How Much Authority Does A Pastor Really Have?

[Guest lovinghim4ever]

There are alot of factors that aren't revealed here. For instance, is the church that Two is feeling led to start a long distance from One's church? (btw, I really hate referring to a body of believers as any one man's church, it is not his possession, but for the purpose of following this story that's how I'm referring to it). What are Two's reasons for not wanting his church to be associated with One's church (i.e not wanting to have the same name or be linked)? Also, are there elders or deacons involved?

Two's church is not very far from One's church, and it's not that Two doesn't want to be linked or associated with One's church. Two did ask for blessing, but One would not give it. It's just that One's church is geered more to helping the Christian or the already churched people grow in their walk with God. There's great reward in that, however Two feels lead to raise up a church that is geered more to reaching the lost and unchurched.

P.S. There are no elders or deacons involved in Two's decision. He welcomes anyone who wants to join his church, but he does not go out recruiting members of other churches.

Edited October 24, 2006 by lovinghim4ever

[Matthitjah]

Grace to you,

Allow me to throw a Monkey wrench into this for a minute.

There is Samuel promised to God sitting under the Authority of Eli and his two corrupt sons. Eli wasn't especially following God either. He allowed his sons to dishonor the Lord in His own House.

Yet Hannah submitted her son Samuel to Eli. Meanwhile Samuel after hearing from God of what would befall Eli still called him Father.

Then there is King David. Anointed King over Saul yet not laying a hand on the man trying and driving like a madman to kill him. David even called him Father and was about to kill old Nabal for saying he was a broken away from his master. In essence a vanguard and a rebel a foul word for the son of a Dog.

David was so enraged at the price he had paid to be a son to Saul, all the while honoring God. The honor and careful respect he had given the King that he promised that there would be none left that "pisseth against the wall" by morning.

If it were not for the Loving Kindness and the Mercy of the Lord that David understood. He would have committed a grievous sin. Rather He submitted the problem to God and turned from his own wrath.

Allowing God to take control of the matter. Nabal was soon dispatched.

How many times in our lives do we just want to go at the revelation of Gods will in our lives? Yet there are times when we should merely sit back and allow God to work it out.

Depsite the Nabal's, Sauls, and Eli's. Sometimes God is doing a great work in our hearts by allowing the Nabal's, Saul's, and Eli's in our lives.

Trust me, if Nabal, Saul, or Eli are outside the Word of God. They will reap what they have sown.

We just might miss some of the maturity we need by not allowing Gods Grace to work out in our hearts and lives.

Sometimes the wait makes us all the more prepared physically and Spiritually for the great Blessing God is bringing forth.

Sometimes the clay must yield so that the pot doesn't crack in the kiln.

Just my two cents.

Peace,

Dave

[Marnie]

Technically I would say the Pastor has only the authority we give him. If we follow Biblical precepts and he is following Biblical precepts, then we would submit to his teaching as he himself submits to the Word and the Lord. Sadly, too many pastors are not submitting themselves the G-d; they have their own agendas or whatever, so how can they expect the flock to follow them?

[EricH]

I am currently serving in a "2" position, so let me add my "2" cents. I can't speak to the motivation of either man in your story. All I can share with you are convictions that God has laid on my heart as a "2". I have committed before God that I will never leave this church to start a new work in the same area of ministry as the church in which I am currently serving. If God ever calls me to be a "1", it would either have to occur in a purposeful plant by the church in which I am serving, or as a lead pastor in a new area.

[Candi770]

I am currently serving in a "2" position, so let me add my "2" cents. I can't speak to the motivation of either man in your story. All I can share with you are convictions that God has laid on my heart as a "2". I have committed before God that I will never leave this church to start a new work in the same area of ministry as the church in which I am currently serving. If God ever calls me to be a "1", it would either have to occur in a purposeful plant by the church in which I am serving, or as a lead pastor in a new area.

Yeah, I guess their should have been a clear understanding like the above.

[Floatingaxe]

Grace to you,

Allow me to throw a Monkey wrench into this for a minute.

There is Samuel promised to God sitting under the Authority of Eli and his two corrupt sons. Eli wasn't especially following God either. He allowed his sons to dishonor the Lord in His own House.

