The Heretical Commitments To Christ

[Vickilynn]

Making a commitment to Christ is taking your eyes off of Jesus in helping you live the christian life to looking to yourself by keeping that commitment to Christ or to follow Him as the means in living that christian life.

Shalom Poor,

You like to use that phrase a lot and accuse people of "taking our eyes of Jesus." First off, as I said before, you just want to preach, but this is a discussion board.

Secondly, your assertion is false. Making a commitment to G-d (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) is what He expects of us and it is not heresy or taking our eyes off Jesus, but speaking IN FAITH the desire to serve G-d and trusting HIM to bring it about.

[poorinspirit]

Hi OneLight,

Your statement is unclear. Are you saying that those who are committing their lives to follow Jesus are not real Christians or are you saying that those who are trying to be Christians only by their works are not following Jesus. You can not put a blanket statement out there about all Christians who have committed their lives to Jesus.

I call it double-mindedness. That was where I was, and thanks to Jesus, I am free of it as He keeps me from being that way again.

When you make a commitment to Christ or to follow Him, that is something you are doing... you made it and thus bearing testimony of yourself. It is your commitment and as voicing it as such.. you are speaking of yourself, yes?

John 5: 31If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

John 7: 18He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him. 19Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?

What did John the Baptist do?

John 3: 28Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him. 29He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled. 30He must increase, but I must decrease.

2 Corinthians 4:5For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake. 6For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. 7But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

So it is the identification by that commitment to Christ that sepaks of the man and thus if the world is to see his faith in Jesus, he must decrease as in denying himself capable in keeping that commitment to Christ or to follow Him to surrender in resting in His Covenant to us that Jesus will help us live as His by faith. It is the doublemindedness of the walk where a believer mus realize that he needs Jesus all the time to help him live as His thus surrendering to the religious striving of "doing the best you can".

This is your opinion only. If you are calling all Christians who have committed their lives to following Jesus as a religion of "I will", then I call this statement a down right lie!

Then listen to how people judge... and keep in mind that no good tree will produce an evil fruit.

I have heard one man say.. a child should not make a commitment to Christ because they will not know what they are getting into... and thus he went on to say.. ever since he had made that commitment to Christ, the devil been after him to break it. He concluded that living the christian life is hard. That is one red flag as we all know Jesus invites the little children to come to Him and His yoke is easy and His burden is light as promised in Matthew 11:28-30.

One couple will not correct someone in church even though they were not committing the same sin, but by their commitment, they were not perfect so...no one corrects at all.

One would boast of keeping their commitment since he and she made it since they were five years old, but yet elsewhere, others would judge others by saying because they have backslidden, they need to make a recommitment to Christ, and it was not because they stopped believing in Jesus... they just sinned. So how does that not bear false testimony of those that claim they have kept theirs as if they had never sinned? One would say.. that is not what they are really saying, but yet when someone else sin.. they have to make a recommitment. They show partiality to the ones in the spotlight, but yet the followers has to be condemned as breaking it due to sin. Makes sense that if someone is considered breaking it because of sin, then no one can really keep it without having knowledge of sin.. thus how does that not relate to the deeds of the Law by that commitment? Are not the standards of Jesus higher than the works of the Law? That commitment to follow Christ or to Christ is a religious calling borne not of faith. It bears witness of self and thus a false witness. It bears witness of man and thus bears witness against man. Those that do them must live by them and thus commitment voids faith because it is of the flesh.

Even believers will judge another by saying..by saying.. hah.. some christian he or she is... or he is not really serious about the Lord.. or he went forward with his fingers crossed... or he is not really trying HARD enough.... in keeping that commitment to Christ... thus proves it is of the flesh where men can boast and condemn others by.

Remember... no good tree will produce an evil fruit. Those are evil fruits mentioned above.

Use the King James Version if you want to find the actual use of the word "commit" in being used properly in the New Testament as being on the Lord for the word commit means to "entrust" thus being on the Lord. Some version will use commit only to half of what the King James applied His Word towards as they would use it to be on the believer to commit to do what is right when in the KJV, it is on the Lord in well doing in the keeping of our souls while we suffer according to the will of God.

You should really get a concordance and a Greek dictionary that complements your concordance. Then you can look up the original meaning.

John 5:39-40 says scriptures are to testify of Jesus. I don't need scholars help when the Lord helps me to udnerstand His Words in relation to the Gospel.

Do you really believe that those who are committing their lives to Jesus do not live by faith?

