What was God`s Purpose in making the Nations, Israel and the Body of Christ?

[biblelesson]

4 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi biblelesson,

Thank you for your good reply. I agree with some of what you write, however there are a few points to discuss.

Nations.

We need to remember that there were four centuries of people before the Body of Christ started. Think of Seth. He was the third son of Adam and Eve. And from then on, many people turned to God.

`And Adam knew his wife again, and she bore a son and named him Seth. “For God has appointed another seed for me instead of Abel, whom Cain killed.” And as for Seth, to him also a son was born; and he named him Enosh. Then men began to call on the name of the LORD.` (Gen. 4: 25 & 26)

So way back in the very early days people turned to God. They didn`t know all about Jesus however it is because of Jesus` sacrifice that they will be saved. They are not `set` in the Body of Christ as we are, (1 Cor. 12: 18) but they will populate the new earth. This was God`s purpose for man, (Gen. 1: 28) and God will yet fulfill that. (Rev. 21: 24)

 

Israel.

Glad you see that God hasn`t cast away the nation of Israel. However, they are not in the Body of Christ. Yes, individual Jews who turn to God in the time of the Body of Christ will be in in that purpose, however, the nation of Israel will yet turn to God by His Holy Spirit and rule the nations as purposed. (Zech. 12: 10.   1 Kings 2: 45) I see that you noted that will be in the millennium. Good, I agree.

Yes, Israel is grafted back into the Lord but not into the Body of Christ. It is from Him that the purposes will be individually fulfilled.

 

Body of Christ.

We will not be in the New Jerusalem for that was promised to the Old Testament saints. (Heb. 11: 16) And the New Jerusalem comes down out of the third heaven from God. (Rev. 21: 2) The Body of Christ, however, is seated with Christ on His own throne in the third heaven, on Mount Zion. (Ps. 2: 6   Rev. 3: 21)

God the Father and Jesus are in each realm by their Holy Spirit however, their seat of power and authority is in the third heavens. It is from there that they rule over all of God`s great kingdom. (Rev. 4:1- 4   1 Cor. 15: 24   Ps. 68: 33   Isa. 66: 1)

 

Thank Marilyn, 

This subject is very interesting! Requires more study on my part! Thanks for the scriptures!

[Marilyn C]

58 minutes ago, biblelesson said:

Thank Marilyn, 

This subject is very interesting! Requires more study on my part! Thanks for the scriptures!

That`s all good. May the Lord reveal more of His truth to you (and all of us). Anything you find of interest, please let us know.

[tatwo]

On 6/6/2025 at 12:42 AM, Marilyn C said:

Now one point I would like you to enlarge on please -

The other...is temporal and physical...that which is created...has a beginning and has an ending just as everything that God created...will cease to exist when they have fulfilled God’s divine purposes. This includes all nations and peoples....

It seems to me you are saying that God`s purpose for them is just in time and not eternity. Is that so?

Greetings @Marilyn C...

Here is what I am “saying”...in order for something to be “eternal” it had to have existed before creation and time. For example...“In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.” The only thing that I am aware of that existed before the creation of the heavens and the earth is...God...who is a “Spirit.” When there was no creation and all that comes with it in the heavens and on the earth...there was the eternal Spirit of God the Father.

Marilyn, from what I think I know...about that which exists eternally...can accurately be defined and qualified as “no beginning and no ending” and I would cite the “Spirit of God”...as both my proof and example. So...any connection to an eternal existence must be defined this way...the Spirit of God.

So as it would seem...the only way for something to exist eternally is...to be of the same substance that God the eternal Spirit Himself “is.” I am speaking of that which “He” allots via Christ...and is realized and recognized as an endowment [of Spirit] out of His own person...which is Spirit. He does this...and rest assured that it is Him and only Him that can do this.

“I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father [eternal Spirit] but through Me.” This is the Lords personal and only...authenticated access to God...His eternal Spirit Father...and it is only offered to humans as He calls them to it. For those who respond to His call...in faith and obedience...they will then be...“reconciled”...meaning to...“reestablish a close relationship”...in this case a spiritual “likeness, oneness, or unity” with the eternal Spirit of God.

This should tie my entire thought together for you Sister...the connection that a human has to the eternal Spirit of God is our human spirit...which came from God to begin with? When He indwells the human spirit with His Holy Spirit...that human spirit is then “reanimated and reconnected” to its pre-creation, preordained, predestined eternal existence. This eternal life only exists...in or as the Spirit of God.

I quoted you Paul’s teaching on this very subject in an earlier post...here it is once again...

Ephesians 1... “He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will...just as He chose us in Him  before the foundation of the world...He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him...also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will”

Romans 8...“For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son...and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.”

Ephesians 2... “For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.”

This is why Paul also teaches things like...

“from now on we recognize no one according to the flesh; even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him in this way no longer.”

