What comes First

[eric]

I never had a motive one way or the other. All I know that Jesus came to me out of nowhere and pulled me out of the muck and mire that I was in and I'm glad He did because that's when I first heard of eternal life and eternal damnation.

If you are witnessing to some one and you tell them they will go to hell unless they accept Jesus, then you are a bad witness. Jesus did not come to keep you out of hell, He came to reconcile you back to the father.

And yeah Mike, he will save your butt if you do the will of the Father as mentioned in Matt.7:21

[vitality22004]

It is God's love that draws us but His grace and whatever means He uses to get us to the point where we can respond to that love depends on how responsive we are to the convicting power of the Holy Spirit. Some people choose Him because they are afraid to go to hell but once they get to know Him, His unconditional love is what keeps them in Him.

[Candi770]

A motive would be wrong to seek the Lord only to save ones hide.

Christianity- is about a relationship with God. Fellowshiping with him.

Religion is a set of rules that people follow to make themselves righteous.

Jesus died on the cross and thats how his followers are made righteous-nothing we

can do to gain that righteousness.

No you can not live your life IN CHRIST if you are not saved.

If you go fishing- does the fish come out of the water already clean- ready for the frying pan- NO. When we are saved- born again-we are made righteous in the eyes of God, and he

leads us on the road to being "Christ Like" (christianity).

Its a nice benefit of my Father God to know that I gain a wonderful inheritance of eternal life

with him. Personally speaking- that knowledge forshadows any thought of the flames of hell-

I know where I'm bound.

[tah]

I do not agree with ya there..

He came to save my hide...

[Smalcald]

I think there are numerous intellectual reasons we may tell ourselves about why we believe. But I am reticent to make any judgements concerning any of them in that belief is not something that we ourselves created, we cannot will ourselves to believe in Christ, faith is a work of the Holy Spirit, not our will. Thus we know that the Holy Spirit works as it sees fit, blowing as the wind, we cannot control it and thus I don

[mike2]

It was a long time for me before I understood the significance of Christs death and the reason why it had to be Him.

I accepted Jesus as my saviour because of what He taught me, from what I read in the bible, years before I understood His death. I knew He did something very important for me, I knew I was safe with God in my life, but I didnt understand how or why.

People would tell me it was through His death that my sin was washed away (huhhh?).

I didnt know how that worked, but I accepted it, and believed, that in His time ,God would give me the understanding, which He did.

Are we too focused on telling people they are sinners and need to be saved (kind of hard to win them over when you "insult" them)?

Are we spending enough time talking about how acknowledging and following Jesus teachings can change our lives for the better?

Why do we think it has to be right now that people change?, what is the urgency? Think about it... if God has put me in their life to tell them about Him..... He's going to give me all the time I need.

It kind of makes me think about breaking a horse, you can "bust it" like the wild west cowboys did , or you can be gentle and take your time to bring them along like Robert Redford did in The Horse Whisperer.

What about someone that is living with sin and basically knows that Jesus was born on Christmas, Noah built a boat and Moses parted the sea. How would you handle that?

Would you bust em', or would you be a horse whisperer?

Do you think that we can be impatient, focus too much on salvation and, not take the time to relate how a relationship with God can effect the here and now of a persons life?

[mike2]

What comes First, Salvation or a Christian Life

Salvation...you cannot have a christian life without it...its a contridiction in terms.

Is your salvation the only reason to become a Christian.

As a non believer would you think it is kind of shallow to believe in God just to save your butt.

I saw in a thread just the other day someone that would not accept God for that excuse, because, obviously, all they know of God is if you dont believe in Him you go to hell.

With that in mind, believing in God for that reason, is, rightly, hypocritical.

Why should we accept God other than for our salvation and should we be using those examples and reasons when we witness?

No

put that way...yes

if you believe in him your saved, (thats what my Bible tells me).

only hypocritical if you say you believe in him and dont walk the walk.

you only used two reasons..lets look at the second one you wrote...salvation...your being saved from what? eternal damnation...so the second one differs from the first...how?

Personally I chose Christ not for an excape route...or salvation...I chose him because he loved me enough before I was even thought of to die for something I had not yet done.

The other (second?) reason would be to have a relationship with God, and how that relationship is lifechanging.

[Openly Curious]

I came to the lord out of my deep need for him as I needed his help in my life and called out to him and said "Lord change me" and he did sure i feared hell and i knew he died on the cross for me but it was my deep need for him that I came to accept him as lord and saviour in my life.

So I think it is for different reasons why people come to know the lord as each ones needs are different in life. The important thing is that we all do "come" to him in this lifetime of ours.

Openly Curious

[Smalcald]

I never came to Christ, I don't think we have that ability.

[st. Worm]

Smalcald says:

"I never came to Christ, I don't think we have that ability."

SW says:

Truer words were never spoken here. The gospel and our response to it is never from reason or anything else internal. Dead men don't respond very well. Unless they are first made alive by the power of forgiveness through the Holy Spirit they remain nicely dead. Sinners can no more come to Christ on their own than the dead raccoon I saw in the road this morning can get up and walk away.