Ouija Boards etc. fro Christians

[TheoMike]

What about money? Banks were created with the sole purpose of holding people and even nations in bondage. Jesus told us we cannot serve both money and God. He also told us to sell all of our positions and give it to the poor. Yet I would be willing to bet that everybody involved with this discussion uses money every day and has a bank account. If you are going to make a stink about garden gnomes then you must also consider things like the one dollar bill.

Is that why banks were created? You have a distinctly original view of history!

There is a world of difference between "serving" money and using it as "coin of the realm." It can't be all bad since the early Church used money, collected it, distributed it to the poor, and so on. For that matter, it must be important. The New Testament spends more time talking about money and stewardship than about prayer.

Jesus has never told me and I doubt you to sell your possessions. He has told ONE person to do that: the rich young ruler.

But this is off-topic and I don't want to be accused of hijacking a thread.

Vickilynn and I are, surprise!, in agreement on this issue. Not about plastic gnomes, but Ouija boards. While I view a Ouija board as something less than worth the time of day, I put it in same category as horoscopes, palm reading, fortune telling, etc. I don't think any of these things have any merit at all and have NO influence over the believer unless they, with the power of their own minds, give them influence. But, the Bible specifically prohibits dabbling in the occult in any of its forms, so believers should best stay away from them, and the Ouija board in particular, since that is the subject of this thread.

[Gerioke]

I may not be the crispiest chip in the bag, but from my understanding, the first loan set the wheels of oppression in motion in the USA.

Bank gives loan, charges interest. There is only so much money circulating, so interest accrued cannot ever be paid in full because the money hasn't been printed.

Why is the government billions of dollars in debt? Because loans have been made with interest and the debt keeps getting bigger as the interest snowballs. Humanity is indebted to the banks until the Lord's return.

Is my thinking off?

[dugmando]

Hi Vickilynn,

I would like to add to your discussion an incident involving me and my family.

My beautiful first born child who by the way just turned 19, received for her third birthday one of those innocent adorable little ugly gnome looking dolls that had the crystal in belly button sorry, but it was so long ago I cannot remember the name of the stupid thing.

Very popular toy back then so sister-in/out-law bought her one, might I add too, we did not attend Church back then either.

Almost immediately Rachel began to not sleep good at night, she started getting sick and scared of the dark and empty rooms and such.

She had been very successfully potty trained and had no problems wetting the bed (she would kill me if she knew I posted this) all of the sudden she reverted back had bed wetting incidents.

She actually began to act out even more and more.

Now I know some of that may have been normal three year old behavior , No Doubt!

But I saw a story on t.v. about Christians claiming a problem possibly demonic spirits involved with these toys

So I removed the thing from her room and the house, throwed it in the garbage to be exact, guess what? soon Rachel got over constant lingering colds, sniffles and viruses and sicknesses, potty training incidents went away.

Still had problems with being scared of things like the dark and such, but they where not as bad.

Although I must admit acting out left for about a day, came back in teenage years am going to still credit that to.....naah ain't gonna go there, but anyway amazingly things started changing when the toy was removed.

Now do I believe toy was the problem don't really believe so, but strange how things stopped.

Now do I believe that objects can be possessed by demons and imps, uh no!

But I do believe objects can be used to mess with us, now I do not have scripture to say so, but trust me the devil is a sly wily thing that is just looking for an opportunity to attack us and try to trip us up.

Sadly we're the ones who easily give him a place, a foothold, an opportunity.

By our actions and non-beliefs.

But let say one more thing so that you know where I stand: Greater is He that is in me than he that is in the world!

This I believe with all my heart and stand on it!

Dug

[AndrewA]

This proves only what I've already agreed to -- that there are people who believe these things. Look at your sources: new age texts, theosophy, "spiritualism"... of course they're going to provide their own definitions of these things. But it says nothing about their origins.

writen documentation of fairies can be dated as far back as Bronze Age. ALso in Ancient Greece there were a number of plays and stories that revolved around these creatures, although not in the form we are presented with todays imagery. These supernatural beings have most likely been with us since dawn of time,

what came first the stories or the sightings?

Did people see demons lurking in the shadows and make up stories around them or did they start off as simple stories which demons simply brought to life?

