity for growth, a chance to deepen our faith and recommit ourselves to living authentically as Christians.

Yes, have you ever heard of a Christian being put on the shelf? There are Christian videos put out there on this subject. If you would like to see one I could post it for you.

[TheBlade]

I personally don't like saying when it comes to "people" I never met, don't know on and on. the words "some, many, few, all" blah blah blah. When I do use any of those words its just people I have personally come across and know so my words are true. Now though we only see flesh this can tell us allot about that person .. yet we have to right up front know only He sees the heart and that heart can be 100% different then what we are seeing and hearing. Also we need to know were only looking at some moment in time not the whole life

When He spoke those words in Rev 3 He new the heart but this is what He ended it on "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent. Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me." 

I don't know why we believers don't speak more words of life.. like I bet once they heard this .. oh nan they repented and got right with Christ. Also no one was spit out of His mouth. From what I read and study its not "will" its "about to".  The "as many as I love I rebuck and chasten so be zealous and repent" says it all. 

Now break down what about to spit you out of my mouth means. What we should notice upfront is.. its not written what He meant. We say "not a Christian He is rejecting you". Yes just reading it I would agree but I also know that is not written. There is so much we do not understand. Well book of life is not the Lambs book.  So what is it then? I will blot your name of of the book of life. Is that what He said? I like this "The promise: “I will not erase his name from the book of life” does not necessarily imply that some do have their names erased. It simply says, to the one who is in the book, and who conquers in faith" What I like is "not necessarily imply.. simply says". 

We imply with digging up other verses and put them together to say what we want. This is NOT about salvation. I am trying to say .. we do not fully see nor understand. This is a GOD that left heaven to become man and then. so much love to those us that hated Him .. He knew all the evil this world will do .. some evils that never ever ever get talked about.. He died for the world. I am sure at times I have fallen into the "many". 

[missmuffet]

1 hour ago, TheBlade said:

I personally don't like saying when it comes to "people" I never met, don't know on and on. the words "some, many, few, all" blah blah blah. When I do use any of those words its just people I have personally come across and know so my words are true. Now though we only see flesh this can tell us allot about that person .. yet we have to right up front know only He sees the heart and that heart can be 100% different then what we are seeing and hearing. Also we need to know were only looking at some moment in time not the whole life

When He spoke those words in Rev 3 He new the heart but this is what He ended it on "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent. Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me." 

I don't know why we believers don't speak more words of life.. like I bet once they heard this .. oh nan they repented and got right with Christ. Also no one was spit out of His mouth. From what I read and study its not "will" its "about to".  The "as many as I love I rebuck and chasten so be zealous and repent" says it all. 

Now break down what about to spit you out of my mouth means. What we should notice upfront is.. its not written what He meant. We say "not a Christian He is rejecting you". Yes just reading it I would agree but I also know that is not written. There is so much we do not understand. Well book of life is not the Lambs book.  So what is it then? I will blot your name of of the book of life. Is that what He said? I like this "The promise: “I will not erase his name from the book of life” does not necessarily imply that some do have their names erased. It simply says, to the one who is in the book, and who conquers in faith" What I like is "not necessarily imply.. simply says". 

We imply with digging up other verses and put them together to say what we want. This is NOT about salvation. I am trying to say .. we do not fully see nor understand. This is a GOD that left heaven to become man and then. so much love to those us that hated Him .. He knew all the evil this world will do .. some evils that never ever ever get talked about.. He died for the world. I am sure at times I have fallen into the "many". 

Where do you think believers souls go when they die? Where do you think the unbelievers souls go when they die?

[Bruce_Leiter]

Dear friend, your topic heading sent me immediately to John 17. Jesus' prayer to the Father says in part in that chapter: 

Joh 17:13  But now I am coming to you, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have my joy fulfilled in themselves. 
Joh 17:14  I have given them your word, and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 
Joh 17:15  I do not ask that you take them out of the world, but that you keep them from the evil one. 
Joh 17:16  They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 
Joh 17:17  Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth. 
Joh 17:18  As you sent me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. 
Joh 17:19  And for their sake I consecrate myself, that they also may be sanctified in truth (ESV).

Notice that Jesus prays for his disciples and, by application, for us that we be filled with God's joy (verse 13 and Philippians 4:3), God's words (verse 14), be separate from the values and ideas of the culture around us and the devil's lies and influences (verse 15), be more and more holy (verse 17), and be God's witnesses and positive influences in the culture (verse 15a, 18). Thus, we are to be "in the world but not of it."