Is all disobedience an act of will?

[Floatingaxe]

1 John 5:16-17...

16If anyone sees his brother commit a sin that does not lead to death, he should pray and God will give him life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that he should pray about that. 17All wrongdoing is sin, and there is sin that does not lead to death.

This scripture is meant to encourage and instruct us in INTERCESSORY PRAYER. We are called to pray for a sinning brother in Christ. John suggests that we refrain from interceding on behalf of someone who is committing that sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit--that sin that leads to death. Such a person would be unregenerate, reprobate and far from God.

This classifying of sin as Mortal and Venial is really not necessary. All sin is mortal to God---it brings about death, death of the spirit, and one's right standing before a holy God.

[Pax]

1 John 5:16-17...

16If anyone sees his brother commit a sin that does not lead to death, he should pray and God will give him life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that he should pray about that. 17All wrongdoing is sin, and there is sin that does not lead to death.

This scripture is meant to encourage and instruct us in INTERCESSORY PRAYER. We are called to pray for a sinning brother in Christ. John suggests that we refrain from interceding on behalf of someone who is committing that sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit--that sin that leads to death. Such a person would be unregenerate, reprobate and far from God.

This classifying of sin as Mortal and Venial is really not necessary. All sin is mortal to God---it brings about death, death of the spirit, and one's right standing before a holy God.

Your right 1 John 5: 16-17 does talk about intercessory prayer, but it also makes it clear that there is a deadly and non deadly sin. There is no getting around this one Floatingaxe. Classifying sin might not be necessary to you, but it was to John a disciple of Jesus Christ. I also don't recall ever seeming the word blasphemy used in those two verses. Mortal sin is not only blasphemy.

[Floatingaxe]

That is precisely the sin John was speaking of--the unforgivable sin.

[antz]

So you have never wilfully sinned since you received the "truth"? You are sinless?

That is correct Jade, after you received the TRUTH, as a Christian you SHOULD not willfully sin.

But that does not mean you are sinless. Christian still sins but not willfully that is why John said, if you see your brother sin (not the deadly sin) pray for him. This is the reason why I disagree that ALL disobedience is an act of will. It will fall on deadly sin if you willfully disobey God after you received the truth.

[Pax]

That is precisely the sin John was speaking of--the unforgivable sin.

Axe,

Are you trying to say that if a teenager commits blasphemy but later on in life repents and ask God for forgiveness, he will not forgive that person. If that's the case many people are going to hell. God is a merciful God and no sin is to big for him to forgive. There is a way to come back into the grace of God after committing a deadly sin, there has to be or else 99.9 percent of the world would be going straight to hell. God knew this . This is why the Christ established the Sacrament of Reconciliation to deal will deadly sin and bring us back into communion with Christ.

[antz]

That is precisely the sin John was speaking of--the unforgivable sin.

so now you agree that not all disobedience is an act of will???

[ayin jade]

So you have never wilfully sinned since you received the "truth"? You are sinless?

That is correct Jade, after you received the TRUTH, as a Christian you SHOULD not willfully sin.

But that does not mean you are sinless. Christian still sins but not willfully ....... It will fall on deadly sin if you willfully disobey God after you received the truth.

And yet you wilfully sinned in here yesterday by taunting, and you had admited to that. You admited to doing it willfully. By your own admission, you wilfully sinned. Since you did that, there is no more hope for you, according to your beliefs, according to your interpretation of this verse. Hebrews 10:26For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins, 27but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and a fierceness of fire which shall devour the adversaries. According to your beliefs, you have lost salvation with no hope of getting it back.

[antz]

So you have never wilfully sinned since you received the "truth"? You are sinless?

That is correct Jade, after you received the TRUTH, as a Christian you SHOULD not willfully sin.

But that does not mean you are sinless. Christian still sins but not willfully ....... It will fall on deadly sin if you willfully disobey God after you received the truth.

And yet you wilfully sinned in here yesterday by taunting, and you had admited to that. You admited to doing it willfully. By your own admission, you wilfully sinned. Since you did that, there is no more hope for you, according to your beliefs, according to your interpretation of this verse. Hebrews 10:26For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins, 27but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and a fierceness of fire which shall devour the adversaries. According to your beliefs, you have lost salvation with no hope of getting it back.

didn't you read my post??? i was dragged because somebody puke at my post.

i didn't mean to taunt around coz that is not my purpose here... realizing that and not doing it again means you did not willfully did it. but if you realize your sin and still willfully do it again and again without any other influencing factor but your own will, then the verse that you are using will be applied...

Tit 3:10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

That is why OSAS is a very dangerous belief for me... it gives false hope that one can commit sins again and again hoping that Christ and The Father is merciful to a willfull sinner. But as the Bible said, that is not the case.

GOD will forgive any transgression a man had committed while he was outside the TRUTH but once he accepted Jesus, has been cleansed, has been purified (as a Gift to those who will accept Jesus, not by works Eph 2:8...)... then you have to keep his commandments until Jesus comes back... read...

1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Edited August 20, 2006 by antz

[Guest shiloh357]

didn't you read my post??? i was dragged because somebody puke at my post.

Doesnt matter, you still sinned willfully. You cannot blame it on someone else. Even when someone does something we don't like, and it offends us, we still have to take responsibility for it. No one else is accountable for our sins.

You sinned willfully, and you better get resaved, or you are going to hell according to your twisted "theology."

[ayin jade]

didn't you read my post??? i was dragged because somebody puke at my post.

i didn't mean to taunt around coz that is not my purpose here... realizing that and not doing it again means you did not willfully did it. but if you realize your sin and still willfully do it again and again .....

God doesnt accept excuses. Look at Adam and Eve to see that. They tried to put the blame of their sin on someone else too.

Genesis 3

11 And He said, Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten of the tree which I commanded you that you should not eat?

12 And the man said, The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate.

13 And the LORD God said to the woman, What is this you have done? And the woman said, The serpent deceived me, and I ate.

And yet God punished them for their sin. You willfully taunted yesterday. Despite repeatedly having that pointed out to you, you continued to taunt. You willfully and maliciously sinned. You are now unsaved per your twisted theology.