Suicide

[stevehut]

Suicide is murder. And it's the only sin that you can't repent of.

Sure, I believe in grace. But that doesn't mean that God is obligated to save every person.

I'm not going to test God on that one.

Steve

[Openly Curious]

what does scripture say? scripture is silent regarding suicide, but is not silent at all regarding murder. is suicide really murder though, or is it an act of desparation to someone who has given up? certainly it is a sin... but, what does God say about sin? scripture says that the ONLY sin which will not be forgiven is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit... i.e. giving credit to satan for the work done by the Holy Spirit. so no, i don't believe that those who commit suicide will be barred from heaven's gate.

Hello LadyC,

Suicide is murder and a matter of fact it is 1st degree murder. Just because one chooses to kill self doesn't mean it wasn't thought out and premeditated within their hearts and mind. Unfortunately they themselves were the victims of their own crime. They are still a murderer. The word suicide is not in the bible but look the definition of suicide up.

Suicide is most defiantly an act of desperation among other things. Mostly it is someone who is seeking to get out of their pain usually it is a very very deep pain the person has and is living with.

And seeking to escape this pain they plot against themselves and conspire in their own minds to kill themselves. Thinking it will release them from the pain they are currently in. This is a sad situation indeed for a person to be in that much pain.

But nevertheless that is their motive which drives them to kill or murderer their ownselves. They are indeed a tragic victim of their own crime.

Yes scripture does say the only sin that won't be forgiven is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. But scriptures also says and teaches us in 1 John the things I wrote back in my post to Hannah.

God Bless

Openly Curious

[Tari]

The majority of people who commit suicide believe that they will find peace by doing so. Unfortunately, they find out too late that, what they have done is actually an abomination to God. We are created by the Lord, and to kill His creation, this includes suicide, is very wrong. God has a purpose for all of us, and sometimes through life we have to endure through a lot of suffering. Sometimes our faith and strength is tested through many trials in life. Anyone who ever is on the verge of suicide, needs to seriously reach out to the Lord for help. God does intervene in many people's lives every day.

Years ago a very close person to me committed suicide. The night of his funeral myself and his two roomates were sitting there. We all heard this (like a spiritual experience that people encounter sometimes). For a brief moment we could hear this loud screaming like someone was knocking and trying to get in. We just knew that he really wished he could have his life back. It was very traumatic on everyone he knew, and there was nothing at all peaceful about it. Suicide is a terrible decision for anyone to ever make.

[Openly Curious]

I just bothers me that people are not secure in their faith. Why would God send somebody to Hell, that has received Jesus as Lord and Savior?

Does it say anywhere in the Bible that we are "saved" as long as we don't do this sin or that sin? If that is true then what sins does God permit? Are there sins that God won't save us from? Which ones? Jesus died to save us from all sins even murder and suicide.

I do like what Will's Mom said though. (God won't give us more than we can handle.) Suicide is evil in God's eyes because it is sin. Jesus died on the cross to save us from our sins. Why would God send a person Born of God to Hell? It just doesn't make sense to me. All sin is sin.

Hello '50_Cent's_dog',

You said, "All sin is sin"

Where will unconfessed sins send you?

It say in 1 John aslo, that all wrongdoing is sin. If the bible tells us all wrongdoing is sin then where will my sins send me if they are unconfessed?

Yes, "All sin is sin" and murder is not the fruit of the Spirit either so where will unconfessed sin send one?

Murderers shall have no part in the holy city New Jerusalem so where will unconfessed sin send the transgressors of God's word. "All sin is sin"

Openly Curious

[50_Cent's_dog]

I just bothers me that people are not secure in their faith. Why would God send somebody to Hell, that has received Jesus as Lord and Savior?

Does it say anywhere in the Bible that we are "saved" as long as we don't do this sin or that sin? If that is true then what sins does God permit? Are there sins that God won't save us from? Which ones? Jesus died to save us from all sins even murder and suicide.

I do like what Will's Mom said though. (God won't give us more than we can handle.) Suicide is evil in God's eyes because it is sin. Jesus died on the cross to save us from our sins. Why would God send a person Born of God to Hell? It just doesn't make sense to me. All sin is sin.