What ever the origins does it matter? These creatures are Satans creatures. Plenty of people believe in these creatures today and plenty claim to have seen them and communicate with them. These fairies etc serve no useful purpose to man or God they are only useful to Satan to drive man from God, in same way Ghosts and UFOs do.

Therefore is it honouring to God that we own images of these demonic beings? I am not saying a lump of plastic is denomic, which some people have kind of got around to thinking that is what I believe, far from it, It is more a case of is it right in owning something that REPRESENTS a demon etc.

Here are a few more explanations as to the origins of fairies.

source TheFairyfaith.com

The Irish believe that the fairies are a previously conquered society, the Tuatha De Danaan (People of the Goddess Dana), who were driven into hiding when the Celts invaded Ireland. The Pagan gods of the Tuatha, skilled in building and magic, went underground to live in the tombs and mounds they had built. Hidden from sight, they grew smaller in the popular imagination until they turned into fairies.

Some cultures believe fairies are angels cast out of Heaven. Some fell into the sea and some onto the land where they do no harm if left alone.

In Wales, fairies are thought to be a race of invisible spiritual beings living in a world of their own.

en.Wikipeadea.org

People who believed in the existence of fairies often did not always ascribe to them a definite origin,[3] and explanations varied culturally, regionally and temporally.

One popular belief was that they were the dead, or some subclass of the dead

Another view held that they were an intelligent species, distinct from humans and angels.

A third belief held that they were a class of "demoted" angels.[21] One popular story held that when the angels revolted, God ordered the gates shut; those still in heaven remained angels, those in hell became devils, and those caught in between became fairies.[22] Others held that they had been thrown out of heaven, not being good enough, but were not evil enough for hell.[23] This may explain the tradition that they had to pay a "teind" or tithe to Hell; as fallen angels, though not quite devils, they are subject to the Devil.[24]

A fourth belief was the fairies were devils, entirely.

[Vickilynn]

What about money? Banks were created with the sole purpose of holding people and even nations in bondage. Jesus told us we cannot serve both money and God. He also told us to sell all of our positions and give it to the poor. Yet I would be willing to bet that everybody involved with this discussion uses money every day and has a bank account. If you are going to make a stink about garden gnomes then you must also consider things like the one dollar bill.

Shalom Gerioke,

Nope, sorry, it won't fly in this thread either. We are talking about Ouija boards, gnomes and faeries and things created for EVIL purposes. Neither money or banks fall into that category. Please stay on topic. Thanks!

[Vickilynn]

What about money? Banks were created with the sole purpose of holding people and even nations in bondage. Jesus told us we cannot serve both money and God. He also told us to sell all of our positions and give it to the poor. Yet I would be willing to bet that everybody involved with this discussion uses money every day and has a bank account. If you are going to make a stink about garden gnomes then you must also consider things like the one dollar bill.

Is that why banks were created? You have a distinctly original view of history!

There is a world of difference between "serving" money and using it as "coin of the realm." It can't be all bad since the early Church used money, collected it, distributed it to the poor, and so on. For that matter, it must be important. The New Testament spends more time talking about money and stewardship than about prayer.

Jesus has never told me and I doubt you to sell your possessions. He has told ONE person to do that: the rich young ruler.

But this is off-topic and I don't want to be accused of hijacking a thread.

Vickilynn and I are, surprise!, in agreement on this issue. Not about plastic gnomes, but Ouija boards. While I view a Ouija board as something less than worth the time of day, I put it in same category as horoscopes, palm reading, fortune telling, etc. I don't think any of these things have any merit at all and have NO influence over the believer unless they, with the power of their own minds, give them influence. But, the Bible specifically prohibits dabbling in the occult in any of its forms, so believers should best stay away from them, and the Ouija board in particular, since that is the subject of this thread.

Shalom Mike,

You know, I like you. Alot. And I love your posts, they are awesome. I know you can't tell that by the way I disagree with you on issues, but I debate passionately. It does not mean I don't respect. you or your position, I just may disagree with it.

I'm glad that we are in agreement regarding the Ouija board. And I agree with you concerning money and banks. Not what this thread is about.

[angels4u]

Hi Vickilynn,

I would like to add to your discussion an incident involving me and my family.

