Sheep/Goats Judgement not same as Great White Throne?

[Dennis1209]

1 hour ago, Vine Abider said:

Yes, there is what you quoted in red, and that does sound like believers. But He also says sheep are entering simply because they showed compassion on just one of the least of His brothers, right?

I am not trying to convince anyone of my views or change minds. Where in the Bible are sheep ever symbolized in a negative context, as opposed to goats? The sheep hear God’s voice, symbolizing the sheep belong to Him, the Lamb of God.

In other words, these tribulation sheep (saints still alive) accepted the Lord and were saved. If one is spirit-filled (sheep), they have the fruits of the Spirit toward even the least of their brethren, even under threat of prison and death.

I see it as they opposed the genocide and helped the Jews where they could; the fruit of the Spirit shined through.

[Marilyn C]

9 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

I am not trying to convince anyone of my views or change minds. Where in the Bible are sheep ever symbolized in a negative context, as opposed to goats? The sheep hear God’s voice, symbolizing the sheep belong to Him, the Lamb of God.

In other words, these tribulation sheep (saints still alive) accepted the Lord and were saved. If one is spirit-filled (sheep), they have the fruits of the Spirit toward even the least of their brethren, even under threat of prison and death.

I see it as they opposed the genocide and helped the Jews where they could; the fruit of the Spirit shined through.

Hi Dennis,

Only those in the Body of Christ are Spirit-filled. Before Christ ascended believers only had the Spirit come upon them. Believers in God after Christ takes His Body to glory will only have the Spirit to draw them to God. They will NOT have the Holy Spirit within to make them like Christ, That is just for this Body purpose.

[Vine Abider]

1 hour ago, missmuffet said:

Yes, because they assisted persecuted/needy believers during the

tribulation but also because of their saving faith. The sheep are

believers where the goats are not believers.

The passage says nothing of "their saving faith" but only the compassion they showed Christ's brethren, right?

[Marilyn C]

26 minutes ago, Vine Abider said:

The passage says nothing of "their saving faith" but only the compassion they showed Christ's brethren, right?

Spot on there VA I believe,

The `sheep` people will go through to the millennium and will need to turn to God and follow His ways as shown by Israel if they want eternal life. 

They will eventually be judged at the Great White Throne.

[missmuffet]

1 hour ago, Vine Abider said:

The passage says nothing of "their saving faith" but only the compassion they showed Christ's brethren, right?

They obviously have to be Christians and be saved. That is a given.

[tatwo]

Greetings @Vine Abider...interesting conversation...thank you.

I was thinking to myself…Lord…”Vine Abider” loves you and…has in prior conversations…brought forth light for me and others…what am I missing here? I just stopped and asked the Lord for understanding…first because of the respect I have for you as a brother who carefully studies and secondly because I have been working on “who” it actually is that is on the earth during the millennial age where the Body of Christ rules with the Lord Yahshua.

Check this out…if you are working from the “King James or the New King James” translations…the verse that seems to me to be creating this “difference” of interpretation between us is…Matthew 25:40…

Mat 25:40 KJV  “And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.”

Mat 25:40 NKJV  “And the King will answer and say to them, 'Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.”

I think I can see how “you are seeing” what I referenced as a 3^rd group that I don’t see. It says “unto the least of these” apparently signifying a 3^rd group because what follows that is “my brethren” making it seem like there are the “least of these” and separate from them is “my brethren.”

I do often reference the KJV and the NKJV in my studies…I have for many years…however my primary study version is the NASB. Look at how Matthew 25:40 is written in the NASB…

Mat 25:40 NASB “The King will answer and say to them, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.”

Mat 25:40 KJV  “And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.”

In the NASB…the “least of these” from the KJV…is written as “these brothers of Mine” thereby signifying that both those who are "serving and those who are being served" are His righteous brothers.

Whereas in the KJV it appears to reveal them as separate…can you see what I mean?

Here's a few additional interpretations and version for consideration.

Mat 25:40 GW  "The king will answer them, 'I can guarantee this truth: Whatever you did for one of my brothers or sisters, no matter how unimportant they seemed, you did for me.'

Mat 25:40 NET  And the king will answer them, ‘I tell you the truth, just as you did it for one of the least of these brothers or sisters of mine, you did it for me.’

Mat 25:40 NIV  "The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'

Mat 25:40 NRSV  And the king will answer them, 'Truly I tell you, just as you did it to one of the least of these who are members of my family, you did it to me.'

Tatwo...:)

[tatwo]

2 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Believers in God after Christ takes His Body to glory will only have the Spirit to draw them to God. They will NOT have the Holy Spirit within to make them like Christ, That is just for this Body purpose.

In John 3:5 “Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.” This is the process by which one receives the Holy Spirit…which is the “key” to entering the spiritual Kingdom of God...which is Christ.

In Matthew 25:34…when speaking to the “sheep” that were separated out of “all the nations”…at His return…to conclude the age…the Lord Yahshua said…“Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.”

Only those “born of water and the spirit” can enter the Kingdom of God Marilyn…and those sheep at the end of the age when the Lord returns will inherit the Kingdom of God as a blessing from their Father…you may want to rethink what you posted here.

Tatwo...:)

[Marilyn C]

42 minutes ago, tatwo said:

In John 3:5 “Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.” This is the process by which one receives the Holy Spirit…which is the “key” to entering the spiritual Kingdom of God...which is Christ.