Hello '50_Cent's_dog',

You said, "All sin is sin"

Where will unconfessed sins send you?

It say in 1 John aslo, that all wrongdoing is sin. If the bible tells us all wrongdoing is sin then where will my sins send me if they are unconfessed?

Yes, "All sin is sin" and murder is not the fruit of the Spirit either so where will unconfessed sin send one?

Murderers shall have no part in the holy city New Jerusalem so where will unconfessed sin send the transgressors of God's word. "All sin is sin"

Openly Curious

I understand your thoughts on "unconfessed" sin. Let me ask you a question. How many times have you forgot to confess a sin? I know that you probably will say that you confessed every sin that you ever committed. How can you be so positive that you confessed every sin?

Will God send me to hell even though He gave me the faith to receive Jesus as Lord and Saviour 10 years ago. I am righteous in God's eyes because He gave me the faith to believe in Jesus and what He did on the cross. Just as Abraham believed God and it was credited to him as rightiousness. Did Abraham sin? Yes, but God still considered Abraham righteous because he believed God and had faith.

[Guest LadyC]

curious, i don't believe there are many christians in the world without some unconfessed sin. if one has pride in oneself, that is a sin... and one many christians have. it doesn't keep them out of heaven though.

if one harbors any anger towards anyone in their life, they harbor sin. i'll use an example here. if a christian has a child that was sexually molested, it's quite likely that the christian will harbor resentment, maybe for the rest of their life, for the perpetrator. that's not going to keep them out of heaven either.

if a christian wife has a husband who habitually disrespects her by viewing pornography, and rather than committing it entirely to God she nags, cries, gives ultimatums, tracks her husband's viewing habits, puts blocking software on the computer, etc., then she is holding on to the anger and pain and denying God the trust He desires of her. that is generally an unconfessed sin that she may very well die in. but it won't keep her out of heaven.

yes, murder is an abomination (although not all killing is murder... just to clarify i believe that suicide IS murder of self.) but there is no scripture to support that one automatically gets kicked out of the kingdom of God for having died in their sin without confessing it. again i say, the only sin that God says will be unforgiven is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

it isn't up to us to figure out why God doesn't always make sense to our logical minds. scripture also says "for His ways are not our ways" and to not lean on our own understanding.

not to get off topic, this is just a theoretical point of curiousity to me... i wonder how many people here who believe that a christian committing suicide will send them straight to hell also believe "OSAS" , that a person can not be snatched out of God's hands. (please, remember i'm just voicing a thought here... if anyone wants to follow up on that thought we should start a new thread.)

[Openly Curious]

I just bothers me that people are not secure in their faith. Why would God send somebody to Hell, that has received Jesus as Lord and Savior?

Does it say anywhere in the Bible that we are "saved" as long as we don't do this sin or that sin? If that is true then what sins does God permit? Are there sins that God won't save us from? Which ones? Jesus died to save us from all sins even murder and suicide.

I do like what Will's Mom said though. (God won't give us more than we can handle.) Suicide is evil in God's eyes because it is sin. Jesus died on the cross to save us from our sins. Why would God send a person Born of God to Hell? It just doesn't make sense to me. All sin is sin.

Hello '50_Cent's_dog',

You said, "All sin is sin"

Where will unconfessed sins send you?

It say in 1 John aslo, that all wrongdoing is sin. If the bible tells us all wrongdoing is sin then where will my sins send me if they are unconfessed?

Yes, "All sin is sin" and murder is not the fruit of the Spirit either so where will unconfessed sin send one?

Murderers shall have no part in the holy city New Jerusalem so where will unconfessed sin send the transgressors of God's word. "All sin is sin"

Openly Curious

I understand your thoughts on "unconfessed" sin. Let me ask you a question. How many times have you forgot to confess a sin? I know that you probably will say that you confessed every sin that you ever committed. How can you be so positive that you confessed every sin?

