Dangerous Heresy

[ayin jade]

2 Cor 12

7 and by the surpassing revelations, lest I be made haughty, a thorn in the flesh was given to me, a messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I be made haughty.

8 For this thing I besought the Lord three times, that it might depart from me.

9 And He said to me, My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore I will rather glory in my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may overshadow me.

[truthbringer]

WHAT IS FAITH?

If one wants to please God one must have faith: "But without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God MUST BELIEVE that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him" (Heb. 11:6).

This is one sure way to please God. If God can be made happy and well pleased in such a simple way, why should not everyone one who loves Him put forth the utmost effort to have faith in Him? Not one of us would be pleased if our friends would constantly make us a liar every time we opened our mouths to say something. Not one of us would feel like doing anything for those who did this. The same is true with God. We should not insult God by questioning and doubting every promise He makes. How can we expect to get answers to prayers as long as we continue in such an attitude?

Faith is simple. It is believing God without waver, without doubting, and without questioning what He says. It is taking God at His Word and believing that what He has promised He is able to perform it. It is believing not only that He is able, but that He will do it. It is the quality of counting those things that be not as though they were (Rom. 4:17). Faith is also the absolute conviction that what God has promised and what we have asked for according to His Word is already done. It is the substance of things hoped for and the first payment on things that we desire from God (Heb. 11:1-3).

How do we get faith.

The way to get faith is by Hearing the Word of God (Rom. 10:17).

The way to use faith is to take God at His Word and count Him faithful in granting what is asked in the name of Jesus. Ask and then believe that it is done. Thank God for it as if it were already done. Expect the complete answer whether you see it at once or not.

Forget symptoms, feelings, impossibilities,or anything to the contrary and it shall be done regardless of how impossible it may appear outwardly. Faith leaves all results and all answers with God as being God's part, and faith believes that it is done. Our part then is to co-operate with God through faith and not hinder its working by doubting and questioning the how and when of the answer.

If a Christian will truly exercise faith that he knows is necessary, there will be no question as to the answer. One can get healing, health, success in business or in any undertaking, prosperity, happiness or anything that one to be victorious in any phase of life (Matt. 17:20; 21:22; Mark 11:22-24; John 15:7, 16; Rom. 8:32; Heb. 11:6; James 1:5-8).

Faith is not only a natural ability or exercise of a created faculty of man, but it is a fruit of the Spirit and a gift from God (Gal. 5:22-23; 1 Cor. 12:4-11).

Dangerous Heresy?

"But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:" (Acts 24:14).

Haz.

[1] What is heresy about that.

[2] Faith isn't a fruit of the Spirit- The fruit of the spirit is,"Faithfulness".

[truthbringer]

God also promises us suffering on this earth if we are to be Christians if we are to really live His life, the narrow path. How does that fit?

In fact scripture says that those who desire to be rich fall into a snare. Listen to the Word, it says to those who even DESIRE to be rich, the longing for all of those things which seem to be what some of these preachers are telling us to pray for, is wrong. We should not pray for wealth. Certainly we should pray to feed and cloth our family,

[Smalcald]

God also promises us suffering on this earth if we are to be Christians if we are to really live His life, the narrow path. How does that fit?

In fact scripture says that those who desire to be rich fall into a snare. Listen to the Word, it says to those who even DESIRE to be rich, the longing for all of those things which seem to be what some of these preachers are telling us to pray for, is wrong. We should not pray for wealth. Certainly we should pray to feed and cloth our family,

[truthbringer]

When didn't God grant what Pauls asked for?

2 Cor 12:7 To keep me from becoming conceited because of these surpassingly great revelations, there was given me a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. 8 Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. 9 But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me. 10 That is why, for Christ's sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

I though that you would use that one, What we need to understand about the Bible, is.

Who is doing the talking, Is it [A] God, a Bible charater, or [C] the translator.

For instance, God never said, "The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away", That was Job, [A Bible charactor].

Another instance, The Bible translator said, "We are made a little lower then angels".

The original Hebrew says, "We are made a little lower then God". The Hebrew word is, Elohim [God].

Now here in 2 Cor 12: 7--9, Looking at it quickly people read it the way that you did, But Look at it, and study it, and you will see- On face value alone that Paul never said God didn't deliver him, Even if he wasn't delivered, it doesn't take away the truth from the Bible. This same Paul said[inspired by God] We are more than conquerors, always triumphant, and victorious.

