One Punk Under God

[Emily~Anne]

Well, I've read some or the replies. Interesting points. This is what I have to say

It's obvious some of us "christians" are picky as to who we would consider "worthy" to be "christianly " to. I think Yeshua put it this way in Matthew 23:13-33

13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. 14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. 15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves. 16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor! 17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold? 18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. F44 19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift? 20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon. 21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein. 22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon. 23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise F45 and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. 24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel. 25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess. 26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also. 27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. 28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity. 29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, 30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. 31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. 32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. 33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

Do you see any difference to those offended by this outreach? I don't.

The so-called subcultured need love too.

It is actually possible to walk the narrow path and love the subcultured too, in fact, loving the subcultured IS part of walking the narrow path.

[botticelli]

i only get mad if the "outreach" is a feel-good church

[Guest faithproject]

I'm with Crystal on this one the Ecclesia is made up of saints, period.

Agreed.

[Emily~Anne]

Not sure how many of you read the link I gave to my testimony, so I am pasting in a aparagraph from that link:

we do not have to dress punk to reach out to punks, and frankly, I wouldn't have shared my pain with her if she dressed as a punk too. Something about her "stuck out" to me because she was different! That is exactly WHY I veered towards her!! I needed and desired something "different" yet I did not have a clue what that different thing was until I met a fellow sister in Christ!! I knew, after a short time, that she had something I wanted!! It is not necessary to conform to the world to make an impact. In fact it seems we would actually make less of an impact by conforming to the world, as our testimony would not be as strong.

Here is the link to the rest of the post: http://www.worthyboards.com/index.php?show...mp;#entry675031

Edited December 11, 2006 by Emily Anne

[Constant]

I did a bit of reading about the church he leads (Revolution, I think it's called), and the people his church reaches out to are people who would otherwise feel either out of place or would not be accepted by other churches: People like metalheads, punks, goths, drug addicts etc.

I'm glad to see that somebody is reaching out to these people, as they are a population that seem to be ignored by the church at large.

I agree with you about this. Alot of people who are tattooed or pierced are looked at differently at churches which is a shame. Seems like this man is reaching out to them. Good job on his part and I hope that this Church of his goes far. No one should be judging him or his Church. A bunch of haters!

[LightofJesus]

I have to say that I am offended at the first moment I see a person who is dressed as a goth or are all tattooed up and peirced, but then in my heart these people need to be reached in whatever the Lord leads a person to do it, I am obviously not the one chosen for the job. I do though need to stop and realize that God loves all of us regardless of how we dress or peirce ourselves. It is the heart He wants to reach and if it need to be with someone who is among their own God seems to know the heart that is involved!!

I read the above post where one of you were wanting to enter a different lifstyle and was drawn to a christian, well that is wonderful God used this person for you, God is using Baker for His purposes for others that live that lifstyle. We are not to jugde God are we? I think God knows what He is doing!!!

[Scum_of_the_Earth]

The link wouldn't work for me, but I can say that "Son of a Preacher Man" by Jay Bakker was one of the best books I've ever read on the subject of grace and forgiveness. I suggest everyone here read it a few times.

Being a part of my church, a church like Bakker's Revo in Atlanta has changed my life. I've only been here for about 6 months, but it has made the most profound difference on my faith and walk with Christ than any other cookie-cutter congregation has.

So often ministries like Bakker's and the church I go to, get a bad rap from people that have no idea what we're about, that haven't stepped foot inside the doors to get to know who we are. I'd love to go volunteer with Jay for awhile and hope to someday take on a bigger role with my church, hopefully staff if God wills it.

There's nothing wrong with getting down in the gutter with people and loving them the way Christ would. The people in the gutter wouldn't dare darken the step of the majority of churches in this country. They'd be turned away because of their smell or look or whatever else reason one would give. But Christ calls us to embrace them and love them and if they won't come to us, we should go to them. It's not about compromising the gospel, it's about LIVING the gospel in a way that makes a difference.

[Floatingaxe]

The link wouldn't work for me, but I can say that "Son of a Preacher Man" by Jay Bakker was one of the best books I've ever read on the subject of grace and forgiveness. I suggest everyone here read it a few times.

Being a part of my church, a church like Bakker's Revo in Atlanta has changed my life. I've only been here for about 6 months, but it has made the most profound difference on my faith and walk with Christ than any other cookie-cutter congregation has.