Will God send me to hell even though He gave me the faith to receive Jesus as Lord and Saviour 10 years ago. I am righteous in God's eyes because He gave me the faith to believe in Jesus and what He did on the cross. Just as Abraham believed God and it was credited to him as rightiousness. Did Abraham sin? Yes, but God still considered Abraham righteous because he believed God and had faith.

50 cent dog,

To him that doeth righteousness is righteous him that doeth unrighteousness is unrighteous that is what it say in Romans

This meaning those who do right in God's sight are the righteous. Those who willfully choose to go against God and do the wrong is the unrighteous or wicked in this world and they do not possess the righteousness which is in Jesus Christ. As Abraham believed God and it was accounted unto as righteousness. You said the key word "Faith"

The person who commits suicide has given up that "faith" you speak of they have cast it aside and taken matters into their own hands and are choosing to do their own will and way over the will of God. They have taken their trust out of God choosing not to confide with him in fellowship about their problems and deep needs as a result cannot get more of the much needed grace in which they so desperately need within their lives. For God giveth more grace to the humble. As the word also tells us to Let us come boldly to the throne of grace that we may obtain mercy and grace in our time of need.

We are also to make our prayers and petitions known to him the word tells us because in our weaknesses Christ will be made strong if we just keep our faith and don't cast it aside. Also the word tell us that those who endure to the end shall be saved and we are to fight the good fight of faith. We have to earnestly contend for our faith lest we loose it and give up as the case of those who want to give up and commit suicide.

There is alot of marriages that bust up because they give up on it and don't go to God in the midst of their troubles and get forgiveness and more grace in their time of need. The grace of God is sufficient for every need we have no matter how big or small we think our problems are our own solutions only makes things worse when we fail and put our faith elsewhere.

Sometimes our trials in life feel like their choking us and we will never make it through them and sadly some don't survive their trials. But if we don't stay with Jesus we loose all the way around.

I do not claim to be a perfect Christian as you seemed to suggest that I am. I have faults and failures that come into my life and when the Lord makes them known to me they have to go if I want my relationship to continue with Him. I want the fellowship with my heavenly Father to continue as sin is how it is broken. So I will endeavor to walk a life of obedience in his sight and will shun the wrong and cling to the right. In other words I'm gonna put up a good scrap in the fight to keep my faith til the end. Because the trial of our faith will have great recompense of reward in the end.

I know also that if I walk in obedience to God and do his will then I will have confidence before Him to ask what I will when I get into his presence through prayer and I know he will hear me according to 1 John That is my confidence and that is what I trust in. And it is a shame that a person who once was a believer who once put their trust in Jesus didn't come to this knowledge or couldn't no longer trust in the truth of his word and chose rather to end their life.

As far as your question will God send you to hell even though he gave you faith to accept Jesus as your Lord and Saviour 10 years ago. Well, first I am not the judge of your eternal soul for I do not know of your walk with God. But I will warn you to keep your relationship right with you and the Lord all the days of your life don't let anything get between you and Him. Guard it with the utmost care for it is sin that breaks that fellowship with him and steals our confidence away from us to approach him to ask and receive the things we so desperately need pertaing to this life and godliness.

God had dealt to every man a measure of faith but not everyone acts upon that measure of faith given to them as there are still unbelievers who have not acted on that faith given them by God. Not every person will choose to walk out their faith or their profession of that faith they say they have.

God Bless

Openly Curious

[Openly Curious]

curious, i don't believe there are many christians in the world without some unconfessed sin. if one has pride in oneself, that is a sin... and one many christians have. it doesn't keep them out of heaven though.

if one harbors any anger towards anyone in their life, they harbor sin. i'll use an example here. if a christian has a child that was sexually molested, it's quite likely that the christian will harbor resentment, maybe for the rest of their life, for the perpetrator. that's not going to keep them out of heaven either.

if a christian wife has a husband who habitually disrespects her by viewing pornography, and rather than committing it entirely to God she nags, cries, gives ultimatums, tracks her husband's viewing habits, puts blocking software on the computer, etc., then she is holding on to the anger and pain and denying God the trust He desires of her. that is generally an unconfessed sin that she may very well die in. but it won't keep her out of heaven.