“There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female”

“For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek”

“a renewal in which there is no distinction between Greek and Jew”

The Lord Himself put it this way...

“That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.”

Jews and gentiles are separate independent human flesh and blood definitions applied to those who can exist in creation only. For those of us who are born of God’s eternal Spirit...we are no longer merely carnal temporal human beings that can only exist in creation. We are “Spirit beings” whose spirits exist eternally in Christ...though some of us are yet clothed upon by flesh.

Our spiritual existence is in the invisible Kingdom of God where Yahshua is...and we are eternally alive in the Spirit. This is why “in the Spirit realm of eternity” there are no distinctions between “Jew and Greek.”

There is only one Kingdom in the eternal Spirit...the Kingdom of God...there is only one priesthood in eternity and it is the Royal Priesthood and the only nation in eternity is a Holy Nation and it is made up of “the spirits of the righteous made perfect.”

Here I’ll leave you with a quote from Peter in regards to the matter Sister Marilyn C... “But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light: Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy. 1^st Peter 2:9-10 KJV

Tatwo...:)

[Dennis1209]

18 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Dennis,

Great to have a discussion on one point. Now what those esteemed men have said is good however one point doesn`t match up with scripture. You see God is everywhere by His Holy Spirit and as King David said if he went to hell God would be there. (Ps. 139: 8)

That then would be ridiculous saying that hell is heaven. So, saying wherever God is, is heaven is not correct.

Heaven is a place and a word used for the three areas -

1. Atmospheric heavens where the birds fly, rain etc. (James 5: 17)

2. The Universal heavens - the sun, moon and planets etc. (Gen. 1: 14)

3. The third heaven - the invisible realm where God`s throne is. (Isa. 66: 1    Col. 1: 16)

God`s word tells us some things about heaven - the invisible third heaven.

`...you have come to Mount Zion, and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, to the general assembly and church of the first-born who are registered in heaven, to God the judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.` (Heb. 12: 22 - 24)

So we have in the third heaven -

God the Father, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. 

Innumerable company of angels - who minister to believers. (Heb. 1: 14)

Mount Zion - the ruling area of God`s throne and Jesus will have His own throne (authority) there too. (Ps. 2: 6)

General Assembly - the church - the believers in the Body of Christ who are asleep in Christ. When the whole Body is gathered together they will go to the Lord`s own throne on Mount Zion. (Ps. 2: 6   Rev. 3: 21)

The New Jerusalem city - this symbolically has streets of gold, meaning those who by faith looked for this city as God promised them. (Heb. 11: 16) Faith being more precious than gold. (1 Peter 1: 7)

This city will come down out of the third heaven and reside in the Universal area. There it will be the administrative center for God`s rulership through Israel over the earth.

It is also the means whereby God connects and interlocks the spiritual and physical realms. The symbol of this is the `Bride,` representing this connecting and interlocking. (Rev. 21: 2 & 9 - 11)

The spirits of just men (& women) -these are the Old Testament saints who have been promised a city in the heavens. (Heb. 11: 16) In the new heavens and earth they will come down out of heaven with the city ruling over the earth.

The Blood - eternal redemption. (Heb. 9: 12)

 

Hi Ya,

I suppose our doctrines vary on a few points. I would also like to add @AdHoc to the conversation, he has been as quiet as a church mouse lately. Let’s talk about Hell as you mentioned, better translated hades.

Acts 2:27 (KJV) Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

We remember the conversation between Abraham (Abraham’s bosom), a place of comfort, and the rich man, a place of torment, separated by a great divide. This is not a parable, most agree a parable never uses real people.

Therefore, there were, or still are two sides of Hades. Many contend, as I do, the comfort side was cleaned out at Christ’s resurrection.

Matthew 27:52-53 (KJV) And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, ⁵³ And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 (KJV) Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

The apostle Paul mentioned a change in where as souls and spirit reside from the resurrection of Christ. Thus, in the Christian era, Abraham’s bosom is bypassed

2 Corinthians 5:6-8 (KJV) Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: ⁷ (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) ⁸ We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Now let us talk about Hades, not to be confused with the Lake of Fire. An analogy of Hades would be a jail, where the accused are confined and held awaiting their trial, hearing, conviction, and punishment. Note: Satan, the Antichrist, and False Prophet have already been condemned without a trial.

The Lake of Fire is the prison sentence, the second death penalty, for all of eternity. With that thought, how does God’s omnipresence factor in? I propose that in these areas, God’s omnipresence is vacated; after all, what is Hell? Hell, and the Lake of Fire by definition, are the absence of God, no communication or possibility of prayer, continual pain and torment, zero blessings, and no hope, redemption, or second chances.

However, I will not disagree with you, God’s omnipresence is everywhere, all the time. All the commentaries I read state that God’s omnipresence is even in Hell. Perhaps I should reconsider my hermeneutics.