Oh Christmas Tree, Oh Christmas Tree

[Hypathia]

Winter Solstice falls on Dec 21st but the whole week ended up being celebrated in Rome. They called it Saturalia [the god Saturn] and many religious and non-religious practices from many cultures were incorporated into the week. The Persian Deity of the religion called Zoroastrianism celebrated the birth of it's Sun deity Mitras, [sol Ivectus] on Dec 25th and that's how that day was selected. It represented the rebirth of the sun which was "dead" on Dec 21st.

Haven't we covered all this already?

Perhaps religious scholars should try and narrow down a day closer to the actual birth of Jesus. That would be more appropriate than the day of the sun god Mithras imo. If they did that how would you celebrate it? How do you celebrate it now? Do you put up a tree, have presents, the whole bit or do you skip all that and just go to church and focus on Jesus all day?

[Guest Biblicist]

I didn't say there wasn't celebrating on the day of his birth; I said Dec 25 was not the day of his birth.

I don't celebrate pagan gods. I see it for what it is, a time to celebrate time with my family with the food, the presents and the decorations.....all man's ways of celebrating time with the family.

It's not gonna matter whether you celebrate it that way or whether you put a "christian label" on it. In the end, you're either one of the elect or you're not.

Religiously speaking, the pagans had the holiday taken from them; it was theirs to begin with. So if they do want to "reclaim" it.... as you put it, they're [religiously speaking], within their right to do so. Who are you to complain about their attempts since it was their religious tradition to begin with.

I'm getting tired of repeating the same information to you. Go back and read what has been written.

[Hypathia]

Now my wheels are really turning here.

If scholars figure out the real day Jesus was born....or can come reasonably close to it....how should we celebrate it. I'd be interested in hearing what you guys think. I think most people would still continue to celebrate the december holidays in the usual ways but how should we celebrate the actual birthday of Jesus if it can be determined? What traditions would be appropriate and respectful? Would you stop recognizing Dec 25 as any kind of holiday, would you go to work on that day and treat it just like most any other ordinary day?

With a true date we could start.... anew, what would you like to do? What traditions would you like to start for the real birthday party?

[Guest Biblicist]

Winter Solstice falls on Dec 21st but the whole week ended up being celebrated in Rome. They called it Saturalia [the god Saturn] and many religious and non-religious practices from many cultures were incorporated into the week. The Persian Deity of the religion called Zoroastrianism celebrated the birth of it's Sun deity Mitras, [sol Ivectus] on Dec 25th and that's how that day was selected. It represented the rebirth of the sun which was "dead" on Dec 21st.

Haven't we covered all this already?

Perhaps religious scholars should try and narrow down a day closer to the actual birth of Jesus. That would be more appropriate than the day of the sun god Mithras imo. If they did that how would you celebrate it? How do you celebrate it now? Do you put up a tree, have presents, the whole bit or do you skip all that and just go to church and focus on Jesus all day?

I would just like to say, you sound like my husband's uncles, they are Jehovah's Witnesses and they always give me the exact arguments you give. I don't even bother sending them Christmas cards because I get letters back from them stating these very points.

[Hypathia]

Winter Solstice falls on Dec 21st but the whole week ended up being celebrated in Rome. They called it Saturalia [the god Saturn] and many religious and non-religious practices from many cultures were incorporated into the week. The Persian Deity of the religion called Zoroastrianism celebrated the birth of it's Sun deity Mitras, [sol Ivectus] on Dec 25th and that's how that day was selected. It represented the rebirth of the sun which was "dead" on Dec 21st.

Haven't we covered all this already?

Perhaps religious scholars should try and narrow down a day closer to the actual birth of Jesus. That would be more appropriate than the day of the sun god Mithras imo. If they did that how would you celebrate it? How do you celebrate it now? Do you put up a tree, have presents, the whole bit or do you skip all that and just go to church and focus on Jesus all day?

I would just like to say, you sound like my husband's uncles, they are Jehovah's Witnesses and they always give me the exact arguments you give. I don't even bother sending them Christmas cards because I get letters back from them stating these very points.

What do you say about Halloween?

[Vickilynn]

What do you say about Halloween?

Shalom, please stay on topic.

BTW, please check this out, it will help you I believe as to why it is fine to celebrate Christmas.

http://biblicalholidays.com/Hanukkah/messiah_in_hanukkah.htm

Was Jesus Conceived on Hanukkah?

Many believe that our Messiah, the

[nebula]

Perhaps religious scholars should try and narrow down a day closer to the actual birth of Jesus.

Many scholars believed Jesus was born during the Feast of Tabernacles.

"And the Word became flesh and tabernacled among us."

I couldn't tell you all the reasons off the top of my head, but many do believe this.

[Guest Biblicist]

Winter Solstice falls on Dec 21st but the whole week ended up being celebrated in Rome. They called it Saturalia [the god Saturn] and many religious and non-religious practices from many cultures were incorporated into the week. The Persian Deity of the religion called Zoroastrianism celebrated the birth of it's Sun deity Mitras, [sol Ivectus] on Dec 25th and that's how that day was selected. It represented the rebirth of the sun which was "dead" on Dec 21st.

Haven't we covered all this already?

Perhaps religious scholars should try and narrow down a day closer to the actual birth of Jesus. That would be more appropriate than the day of the sun god Mithras imo. If they did that how would you celebrate it? How do you celebrate it now? Do you put up a tree, have presents, the whole bit or do you skip all that and just go to church and focus on Jesus all day?

I would just like to say, you sound like my husband's uncles, they are Jehovah's Witnesses and they always give me the exact arguments you give. I don't even bother sending them Christmas cards because I get letters back from them stating these very points.

What do you say about Halloween?

You guess...

[Vickilynn]

Perhaps religious scholars should try and narrow down a day closer to the actual birth of Jesus.

Many scholars believed Jesus was born during the Feast of Tabernacles.

"And the Word became flesh and tabernacled among us."

I couldn't tell you all the reasons off the top of my head, but many do believe this.

Shalom Neb,

Exactly!! There are many reasons at the link I posted above.

And that would mean that Yeshua was CONCEIVED by the Holy Spirit during the Feast of Dedication (Festival of Lights) and around the time we celebrate Christmas!! So, yes, more the reason to celebrate in December, His INCARNATION.

[kittyjo]

I was going to add this thought much earlier in this um, 'discussion', but decided not to...

I changed my mind this morning upon hearing a somber chorus of "Oh Christmas Tree, Oh Christmas Tree, How lovely are thy branches..."

This song has alwas brought a tear to my eye...

As a young child and hearing the Birth of Christ as read from Luke, was not where my mother would end the story, she always reminded me of His purpose... The crucifixion of Christ and the redemption for all as the result of this sacrifice. Cristmas was always the story of the cross. So as a child, when I heard this song I would always think...

I think back to that tree, the tree that was harvested to make Christ's cross.... It is Him that I see, not a tinseled lighted evergreen when I hear... "Oh Christmas Tree, Oh Christmas tree, How lovely are thy branches.... It is Him that I see, hung on that 'tree' [cross], arms streatched out [the ultimate symbol of love] and offering us everlasting life...

"Oh Christmas Tree, Oh Christmas Tree, How Lovely are Thy Branches..."

Perhaps an obscure train of thought, but that is how a child thinks.... And that is what comes to mind even now after all these years.

Merry Christmas!