In Matthew 25:34…when speaking to the “sheep” that were separated out of “all the nations”…at His return…to conclude the age…the Lord Yahshua said…“Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.”

Only those “born of water and the spirit” can enter the Kingdom of God Marilyn…and those sheep at the end of the age when the Lord returns will inherit the Kingdom of God as a blessing from their Father…you may want to rethink what you posted here.

Tatwo...:)

Yes, by water and the Holy Spirit. However, the Holy Spirit was not given to be within anyone till the Lord ascended to heaven. Thus, those previously did not have the Holy Spirit within them, but upon them.

And the kingdom/rule of the Lord as promised (before the Body of Christ) was the kingdom rule of the Lord over Israel in the millennium.

[Jedi4Yahweh]

58 minutes ago, Marilyn C said:

Yes, by water and the Holy Spirit. However, the Holy Spirit was not given to be within anyone till the Lord ascended to heaven. Thus, those previously did not have the Holy Spirit within them, but upon them.

And the kingdom/rule of the Lord as promised (before the Body of Christ) was the kingdom rule of the Lord over Israel in the millennium.

The scriptures says in certain places that some people of the OT had the Holy Spirit in them and in some places it says upon them...but it also says in the Last days NT the Spirit will come upon them and they will prophecy, see visions, etc...   Having the Holy Spirit in you is definitely part of the NT promise...but we can not say that none of OT prophets or saints did not have the Holy Spirit in them.

Peter said this of the OT prophets:

Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace [that should come] unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. - 1Pe 1:10-11 

Holy Spirit In (OT):

Yet for many years You had patience with them, And testified against them by Your Spirit in Your prophets. Yet they would not listen; Therefore You gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. - Neh 9:30 NKJV

Then the LORD spoke to Moses, saying: "See, I have called by name Bezalel the son of Uri, the son of Hur, of the tribe of Judah. "And I have filled him with the Spirit of God, in wisdom, in understanding, in knowledge, and in all [manner of] workmanship, - Exo 31:1-3 NKJV

Ezekiel: Then the Spirit entered me when He spoke to me, and set me on my feet; and I heard Him who spoke to me. - Eze 2:2 NKJV

And it happened, when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, that the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. - Luk 1:41 

Now his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Spirit, and prophesied, saying: - Luk 1:67 

Holy Spirit Upon (OT):

Then Moses said to him, "Are you zealous for my sake? Oh, that all the LORD's people were prophets [and] that the LORD would put His Spirit upon them!" - Num 11:29 

"Then the Spirit of the LORD will come upon you, and you will prophesy with them and be turned into another man. - 1Sa 10:6 

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Holy Spirit In (NT):

"the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. - Jhn 14:17 

Holy Spirit Upon (NT):

And the Holy Spirit descended in bodily form like a dove upon Him, and a voice came from heaven which said, "You are My beloved Son; in You I am well pleased." - Luk 3:22 

"But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." - Act 1:8

"And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them, as upon us at the beginning. - Act 11:15 

And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. - Act 19:6 NKJV

While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. - Act 10:44

[Marilyn C]

1 hour ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

The scriptures says in certain places that some people of the OT had the Holy Spirit in them and in some places it says upon them...but it also says in the Last days NT the Spirit will come upon them and they will prophecy, see visions, etc...   Having the Holy Spirit in you is definitely part of the NT promise...but we can not say that none of OT prophets or saints did not have the Holy Spirit in them.

Peter said this of the OT prophets:

Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace [that should come] unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. - 1Pe 1:10-11 

Holy Spirit In (OT):

Yet for many years You had patience with them, And testified against them by Your Spirit in Your prophets. Yet they would not listen; Therefore You gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. - Neh 9:30 NKJV

Then the LORD spoke to Moses, saying: "See, I have called by name Bezalel the son of Uri, the son of Hur, of the tribe of Judah. "And I have filled him with the Spirit of God, in wisdom, in understanding, in knowledge, and in all [manner of] workmanship, - Exo 31:1-3 NKJV

Ezekiel: Then the Spirit entered me when He spoke to me, and set me on my feet; and I heard Him who spoke to me. - Eze 2:2 NKJV

And it happened, when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, that the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. - Luk 1:41 

Now his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Spirit, and prophesied, saying: - Luk 1:67 

Holy Spirit Upon (OT):

Then Moses said to him, "Are you zealous for my sake? Oh, that all the LORD's people were prophets [and] that the LORD would put His Spirit upon them!" - Num 11:29 

"Then the Spirit of the LORD will come upon you, and you will prophesy with them and be turned into another man. - 1Sa 10:6 

-----

Holy Spirit In (NT):

"the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. - Jhn 14:17 

Holy Spirit Upon (NT):

And the Holy Spirit descended in bodily form like a dove upon Him, and a voice came from heaven which said, "You are My beloved Son; in You I am well pleased." - Luk 3:22 

"But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." - Act 1:8

"And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them, as upon us at the beginning. - Act 11:15 

And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. - Act 19:6 NKJV

While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. - Act 10:44

Thank you for that correction Jedi,

yes, the Holy Spirit was IN some in the OT for specific purposes relating to Israel. Then when the Lord ascended to the Father He sent the Holy Spirit to be within the believers to make them like unto Himself in the Body of Christ.

After that purpose is completed, we know that the Holy Spirit will draw people to God and look for the coming Messiah. A different purpose then.