So often ministries like Bakker's and the church I go to, get a bad rap from people that have no idea what we're about, that haven't stepped foot inside the doors to get to know who we are. I'd love to go volunteer with Jay for awhile and hope to someday take on a bigger role with my church, hopefully staff if God wills it.

There's nothing wrong with getting down in the gutter with people and loving them the way Christ would. The people in the gutter wouldn't dare darken the step of the majority of churches in this country. They'd be turned away because of their smell or look or whatever else reason one would give. But Christ calls us to embrace them and love them and if they won't come to us, we should go to them. It's not about compromising the gospel, it's about LIVING the gospel in a way that makes a difference.

Right on, Scum!

[WillingToDie]

The link wouldn't work for me, but I can say that "Son of a Preacher Man" by Jay Bakker was one of the best books I've ever read on the subject of grace and forgiveness. I suggest everyone here read it a few times.

Being a part of my church, a church like Bakker's Revo in Atlanta has changed my life. I've only been here for about 6 months, but it has made the most profound difference on my faith and walk with Christ than any other cookie-cutter congregation has.

So often ministries like Bakker's and the church I go to, get a bad rap from people that have no idea what we're about, that haven't stepped foot inside the doors to get to know who we are. I'd love to go volunteer with Jay for awhile and hope to someday take on a bigger role with my church, hopefully staff if God wills it.

There's nothing wrong with getting down in the gutter with people and loving them the way Christ would. The people in the gutter wouldn't dare darken the step of the majority of churches in this country. They'd be turned away because of their smell or look or whatever else reason one would give. But Christ calls us to embrace them and love them and if they won't come to us, we should go to them. It's not about compromising the gospel, it's about LIVING the gospel in a way that makes a difference.

Awesome to hear from someone who has personal experience with such a church

[Candi770]

Ok, let's remember that there is A humongous DIFFERENCE between a lost sheep and a dissilusioned struggling person dressing goth and a mature Christian and active member of the church dressing as goth or punk. Let's not lump the two together. Jesus came into the world as LIGHT, not darkness. So why wear all black and dress disrespectively? Now does the fact that church recognizes what is wrong with dressing goth or punk mean they turn people away from their doors for the way they are dressed?? Quite the contrary! Doesn't the bible tell us OVER and OVER to reach out to those who are lost and struggling? No church I have EVER been a memeber of has EVER turned away someone at their door for how they are dressed. It is not necessary for a pastor to be a punk in order to minister to punks. I suppose the pastor should take up a drug habit also so he can minister to drug addicts? I think we need a church flavored with TRUTH and LIGHT that is not watered down. Rather than walk the broad road with those who are lost, let's show them the narrow road that leads to life. It is hard enough to find in this day and age.

Matthew 7:13-14 Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow is the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

I believe that a church should be a beacon to all. The Gospel should be preached to all. The Gospel message is simple.

God's people shouldn't be consumed with looking on the outward appearance of a man when our Lord looks on the heart. The Holy Spirit will deal with each of us. If the Holy Spirit convicts them of their clothing-then they better listen to Him. I'm surely not the Holy Spirit and I have no need to look down my nose-I know where I came from-and whose Grace saved me.

I don't think a pastor has to be a punk to minister-as long as he preaches the gospel. But it is awesome when God has delivered someone from the bondage of sin and then God uses them to minister the Gospel. God has used me numerous times ministering to people out of things He brought me out of-of course with the gospel message. That's the way the Holy Spirit has used me. But as far as a pastor doing drugs that would be bad-obviously-LOL. But we just have to be willing to go, where the Holy Spirit leads us.

I don't wear punk clothes, but I have been in churches and because I didn't wear high quality clothes, I was treated different, it didn't bother me-because I was mature enough to understand where they were coming from-their problem. And, I know that the Lord is showing me things at times and I'm not as concerned for myself-but get concerned when others are treated that way. But can you imagine someone who doesn't know or has never been to a church- getting those glaring looks from self righteous. The devil will use our self righteous attitudes to turn unbelievers and new converts away.

I found out that the first private school my children attended turned away 2 people who didn't dress well- way below poverty level- they turned them away. Luckily, someone found out where they were at and minister to their needs-but hello-what was the church there for.

We should walk in the example that Christ gave us, being led of the Holy Spirit, reaching out to the Lost, broken and sick. If the Holy Spirit leads us to those who are lost-we don't make ourselves to be on the "broad" path- we are in the Will of God for our life. If we don't go to where he leads us then yeah, we are in sin-and broad is that path. I'll stay on the narrow-and lead those to the narrow.

candi770