My beautiful first born child who by the way just turned 19, received for her third birthday one of those innocent adorable little ugly gnome looking dolls that had the crystal in belly button sorry, but it was so long ago I cannot remember the name of the stupid thing.

Very popular toy back then so sister-in/out-law bought her one, might I add too, we did not attend Church back then either.

Almost immediately Rachel began to not sleep good at night, she started getting sick and scared of the dark and empty rooms and such.

She had been very successfully potty trained and had no problems wetting the bed (she would kill me if she knew I posted this) all of the sudden she reverted back had bed wetting incidents.

She actually began to act out even more and more.

Now I know some of that may have been normal three year old behavior , No Doubt!

But I saw a story on t.v. about Christians claiming a problem possibly demonic spirits involved with these toys

So I removed the thing from her room and the house, throwed it in the garbage to be exact, guess what? soon Rachel got over constant lingering colds, sniffles and viruses and sicknesses, potty training incidents went away.

Still had problems with being scared of things like the dark and such, but they where not as bad.

Although I must admit acting out left for about a day, came back in teenage years am going to still credit that to.....naah ain't gonna go there, but anyway amazingly things started changing when the toy was removed.

Now do I believe toy was the problem don't really believe so, but strange how things stopped.

Now do I believe that objects can be possessed by demons and imps, uh no!

But I do believe objects can be used to mess with us, now I do not have scripture to say so, but trust me the devil is a sly wily thing that is just looking for an opportunity to attack us and try to trip us up.

Sadly we're the ones who easily give him a place, a foothold, an opportunity.

By our actions and non-beliefs.

But let say one more thing so that you know where I stand: Greater is He that is in me than he that is in the world!

This I believe with all my heart and stand on it!

Dug

thanks for sharing, the same thing happened to my sister's daughter, when she was a child she had a troll in her room and couldn't sleep , after my sister threw it in the garbage she could sleep again.

The same thing can happened to somebody I know who listened to demonic music in her bed , I know the person felt the evil hovering above her and making her cold.

Question where to you draw the line with which music is demonic?

[Guest]

There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,

Deuteronomy 18:10

[Guest]

Question where to you draw the line with which music is demonic?

It came even to pass, as the trumpeters and singers were as one, to make one sound to be heard in praising and thanking the LORD; and when they lifted up their voice with the trumpets and cymbals and instruments of musick, and praised the LORD, saying, For he is good; for his mercy endureth for ever: that then the house was filled with a cloud, even the house of the LORD;

2 Chronicles 5:13

[Giaour]

I dont think that you can put replicas of fairies and gnomes in the same category as ouija boards.

Ouija boards in of themselves were made to summon the dead (demons).

Garden art of fairies and gnomes were not.

I put ouija boards in with tarot cards, astrology readings, scriing maps, crystal balls and the magic 8 ball.

These items were made to specifically to assist in contacting demons and gaining information from demons.These are actual "tools" used to summon and commune with demons with.These are not replicas or paintings or images of demonic tools but the ACTUAL tools.

Do I think that having any of these things in your home is wrong?

Well it depends.

If a person uses these things for the purpose that they were invented for, then yes, it is wrong.

If a person having these things in their home, tempts them or their household to think about demonic things, yes it is wrong.

If a person believe that these things have supernatural power, then yes it is wrong.

If the items are a stumbling block for others who enter the home.

I cant see any reason for a Christian to have any of these things in their home unless they are an antique game collector or maybe storing it for someone. But just the act of having these things in your house is not sinful to me. I personally would not have them, nor would I allow anyone to use them in my home but I would not judge someone who does. I would ask them about it for sure, and minister to them if needed.

Replicas and images of fairies, gnomes, gargoyles, imps, trolls, orges, dragons etc are not the ACTUAL beings because the "beings" do not exist. They are superstitions,fairy tales,stories from vivid imaginations.

Children can be influenced by anything their imagination finds scarey. My son was frightened by clowns. He said they were monsters. He couldnt sleep in a room that had one in it. Does this mean that clowns are demonic or have a demonic spirit connected with it? Of course not. But to HIM it was real, so we cleaned the house of all clowns. He is 24 and he still doesnt like clowns. My point is, clowns were a stumbling block for my son so we removed them. It had nothing to do with the clowns but with my son.