Now lets look at this, V 9, Paul said the power of Christ was upon him, Well if the power is on you, that means you'll get delivered, If you have the faith.

Now Jesus said to Paul in the original text,

"My supernatual power will accomplish what you have requested".

Grace means more then, unmerited favour, It means, "GOD'S WILLINGNESS TO SHOW HIMSELF STRONG ON OUR BEHALF".

MEANING THAT GOD WILL ALWAYS DELIVER THOSE WHO HAVE FAITH IN HIM.

SO WE SEE THAT JESUS DID WANT TO DELIVER PAUL.

[truthbringer]

2 Cor 12

7 and by the surpassing revelations, lest I be made haughty, a thorn in the flesh was given to me, a messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I be made haughty.

8 For this thing I besought the Lord three times, that it might depart from me.

9 And He said to me, My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore I will rather glory in my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may overshadow me.

For the truth about these vs, read my reply to runningator.

[OneLight]

Let's be careful not to attack each other. We are to discuss/debate the subject at hand without attacking the poster.

TOS

Abuse of other posters is not allowed. This includes, but is not limited to, name calling, insulting, harassing, threatening or in any way invading the privacy of another poster. We also strongly discourage giving out personal information such as email addresses, physical addresses and phone numbers on the public boards. Any information given out in private is at your own discretion and risk. (Eph. 4: 29)

Debate the subject, not the person. It is possible to disagree about a doctrine or subject under discussion without insulting the person with whom you are debating. Also remember that the fact that a person disagrees with you does not mean they are attacking you as a person. Respect each other in the love of God! This is the main reason that threads get stopped, shut down, and even deleted! Users that cannot respect others will be banned. (Lev. 19:18)

[truthbringer]

The Greek word for "Confession" is, [Agreeing with God and saying the same as God].

You seem to disagree with the Bible. Jesus said you can have what you say, Do you think He is wrong as well.

I dont think he meant it in the way that you do.

Also The Bible says God cannot do anything without people having faith in Him, Jesus couldn't do any mighty works in His own town because of unbelief.

who had faith in God when he created the universe? Who had faith that Jesus was going to rise again the 3rd day?

This is the most outrageous thing I have heard in a long time. To think that God is bound by our faith and our will is folly at best, but really much worse.

To say God isn't subject to your will, is disagreeing with the Bible, These WOF people give the Bible, People like You give

your own opinion.

SHOW ME IN THE BIBLE WHERE IS SAYS THAT GOD IS BOUND TO MY WILL!

how can anyone have the guts and arrogance to think they can command the God of the universe, the creator and controller of all, and he has to do as we command.

WOW, are some people in for a rude awaking.

When I said "Confession means, Agreeing with God and saying the same as God".

And "Jesus said, We can have what we say". You said, "I dont think He meant it in the way I do.

your trouble is, You have your own opinion on the Bible. I have to stick with the facts as I will have to give an account to God for what I say, So I always make sure, before I say anything.

[Xan]

It is you who said "God is at our beg and call" You have misquoted people,

If you read how many times in the New Testament Jesus say "ACCORDING TO YOUR FAITH". I supose you think He is arrogant as well. I supose you think He is in heresy as well.

no, this is what was said...And He will answer ANYTHING I ask believing. pretty much the same thing as being at your beck and call. Do you really think you can command God to do things?

you also said this...

If you don't permit God to enter into anything on your behalf, He won't

who permited Jesus to die on the cross for you? who permited him to enter into the sacrafice that he made for us all?

and you said this...

Also The Bible says God cannot do anything without people having faith in Him

who had faith in God as he was creating the universe?

You dont know a lot about the Bible do you, You dont know much about tongues, either.

What knid of Church do you go to, They dont seem to teach you much.

Prior to this, I have pointed out very diplomatically that you are being insultive when people disagree with your POV, and have pointed out a better way to handle it; a way in which Christians should want to express their beliefs. However, you have not only ignored it, but you have insisted on continuing to insult others. I have reported the quoted post.

[OneLight]

We must be very careful how we interpret the verses below. Those who are asking Jesus, and who Jesus is answering, are the disciples He choose, who are following God with all their heart. What they ask for is only that which is in accordance to His will in their lives, nothing more. They are not ones who would ask for a new house expecting to get one, but for His pure guidance in their lives so they can follow Him as best as they can, doing only His will on earth.

Matthew 21:20-22

And when the disciples saw it, they marveled, saying,