yes, murder is an abomination (although not all killing is murder... just to clarify i believe that suicide IS murder of self.) but there is no scripture to support that one automatically gets kicked out of the kingdom of God for having died in their sin without confessing it. again i say, the only sin that God says will be unforgiven is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

it isn't up to us to figure out why God doesn't always make sense to our logical minds. scripture also says "for His ways are not our ways" and to not lean on our own understanding.

not to get off topic, this is just a theoretical point of curiousity to me... i wonder how many people here who believe that a christian committing suicide will send them straight to hell also believe "OSAS" , that a person can not be snatched out of God's hands. (please, remember i'm just voicing a thought here... if anyone wants to follow up on that thought we should start a new thread.)

LadyC,

Please help me here what does "OSAS" stand for probably something simple I'm sure and probably figure it out by the time you tell me.

Openly Curious

[Openly Curious]

curious, i don't believe there are many christians in the world without some unconfessed sin. if one has pride in oneself, that is a sin... and one many christians have. it doesn't keep them out of heaven though.

if one harbors any anger towards anyone in their life, they harbor sin. i'll use an example here. if a christian has a child that was sexually molested, it's quite likely that the christian will harbor resentment, maybe for the rest of their life, for the perpetrator. that's not going to keep them out of heaven either.

if a christian wife has a husband who habitually disrespects her by viewing pornography, and rather than committing it entirely to God she nags, cries, gives ultimatums, tracks her husband's viewing habits, puts blocking software on the computer, etc., then she is holding on to the anger and pain and denying God the trust He desires of her. that is generally an unconfessed sin that she may very well die in. but it won't keep her out of heaven.

yes, murder is an abomination (although not all killing is murder... just to clarify i believe that suicide IS murder of self.) but there is no scripture to support that one automatically gets kicked out of the kingdom of God for having died in their sin without confessing it. again i say, the only sin that God says will be unforgiven is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

it isn't up to us to figure out why God doesn't always make sense to our logical minds. scripture also says "for His ways are not our ways" and to not lean on our own understanding.

not to get off topic, this is just a theoretical point of curiousity to me... i wonder how many people here who believe that a christian committing suicide will send them straight to hell also believe "OSAS" , that a person can not be snatched out of God's hands. (please, remember i'm just voicing a thought here... if anyone wants to follow up on that thought we should start a new thread.)

LadyC,

It is unconfessed sin that seperates us from God and when we have and keep unconfessed sin harbored within our hearts and will not confess it before God. Then you as a believer will loose your confidence in God. Just as it says within the gospel of 1 John.

If one looses their confidence with God they in their own condemnation of their hearts before him will not approach him so they can receive the things they are so badly in need of which is more mercy and grace so they can be an overcomer in the trials of this life that are so different and diverse for us all.

I thank you for all the example of how one harbors sin in their lives but I don't need examples for I am a human being in this life with my on trials and heartaches myself just as even you know these same things or you couldn't have given me the examples you did.

I've even been the victim of terrible tragedy and pain in my own life and know of the hatred, bitterness, resentment and fear all the emotions you used in your post. But it had to go if I wanted to continue my relationship with the Lord. Jesus had forgiven me of my sins so I had to forgive others of their sins towards me. And if I refused to do so then the walk with the Lord that I had would have stopped right there as my sin would have kept me seperated from Him. As the word says if I don't forgive others their tresspasses then my tresspasses want be forgiven. My confidence with God would have been gone if I had not forgiven as the sin of unforgiveness harbored within my heart kept me bound in condemnation until I confessed it and forgave it was then the fellowship with God and the confidence was fresh and anew as I obeyed from my heart his word.

Sin breaks our fellowship with God no fellowship no relationship

God Bless

Openly Curious

Edited March 19, 2006 by Openly Curious

[Guest LadyC]

but curious, my point is, do you feel that, as a christian, you would have gone to hell had you died before you were to let go of that bitterness? i don't believe you would have... because even though for a period of time it was unconfessed, and unrelinquished, you had not committed blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. (and OSAS is short for "once saved always saved".