I believe that the commitment is that small leaven of the Pharisees that takes our eyes off of Jesus to man in doing His work in us by the best of their ability. It develops a doubleminded state of looking to self.. get plastered as in falling down.. call Jesus for help.. find yourself standing again...then try the best you can again... fall again.. vicious cycle. A believer is saved, but labouring in unbelief when they depart from faith to resort to their own power in living the christian life as if they can finish it by the flesh by keeping their commitment to Christ. Jesus is waiting for them to surrender from the futility of trying to keep that commitment to Christ.. as well as from looking to other men to prove how serious they are... to looking to Jesus in how serious He is in finishing what He has started in us by helping us live as His as He is the Good Shepherd and As Saviour, bringing us Home by His righteousness... wherein we shall give ALL the glory to the Lord.

Your Brother In Christ,

poorinspirit

[poorinspirit]

poorinspirit - you lost me.

Let me ask this question, then:

If you do not encourage a person to "commit their life to Christ," what do you encourage them to do instead?

"Hi believer,

As you trusted the Lord to be your Saviour, now trust Him to be Your Good Shepherd. He will help you live the christian life. Believe on Him for God has made the Covenant to you declaring that He will do it.

Nice knowing we have a rest in Jesus, yes?"

That would be my encouragement by the grace of God.

[poorinspirit]

Hi Vickilynn,

So, what IS your point? This is a DISCUSSION board, BTW. You just want to preach. How's about discussing?

I don't disagree with anything you've said here. But, in your other posts, you call man's commitments "heresy", and that is preaching false doctrine.

So how can calling this a discussion be your point if you can call that false doctrine? How come you can say "heresey" instead of me?

Thus it leads to say then... no one can have a Defense of the Gospel folder or a Spiritual Warfare folder without declaring truth against falsehood, right?

Tell you what. Since no good tree will produce an evil fruit, you tell me this...

Have you ever heard anyone judging someone by their commitment as not being a christian?

Have you ever heard anyone keeping children from making a commitment because they don't know what they are getting into yet?

Have you ever heard anyone judging a person by not trying hard enough in being a christian?

Have you ever heard of anyone walking away because they believe they have to straighten out their life first before coming to Jesus because of making that commitment to Him?

Have you ever heard anyone saying that ever since they made that commitment, that living the christian life is hard?

Have you ever heard anyone say they will not judge because by their commitment, they are not perfect either so no one corrects anyone even if they are not committing the same sin?

Have you heard anyone railing from the pulpit about making a recommitment to follow Christ even though the people they are punishing are in the pews?

Something to think about. Feel free to ask around.

All I am sharing by the grace of God is to trust Jesus to help us live as His.. thus we live by faith... and not by the commitment made by man as if that will enable us to live that christian life... and it does not.

[poorinspirit]

Making a commitment to Christ is taking your eyes off of Jesus in helping you live the christian life to looking to yourself by keeping that commitment to Christ or to follow Him as the means in living that christian life.

Shalom Poor,

You like to use that phrase a lot and accuse people of "taking our eyes of Jesus." First off, as I said before, you just want to preach, but this is a discussion board.

Secondly, your assertion is false. Making a commitment to G-d (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) is what He expects of us and it is not heresy or taking our eyes off Jesus, but speaking IN FAITH the desire to serve G-d and trusting HIM to bring it about.

Hi Vickilynn,

You do notice that you are not defending the faith, but defending a practise of man, right?

We are to follow Jesus by faith. Following Him by that commitment made by man.. is not of faith.

Commitment... no matter if it is towards Christ... Jesus does not have any confidence in man in keeping it. He would rather you believe that He will do it. He will help you live as His. His power. His workmanship.

[OneLight]

Poorinspirit,

What would you call the Apostles commitment to Jesus? It is a decision to follow Him in all our ways. When we decide to trust in the Lord with all our hearts, it is a commitment we make to ourselves and Jesus. Jesus does not pull strings. It takes action on our part. I understand what you are trying to say, but you are definitely saying it wrong. To say that one can not have salvation by one's own works is right. To say that you were hung up by your works can also be true, but to condemn, by your own words, those who have committed their lives to Jesus is speaking a lie. This may be true for you, but we are not you. Be careful on how you bring your faith forward.

Romans 12:3

For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.

edited for typing errors

[OneLight]

One more question, poor ... when you are faced with temptation, is it not you who decides not to sin?

[poorinspirit]

A brother and I were talking about this one day. He was telling me about some fella who was hung up off of this one paticular word that a well known brother uses. This brother would tell people to commit thier lives to Christ, and the brother who had contention with this said the word does not say commit but believe.

Now, if we have taken time to look that word up then we will know that believe means to entrust or to commit.

When we commit ourselves to Christ we are giving ourselves over to Him. Marriage is a beautiful representation of this. When my wife and I were married we commited ourselves to each other. From this commitment we then focus on eachother. Likewise with Christ. We have given ourselves to Him, and that is it. We dont keep giving ourselves, it was a one time deal. I said here I am Lord, all of me, the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly, and He took it. He knows and realises how unfaithful I am, how sometimes He will want to spend time with me but I want to watch TV. But He is faithful and honors my commitment. I cant focus on someone that I have not commited myself to.