Yet Hannah submitted her son Samuel to Eli. Meanwhile Samuel after hearing from God of what would befall Eli still called him Father.

Then there is King David. Anointed King over Saul yet not laying a hand on the man trying and driving like a madman to kill him. David even called him Father and was about to kill old Nabal for saying he was a broken away from his master. In essence a vanguard and a rebel a foul word for the son of a Dog.

David was so enraged at the price he had paid to be a son to Saul, all the while honoring God. The honor and careful respect he had given the King that he promised that there would be none left that "pisseth against the wall" by morning.

If it were not for the Loving Kindness and the Mercy of the Lord that David understood. He would have committed a grievous sin. Rather He submitted the problem to God and turned from his own wrath.

Allowing God to take control of the matter. Nabal was soon dispatched.

How many times in our lives do we just want to go at the revelation of Gods will in our lives? Yet there are times when we should merely sit back and allow God to work it out.

Depsite the Nabal's, Sauls, and Eli's. Sometimes God is doing a great work in our hearts by allowing the Nabal's, Saul's, and Eli's in our lives.

Trust me, if Nabal, Saul, or Eli are outside the Word of God. They will reap what they have sown.

We just might miss some of the maturity we need by not allowing Gods Grace to work out in our hearts and lives.

Sometimes the wait makes us all the more prepared physically and Spiritually for the great Blessing God is bringing forth.

Sometimes the clay must yield so that the pot doesn't crack in the kiln.

Just my two cents.

Peace,

Dave

Truly anointed, Dave!

[terter]

People pray about which church to attend but usually don't pray whether they should leave or not IMO. At that point, we've gotten our eyes on people and ourselves - upholding what we think instead of focusing on God.

We need to know the Lord's will in each case -

"Psa 37:23 The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD: and he delighteth in his way."

Deut 5:32

[Kabowd]

There are alot of factors that aren't revealed here. For instance, is the church that Two is feeling led to start a long distance from One's church? (btw, I really hate referring to a body of believers as any one man's church, it is not his possession, but for the purpose of following this story that's how I'm referring to it). What are Two's reasons for not wanting his church to be associated with One's church (i.e not wanting to have the same name or be linked)? Also, are there elders or deacons involved?

Two's church is not very far from One's church, and it's not that Two doesn't want to be linked or associated with One's church. Two did ask for blessing, but One would not give it. It's just that One's church is geered more to helping the Christian or the already churched people grow in their walk with God. There's great reward in that, however Two feels lead to raise up a church that is geered more to reaching the lost and unchurched.

P.S. There are no elders or deacons involved in Two's decision. He welcomes anyone who wants to join his church, but he does not go out recruiting members of other churches.

Okay, this doesn't make much sense then. Now I'm starting to see more where One was coming from. Why is Two wanting to start a brand new church nearby and yet not be associated with One's church? I know you say "it's not that he doesn't want to be linked", but he really doesn't if he's starting brand new work and doesn't want the same name or anything. Why would Two want to do this?

[Guest lovinghim4ever]

There are alot of factors that aren't revealed here. For instance, is the church that Two is feeling led to start a long distance from One's church? (btw, I really hate referring to a body of believers as any one man's church, it is not his possession, but for the purpose of following this story that's how I'm referring to it). What are Two's reasons for not wanting his church to be associated with One's church (i.e not wanting to have the same name or be linked)? Also, are there elders or deacons involved?

Two's church is not very far from One's church, and it's not that Two doesn't want to be linked or associated with One's church. Two did ask for blessing, but One would not give it. It's just that One's church is geered more to helping the Christian or the already churched people grow in their walk with God. There's great reward in that, however Two feels lead to raise up a church that is geered more to reaching the lost and unchurched.

P.S. There are no elders or deacons involved in Two's decision. He welcomes anyone who wants to join his church, but he does not go out recruiting members of other churches.

Okay, this doesn't make much sense then. Now I'm starting to see more where One was coming from. Why is Two wanting to start a brand new church nearby and yet not be associated with One's church? I know you say "it's not that he doesn't want to be linked", but he really doesn't if he's starting brand new work and doesn't want the same name or anything. Why would Two want to do this?

The only answer I have for this is that Two feels God is leading him to be Senior Pastor of his own church. Is that wrong?