Hi ruck1b,

Thanks for sharing. It is true that commit means entrust as well as believe, but commitment is not the same thing as commit can mean something else as in of man in declaring I will... of which commitment means a declaration to the world around him of I will do it.

In 1994, I had worked in a warehouse where I had developed the habit of cussing when no one was around to let off steam. One day, I came across a pamphlet that convicted me through the use of scriptures of the words of my mouth. On the last page, it led me to make a covenant with my mouth which I did so as to not to cuss anymore.

The very next day, I was worse than I ever was before. I heard the devil saying, "You are not His. If you were His, He would have helped you keep your covenant!" I stopped listening to the devil and being at my wits end, I prayed to the Lord, "Why aren't you helping me? You know I don't want to do this!"

The Lord Jesus spoke to me,"You made the covenant. You said you were going to do it. I made The Covenant and I said I am going to do it. All I ask from you is to believe on Me."

If you think He was done pruning me as in humbling me in Light of Him.. there is more.

I tried to warn the ministry that made out that pamphlet as the leader of that ministry just ignored what I was sharing and simply said that I wasn't trying hard enough. So by his words, he was looking to me to do it as I was.

Then Promise Keepers was sweeping nation-wide as I hear about it from my Bible studies group. One group says... they were not making promises to God, they were making promises to each other.. another group says.. they were not making promises to man, they were making promises to God. I'd never been to one and I knew it was both. When I tried to warn the brothers and to take joy of God's Coevant to us, one person in the bible study group.. a mason... declared.. isn't a commitment to follow Christ like a promise? sure it is.. he answered. and Thus I was finally delivered from my commitment to follow Jesus to rest in Him that He will be My Good Shepherd as He enables me to live as His as promised in His Covenant to us.

Amazing how a mason would defend the commitment to Christ and the Promise Keepers' program when they can relate to that. It is their belief that majority of man needs to be ruled over. Lucky them for being the minority to rule over the majority. So a commitment made by man is to receive the praise of man. The religious world cannot understand the faith in Jesus Christ because of that relationship, but they can relate to christianity now because of that commitment...show the world how serious they are.

But it is not about us, is it? It's God's turn now. His glory. He is our righteousness. We are His workmanship.

Psalm 100: 3Know ye that the LORD he is God: it is he that hath made us, and not we ourselves; we are his people, and the sheep of his pasture.

Ephesians 2: 8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Psalm 19: 13Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression. 14Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.

May the Lord set us all free from that which hides our faith to the religious world around us.

[nebula]

poorinspirit - you lost me.

Let me ask this question, then:

If you do not encourage a person to "commit their life to Christ," what do you encourage them to do instead?

"Hi believer,

As you trusted the Lord to be your Saviour, now trust Him to be Your Good Shepherd. He will help you live the christian life. Believe on Him for God has made the Covenant to you declaring that He will do it.

Nice knowing we have a rest in Jesus, yes?"

That would be my encouragement by the grace of God.

Hmmm . . . I understand what you are saying here, but . . .

Philippians 2:12-13

12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. 13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Why do you suppose Scripture says here to "work out your salvation with fear and trembling" if the Lord did not mean for us to put some effort into our spiritual walk?

Perspective: I have known many people who believe in Jesus as their Savior but do not submit to Him as Lord.

What would you say to this?

[poorinspirit]

I would just like to add this. I dont keep commiting myself to my wife. I did that when we were married. What happens after commitment is growth. You can measure commitment from growth. Some only give a little of themselves to Christ, then as He becomes more beautiful they give a little more. This is a growing in the commitment. Even though we have believed (entrusted yourselfs) to Christ, we dont do this fully. So we have to mature, and grow, so that we come into the full reality of our commitment.

I hope that makes sense.

Hi ruck1b,

As you use the word commitment in regards to marriage, the religious world will see that differently. They will see commitment in a relationship as work. And the way you describe of giving of yourselves, I do wonder how the religious world would see that in marriage and to Christ. Not trying to disparage you or anything, but some of the people from other forums ( not WorthyBoards) that has striven against me in defending the commitments of man would rip you apart. Fortunately... we have moderators here to stop it, but I have seen it done on other message boards... and they were believers too... religious ones, but believers... and the christian moderators did not tame the condemnation...so I hope you don't get it here. I'll probably get it, but the Lord will help me turn the other cheek since I am desiring others to know the full joy of their salvation by resting in Jesus and His promises to us as they will probably just see me as raining on their parade.

But what is the basis of all relationships? Trust.

So when it comes to the Lord, we are given this warning about how we receive the Kingdom of God.

Mark 10: 13And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them. 14But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. 15Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.

What can a child do but trust the Lord? Mayhap that is why the poor in spirit are blessed because they have come to the end of themselves, and they have only one place to look now and that is to the Lord.